Canare or Belden, which would you choose?

[Codey]

I'm about to order some wire for my mains and can't decide which to get. The Canare 4S11 seems to come highly recommended, but I won't be bi-wiring. Or theres the Belden 5T00UP, which is two conductor 10 awg and almost half the price. Any input?

[John K.]

Codey, you haven't mentioned the most significant factor, i.e. the length of the runs which you'll be doing. The 14ga Canare wires, when combined would give the equivalent of an 11ga wire and the Belden is 10ga. Extremely thick wires like that might be advisable for runs approaching 100 feet, but are gross overkill for the more usual length of runs to the mains. If yours are the more typical 10-15 feet, standard 16ga lampcord is plenty for your needs.

[F1nut]

Codey, finding the best cable for your system isn't always that easy. How do you know what the best is? Read reviews, trial and error and sometimes pure dumb luck. Set a price range and find all the cables in that range and get to work. You may find that neither of your two choices works for you, that it's another one entirely. The results one gets from wire is dependent on the level of gear ie., entry level gear will not sound like top level gear even if hooked up with the most expensive wire made. So, if one has some very cheap gear then 16 ga wire might be the best one could hope for, but for other gear 16 ga is the worst possible choice. My adversary doesn't think wire makes a difference and on his gear maybe it doesn't, but we're not talking about his gear and I wish he'd stop giving out BAD info to others.

Best of luck in your quest.

[Codey]

Thanks for the input.

They'll be about fifteen feet. The reason I chose those two is they're unterminated, affordable, and it seems everyone says check out bluejeans cable and that's about the extent of their offerings.

If I set my price range and find all the cables in it, then what? It seems to me I'd still be in the same boat I am now.

[F1nut]

That's exactly what I'm saying, without trying out different cables you'll never know which one works best for you. What you don't like you can always resell. From what I've seen around here most folks seem to prefer Signal over Bluejeans although I think they both use Belden wire to start with. Probably the best way to try out different cables is buy it used, more bang for the buck. There's a site that lets you rent cables to try, www.usedcables.com.

[Codey]

I found some Audioquest Type 4s used, would they be worth taking a chance on?

[F1nut]

Codey, I've never tried them, so I don't know. Only one way to find out, eh?

[dorokusai]

AQ makes decent cable, the Type4 is a good choice.

I prefer Belden as a cable manufacturer personally, but Canare makes quality product.

[mantis]

good points,

it's a trail and error game. There is no BEST cable.

Buy sell trade is the way to go, used cables on Audiogon is smart to get your trail on.

[F1nut]

Would that be the trail to Zen???

[Tour2ma]

No, "Zen whoppie"...

Cody,
By all means experiment within your budget, but start with, or at least include some "lamp cord" in the mix. Give yourself the chance to hear, or not hear, the differences for yourself. Won't cost more than a buck or so, and hey, you never know... someday you may need to re-wire a lamp... :D

What are you running now?

[Codey]

Thanks for the advice guys. I think I'll start off with the canare 4S11. There is a local electronics store I'm in good with that used to specialize in hi end stuff. I'm pretty sure they'd let me take home various cables to try out.

I'm using 16 awg Monster THX SP.

[Early B.]

I did the Canare 4S11 cables for while. Then I found some inexpensive Acoustic Research Master Series speaker cable (it comes in 15 ft. pairs) and the AR cables were significantly superior in every way. Here's a pair for $62...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=14966&item=5734281399&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

[Willow]

I was using HD 12 awg then found some kimber4 used at a good price. I prefer the sound of the kimber...for now.... for the bedroom system I had HD 14awg and swapped that for some Monster and perferred the monster...(didn't buy it had it lying around)

[Codey]

So the Canare or Belden is more of a lateral move. And if I want to take a step forward I should look at Audioquest or AR Master Series or something of the likes. Is that about right?

[F1nut]

I like MIT.

[rskarvan]

Can anybody actually HEAR a difference (really) between an expensive speaker cable and lamp cord? I'm not talking long runs. Just the normal 10 or 12 feet or so.

I really doubt that any speaker cable SOUNDS appreciably better than lamp cord. If so, I would have no physics/electronic theory to explain/justify why.

I'm an engineer by training. Please, if somebody has a good explanation on WHY SPEAKER CABLE sounds better than LAMP CORD.... I'd love to hear it.

I can understand well-shielded interconnects reducing noise. But, not speaker cable. Maybe its the cool factor.

Thanks.

[dorokusai]

I personally hear a difference between the two choices. I wouldn't spend the money that I do, and have without confirmation of improvement or performance increase. I'm not a moron.

How could anyone explain the "why" to you about what they hear as their own singular experience?

Anytime you want to drop by and conduct some double blind testing of many cables, let me know. I don't care either way if you hear a sonic difference, I'm not selling anything.

It doesn't matter to me as to "why" it sounds different, just that it "does" sound different.

I don't think you have to be an engineer to listen.

PS - This isn't meant to sound defensive or argumentative, it's just words.

[F1nut]

I can hear a difference, no question about and I don't need to see some scientific explanation as to why, I've learned to trust my ears. I read time and time again the doubts and demands for an explanation. The funny thing is that almost all the questioning comes from engineers.....why is that???

As Doro stated, it's not a personal attack on you Ron or anybody else and if anybody takes Doro up on his offer, I'm 15 minutes away, so you're welcome to try the testing here too.

[RuSsMaN]

Belden, with Canare connectors.

[Tour2ma]

Originally posted by F1nut
The funny thing is that almost all the questioning comes from engineers.....why is that??? Because we're engineers...

We're trained to quantify things, even if it takes unit-less numbers to do it :confused: (We actually have quite a stockpile of those, e.g., Prandlt )...
From A Laboratory Manual For Fundamentals Of Engineering Design:
Unitless groups are used frequently in chemical engineering correlations. They are numbers which result in generalized correlations.

I'd love to participate in a double-blind test. It ought to be a cornerstone of a future-fest...

[Codey]

I think I'm going to try the Belden 12 awg. It's almost 1/3 the cost of 4S11 which is nice. Plus with Christmas being this close I can't justify spending a huge wad of cash on some fancy speaker cables for myself.Thanks for the help guys.

[reeltrouble1]

Codey,

You are doing the right thing, consider how this cable sounds to you. Trust your ears, they will let you know when to stop.

I was once an engineering major, I love science and the laws that govern how things work and combine with each other, but I trust most in how something sounds to me.

[opus]

Originally posted by Tour2ma
...

I'd love to participate in a double-blind test. It ought to be a cornerstone of a future-fest...
Boy is that ever a great idea. That would sure settle a lot of arguements

[reeltrouble1]

Originally posted by opus
Boy is that ever a great idea. That would sure settle a lot of arguements

Hmmm...............I think it might be the equivilant of starting POLK'S Hatfield's and McCoy's, but count me in, just check your weapons at the door boys.

[disneyjoe7]

Originally posted by reeltrouble1
Hmmm...............I think it might be the equivilant of starting POLK'S Hatfield's and McCoy's, but count me in, just check your weapons at the door boys.


HECK NO !!!