New Pre-Amp Coming Soon!

[Drenis]

I'm quite thrilled about this so I felt the need to share. I came across a ad for a Parasound 2100 Pre and 2125 Amp in FLAWLESS condition. They are 2009 stock from a former Parasound dealer. The gear has less than 10 hours on it and it really shows. Been sitting indoors since then and the fella is cleaning out his home. he has tons of gear from being in the hobby. I'll be stealing....err picking these both up tomorrow for a great price. The seller wouldn't separate the package so I'll buy both and unload the amp.

To summarize:

- New pre in the rig tomorrow
- Parasound 2100
- :cheesygrin::cheesygrin::cheesygrin::cheesygrin:

I couldn't pass on this as this Pre has remote AND HT bypass so I can use the pre for music ONLY while allowing my AVR (Pio Elite VSX-23) to handle all the inputs for gaming consoles and our cable TV.

Did you read that H9? NO MORE AVR AS MY PRE.

That is all. :cheesygrin:

[steveinaz]

Sweet, nice preamp.

[brgman]

Great pre for the bucks.Still have one i use for the HT bypass.

[Tankman]

What would you take for the amp?Would you ship?

[chumlie]

Congrats. I've been eyeballing that preamp for a while now.

[chandler9a]

congrats! let us know what you think about that preamp. I was thinking about that one for a while but went a different rout and was always curious about it.

[brianle]

congrats! let us know how it sounds comparing to your AVR as a pre

[Oldfatdogs]

Enjoy your new gear.

[heiney9]

Congrats, I think you are going to be pleaseantly surprised.

H9

[Drenis]

Congrats, I think you are going to be pleaseantly surprised.

H9

If I don't hear a difference for the better, you'll be the first to hear about it :razz:

[cfrizz]

Congrats on a good score.

[Denon Frank]

You'll be happy with it. Did a short review on it last month :cool:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21805318#post21805318

[DForeman]

congrats! let us know what you think about that preamp. I was thinking about that one for a while but went a different rout and was always curious about it.

Have been curious about adding this preamp to my system as well.

Let us know how it turns out.

[Drenis]

I decided to drive out (Hour outside the city) to pick this equipment up last night instead of tonight as tonight will be my only listening session before we head out of town for the weekend.

Didn't hook anything up as the gear needs time to adjust to the house temperature (Was quite cold yesterday evening). So I'll be hooking it up tonight and will post some early impressions once I have had some time to tinker.

I must say early on, Parasound makes some real nice gear. First impressions are everything and the build quality is great.

[tonyb]

Steppin' up your game eh ? Good on you and congrats. I nice review when you get the time on the difference in SQ between the pre and the receiver would benefit many members. Though I wouldn't be so quick to kick that amp to the curb either. Nice pickup.

[Slinger182]

Nice pick up. I've been looking at the 2100 for a while now. What other pre amps are out there in the same price range with HT bypass?

Thanks and looking forward to your review.

[Ern Dog]

Nice Score!

Interested in reading about your impressions with this.

[Drenis]

Well I was hesitant to post the following as I was waiting to ensure that the issue at hand was resolved... I'll elaborate.

While I was checking over things, I tested all inputs/outputs, all speaker channels etc etc... I noticed that the pre-amp would NOT power down. It powered straight up when it was plugged in but wouldn't power off with the front panel button or remote. Everything else worked fine. I knew it either had to be something simple or very inexpensive to fix.

So I began asking the seller what we could do to make this a good transaction. he was reluctant to lower the price as I was stealing it anyways... but I said that's just not going to work with me. I played off that it would cost a few bucks to have the unit looked at and repaired if need be. Him being a former Parasound dealer he was dumbfounded by the issue but his lack of common knowledge failed him here. He opted to knock $25 off the price and I got him down to $40 off.

Turns out the small switch on the back of the unit which controls how the unit is powered was set to AC which disables the front button and remote power buttons. Laughter ensued.

Cheapest $40 fix ever! :lol:

[heiney9]

And you are going to call him and tell him you found the issue was a USER related error and give him his $40 back, right? That's the right thing to do, especially if you already got a smokin' deal. Karma is a b#tch and it will come back to bite you if you don't do the right thing.

[Drenis]

And you are going to call him and tell him you found the issue was a USER related error and give him his $40 back, right? That's the right thing to do, especially if you already got a smokin' deal. Karma is a b#tch and it will come back to bite you if you don't do the right thing.

Are you kidding me? What an ignorant suggestion even. I'm anticipating you'll edit your post and state you're joking.

Brock, I'm going to sell you a pre-amp. It is in mint condition with low hours. You can drive out here and buy it. But, when you come look at it and find there is an issue, YOU can pay the full asking price and deal with it yourself. You will tell me where to go pretty fast.

Instead, I bought the unit for a reduced price because I didn't know what exactly was wrong. I did some troubleshooting and READ THE MANUAL to figure out what the issue was. Sad that a former dealer of said products couldn't correct this. As such, he lowered the price and he doesn't have to worry about it. I think I'll draft an invoice for that amount as a fee to inspect, diagnose and correct the issue. What a deal compared to most electronic repair facilities.

Now I'm pissed. My great mood has been spoiled by a remark from a respectable forum acquaintance. How dare you for suggesting that I've done wrong.


Edit: As a courtesy, I promised the seller that I would let him know what the issue and resolution was.

[heiney9]

So you knew the issue before you bought it and negotiated at the time of purchase? I assumed this was after you brought it home and you went back and he refunded you the $40. If it was done at the time of purchase as part of the negotiation, then I apologize. I can only respond to the words on the screen based on how I interpret them.

I thought he had given you $40 when you went back to tell him something was wrong. In that case I thought he was doing you a favor and since you discovered it on your own and that it wasn't actually "broken" I suggested you return the money.

Now, after you furthur explaining it, I see and it's all good.

H9

[Drenis]

I fail to see how you came to your original conclusion. Can't you think before posting instead of painting me as some bad guy to the whole community? Or why not ask for clarification instead of posting garbage like that.

And no, it's not "all good". I'm flippin' angry about it. Thank you for making me out to feel like a crook.

[heiney9]

Ok, your choice to get so upset over words on a screen. Hopefully you'll settle down and enjoy the pre-amp. I hardly called you a crook, I pointed out you should do the right thing based on what you wrote.

You failing to see how I came to my conclusion is not relevant, but I can try to explain if it will make you feel less angry. I assumed you went back to the seller (say it was me who sold it to you in good faith knowing it worked) and told me it didn't power off. We agreed as a gesture I'd give you $40 cash since there is an issue (which wasn't present when I sold it to you). Later you find out the preamp works perfectly and it was your user error that caused the issue, not that it was broken. I would expect my $40 back that I gave you for the supposed broken preamp.

Again I thought this was good faithe gesture after you bought it since it's been almost 24 hours since you purchased it. If you can't see where I was coming from, then sorry but we are looking at it from two different POV's.

Since I now know through your clarification that the above scenario didn't take place, I no longer think you should return the $40.

H9

[Drenis]

Your assumption of events is not even close to what happened or how it was worded. Regardless, who goes to buy electronics in person but doesn't test/check it out? Anyone who goes about a purchase then try to claim some cash back for a falsely reported issue as you explained would be an idiot in my books.

Anyways, impression to follow later.

[heiney9]

Well, I apologize for making you blow your top. That was not my intention nor was it my intention to, as you stated "call you a crook". I obviously misinterpreted your post to mean something different than it was. And you obviously misinterpreted my post as an attack on you and calling you a crook, etc.

To be clear I NEVER said anything about "falsely reported issue", again, like myself in the original post, you are jumping to conclusions and adlibing as you go along. I think now you can understand how something can be interpreted completely differently by sender and receiver.

Again, I was making an observation based on my interpretation of your post.

Enjoy your new pre-amp if your threat level red has subsided.

H9

[audiocr381ve]

Drenis, at first read I made the same assumption H9 did. Maybe it just wasn't clear but it's certainly not something to get that upset about.

[Drenis]

I read through and I suppose I can see how you two were confused. If I had added two words into the equation then it probably wouldn't have been so blown out of proportion.

[Drenis]

Well... I sure like what I hear so far. Wider, fuller stage. Not just horizontally but vertically too. I've noticed some subtle differences. I understand when people talk about instruments becoming more fixed and "airy". Vocals being more pronounced. I still have a lot of listening to do but if I can dumb this down to a grade 8 level for a moment... This is awesome.

Enjoy your evening Polkies

[janmike]

Congrats on the new gear.

[audiocr381ve]

Well... I sure like what I hear so far. Wider, fuller stage. Not just horizontally but vertically too. I've noticed some subtle differences. I understand when people talk about instruments becoming more fixed and "airy". Vocals being more pronounced. I still have a lot of listening to do but if I can dumb this down to a grade 8 level for a moment... This is awesome.

Enjoy your evening Polkies

Very cool! Listen for a few weeks then swap in your old gear and see if it's as big a difference backwards if you know what I mean. It's always interesting to me when I do that.

[organ]

Glad to hear you're enjoying it. Congrats on the new pre:cool:.

[Drenis]

I was out of town all weekend so didn't get any time to tinker. However, I have a bloody ground hum now in my system. What's causing it I haven't the foggiest idea. Tonight will be the first time I get to try and figure out what's causing the hum. There has never been a ground loop hum.

So far I'm thinking it's my AVR or DAC of all things. Everything is plugged into my Furman line conditioner. Removing the IC's from the AVR to my Pre immediately removes the hum. If I use the HT Bypass from the AVR, the hum is full blown loud. If I run the IC's from the AVR into any input, the hum is there (Turn AVR volume up to induce gain for the pre-outs to the pre-amp), then the hum ONLY gets louder as you increase the volume on the pre-amp.

The only components plugged into the same bank as the pre-amp are the AVR, DAC and my Squeezebox Touch. My gaming consoles and cable box are on another bank.

Should be an interesting evening trying to figure this one out...

[chumlie]

Never mentioned a hum in your last post. What changed ?

[tonyb]

Drenis, since the hum appeared after the addition of the pre, it's either the cables your using, or you have too many grounds going into the furman. The cheapest solution is to stop by any hardware store, Walmart, etc, and pick up a cheater plug. A plug that coverts a standard 3 prong plug to 2 prong. Try it first on the pre, or on the receiver. Cost you 2 bucks. You won't harm anything by doing this and it's the easiest,cheapest place to start.

[Drenis]

Never mentioned a hum in your last post. What changed ?

I just never mentioned it cause I hadn't done any troubleshooting. I had very little time before I had to head out of town. The hum began when I first setup the HT bypass.


Drenis, since the hum appeared after the addition of the pre, it's either the cables your using, or you have too many grounds going into the furman. The cheapest solution is to stop by any hardware store, Walmart, etc, and pick up a cheater plug. A plug that coverts a standard 3 prong plug to 2 prong. Try it first on the pre, or on the receiver. Cost you 2 bucks. You won't harm anything by doing this and it's the easiest,cheapest place to start.

I swapped the cables going from the AVR to the Pre and that changed nothing. All IC's are MIT EXP 1's from DAC->Pre->Amp. I can't recall if it's the DAC or the AVR that is only a 2 prong setup. My house had the electrical re-wired recently so it should be a true ground.

Tonight I'll start unplugging components from the back of the Furman until it quits.

[Drenis]

So I've been doing a little reading in anticipation to tinker when I get home. I came across the 2100 owners thread over @ AVS and someone posted something similar to my scenario where it was the cable box causing the hum. Once the coax was disconnected all was fine.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=18727476#post18727476

Now I have my coax for my cable running through my Furman as well so the line is protected and filtered. While I logically think it can't be the coax I wonder if it might be. I also have HDMI AND component video/audio running from the AVR to the TV. A couple switching power supplies for the Squeezebox, Wii and external HDD for the cable box.

The 2100 manual also states to run the amp and pre on the same circuit. I run the amp on its dedicated amp circuit with the Furman (See picture in link for layout of Furman - http://www.furmansound.com/new/images/highres/ELITE-15PFi-rear.jpg). So that first bank, ONLY my Carver is plugged into that which is 2 prong. The pre along with 3 other components take up the next bank and the last bank is full as well.

Regardless of this post, until I tinker later, nothing will get accomplished. But everything was setup for a flawless user experience. This hum means something will have to go and that might mess up the layout. I HATE that...

[Drenis]

Alright, someone may have some advice with the following information on what I can do next.

I traced the hum back to the AVR. Once I unplugged the HDMI cable coming from the cable box, it stopped. I shook my head and began to unscrew the coax. Bingo. I began to scratch my head because the cable runs through my power conditioner (Furman Elite 15-PF i) which eliminates this hum. So I ran direct and bypassed the Furman and the hum stays present once the coax is attached to the cable box.

Now I'm at a loss for what may cause this as it was ONLY introduced once I introduced the pre into my rig. There has never been a hum before due to grounding. It worked fine. So I'm a bit frustrated at the moment. Where is the hum coming from? The cable is split once it enters the house and as such, one cable feeds the TV and the other over to my computer where the modem and router are. For fun I disconnected my RJ-45 run from the router to my SQBT to eliminate any possibility and that did nothing. I really don't think that split cable run would have any effect.

It seems that the only way to kill the ground hum is to pull the plug for the pre-amp. I tried running different combinations of gear on the same power banks.

I'm not sure what to do next. I've never been faced with this situation before. Fact is I need sound from the television to come out this rig. So something has to work... who knew HDMI carries a ground signal which passes a hum

[Drenis]

I must say... anyone on the fence about jumping into separates, do it now.

Just wow. I thoroughly enjoyed the last 4 hours.

[FTGV]

.

I'm not sure what to do next. http://www.cs1.net/products/jensen_transformers/VRD-1FF.htm

[tonyb]

Really my good man, try the cheater plug first, 80% of the time thats all you need.

[Drenis]

http://www.cs1.net/products/jensen_transformers/VRD-1FF.htm
Thanks for the link.


Really my good man, try the cheater plug first, 80% of the time thats all you need.

Isn't that just putting a bandaid on the problem though?

So I'm assuming that by the pre not being 2 prong, it is the chain for the loop. My DAC is 3 prong and it produced no hum.

I'm going to pick up a cheater plug tomorrow though and use it on the pre.

[FTGV]

While the cheater plug may work that third prong is there for a reason,to provide a safety ground.For that reason IMO it is better to look to a better permanent solution than just defeating it.The link was just one known effective example of CATV isolation transformer .A search of the net I'm sure should result in other less expensive alternatives.

[Drenis]

While the cheater plug may work that third prong is there for a reason,to provide a safety ground.For that reason IMO it is better to look to a better permanent solution than just defeating it.The link was just one known effective example of CATV isolation transformer .A search of the net I'm sure should result in other less expensive alternatives.

I know the importance. That's why I don't want to permanently use a plug.

This was also suggested but between what you suggested and this. Only yours is rated to work with Digital TV setups. Still looking at a rough $40-$50 difference without factoring in proper costs for tax and shipping. This pre is no longer a good deal now. :razz:

I'm thinking of going a different direction with my configuration and removing the AVR completely out of the picture.

[heiney9]

Why not just re-route the cable box and NOT have it go thru the Furman? Unless I read your explanation wrong it's the cable box that is the issue when the AVR is plugged in??? Or do I have that wrong?

[Drenis]

Why not just re-route the cable box and NOT have it go thru the Furman? Unless I read your explanation wrong it's the cable box that is the issue when the AVR is plugged in??? Or do I have that wrong?

I did remove the cable from the Furman when I found the issue and plugged it directly into the cable box bypassing the surge protection and filtering of the Furman.

Edit: I think what I will do is run all my sources (CATV, gaming consoles...) through the TV inputs (PITA if you have a Sharp Quattron) and rid the AVR. Run analog out from the TV to the Pre. This also might induce hum. If it does then I'll have to spring for one of those filters... although that leads me to think that something is improperly connected whether from the cable company or it not being grounded in my house (really unsure though - I'll ask a electrician who is a friend of mine).

Or replace the AVR with a soundbar and cease connecting the two systems together which will eliminate the hum.

[heiney9]

Not so much improperly connected, but maybe just not compatible. Wiring sytems together that include, TV, HDMI, CATV, COAX and a combo of 2 and 3 pronged plugs as well as game systems thrown in the mix can be frustrating sometimes. That's a lot of connection and cables doing carrying a lot of different signals.

H9

[Drenis]

Not so much improperly connected, but maybe just not compatible. Wiring sytems together that include, TV, HDMI, CATV, COAX and a combo of 2 and 3 pronged plugs as well as game systems thrown in the mix can be frustrating sometimes. That's a lot of connection and cables doing carrying a lot of different signals.

H9

You're exactly right. With the pre being 3 prong, that's all that was needed to complete the loop. when when I joined the analog side of those connections to the pre.

Time to reorganize and the other half will just have to make do. The pre stays. Music is fantastic. I've never heard the A9's sound SO good compared to when I first bought them. I can;t comprehend what xover upgrades will bring as it's the only thing left to do; mod the speakers.

[heiney9]

Glad you are enjoying it and glad you took the advice and tried seperates for yourself. IIRC, you weren't convinced it would make such a positive improvement.

Enjoy!

H9

[Drenis]

Glad you are enjoying it and glad you took the advice and tried seperates for yourself. IIRC, you weren't convinced it would make such a positive improvement.

Enjoy!

H9

You are spot on. See post #38. :razz: I really don't think I could take a step back now.

[dudeinaroom]

Awesome find. What are you doing with the amp? I'd use it top power center(s) or surrounds, but that's me.

[Drenis]

Awesome find. What are you doing with the amp? I'd use it top power center(s) or surrounds, but that's me.

I'm going to sell it as I have no use for it. I am spending some time getting a feel for the sound currently then I'll swap the Carver out for the 2125 for a listening session.

Who knows, maybe I'll like the Parasound amp more. :razz:

[tonyb]

Blame your hum on Detroit. :cheesygrin:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/05/01/canadians-make-racket-about-mysterious-hum-coming-from-us-side-border/?test=latestnews

Apparently, Canadians want to put a big cheater plug on Detroit. Just an amuseing side note, given your from north of the border.

[Drenis]

Blame your hum on Detroit. :cheesygrin:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/05/01/canadians-make-racket-about-mysterious-hum-coming-from-us-side-border/?test=latestnews

Apparently, Canadians want to put a big cheater plug on Detroit. Just an amuseing side note, given your from north of the border.

Hah... I had a good chuckle at that, thanks.