Rockford Fosgate-Made in the USA

[MacLeod]

In case anybody doubted RF amps are made in the USA, theyve put a live webcam up so you can see them actually assembling them.

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/cam/

[audiobliss]

Ineteresting. Not quite as much action as I was hoping for, lol.

[ND13]

Yawn!!!! It's too late for that.

[swerve]

that's pretty exciting... ...... i mean occasionaly you see a super hot looking arm.... mmmmm tasty.

[PolkThug]

God bless RF. I can't seem to part with my old RF gear even though I haven't used it for about a year and a half.

[Toxis]

Whatcha got PT?

I miss the Fosgate of old... SIGH!!

[Thom]

Originally posted by MacLeod
In case anybody doubted RF amps are made in the USA, theyve put a live webcam up so you can see them actually assembling them.

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/cam/

I don't think anybody doubted them, but there's another company that seems questionable...

[PolkThug]

Originally posted by Toxis
Whatcha got PT?

I miss the Fosgate of old... SIGH!!

Two RF Punch Audiophile 12's and a Punch 60ix.

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by Thom
I don't think anybody doubted them, but there's another company that seems questionable...


Well, we wouldnt want to {tru tech} give any names {tru tech} or anything like that as that {tru tech} would be unprofessional! :D

[bknauss]

RF is supposedly going to ship some stuff overseas coming soon. Its going to be an extremely rare sight to see any product really made in the US.

[MacLeod]

Thats fine with me. I like paying low prices for killer electronics!

[neomagus00]

There's no way you just said that...

[swerve]

Originally posted by neomagus00
There's no way you just said that... he did. i wanted to say something like this the other day but i just left... dissapointed.

china and similiar places don't need to be making amps... they don't even have cars there... and they ones they do have 10 amp alternators and go about 5 mph down their 7 foot wide roads.

[VR3]

I would pay the extra price to buy an American made product, especially amps, preamps, CDPs...

Speakers are a tad different as I am very picky..

Canada made is ok too...

But to say its ok to ship everything over-seas is crazy, especially coming from captain america himself... (see OT threads)

Unfreakin Believable really... I guess this is why we constantly lose jobs I guess... from textile mills to electronics... people want cheaper and will, ironically...lose their job over buying the cheaper stuff...

[swerve]

Originally posted by Vr3MxStyler2k3
I would pay the extra price to buy an American made product, especially amps, preamps, CDPs...

Speakers are a tad different as I am very picky..

Canada made is ok too...

But to say its ok to ship everything over-seas is crazy, especially coming from captain america himself... (see OT threads)

Unfreakin Believable really... I guess this is why we constantly lose jobs I guess... from textile mills to electronics... people want cheaper and will, ironically...lose their job over buying the cheaper stuff... our own worst enemy!!!!!!!woooo

[audiobliss]

Originally posted by Vr3MxStyler2k3
people want cheaper and will, ironically...lose their job over buying the cheaper stuff...

You, my friend, have hit the nail on the head.

[Thom]

Originally posted by swerve


china and similiar places don't need to be making amps... they don't even have cars there... and they ones they do have 10 amp alternators and go about 5 mph down their 7 foot wide roads.

What?

[swerve]

Originally posted by Thom
What? :D :D :D just being an absolute moron. nothing i said was//is true but one thing is for sure....

hopefully within the next year all my amps be plastic and say "Made in China"

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by Vr3MxStyler2k3

Unfreakin Believable really... I guess this is why we constantly lose jobs I guess... from textile mills to electronics... people want cheaper and will, ironically...lose their job over buying the cheaper stuff...

Well Sid, when are we going to start losing these jobs? Alarmists have been saying this crap for decades! 20 years ago Japan was going to take all our jobs and we were going to be ruined. Now its China!! :rolleyes: Yet our economic growth over the last 25 years has been unreal! Unemployment is at level unthought of 20 years ago. Even with a war on, unemployment is down, personal income is up, gross domestic product is up, new home starts are up and you can go out and buy an excellent set of speakers for $200!

Just because we farm out the mindless "put round peg in round hole" jobs to China doesnt mean we're losing jobs over here. While we may loose the mindless jobs here, there are plenty more created by the booming economy to replace them.

An example would be about 15 years ago there were about 2 car audio manufacturers? Now there are 100's! Farming out mindless jobs to China makes things cheaper which boosts the economy and creates more jobs. Yeah, we've lost the mindless jobs to overseas but there have been plenty jobs created over here to replace them. One thing you have to remember my brother, is the economy and especially the job market is not static. Its constantly changing and growing. You cant think of it as there are "X" number of jobs in the country and if any go to China we'll be losing out.

Im all for a global economy and global trade. Im a diehard capitalist thru and thru. Its the best system going and it, along with freedom, is why this country is running rings around the rest of the world!

Captain America! LOL
Thats the nicest thing youve ever said to me Sid! ;)

[exalted512]

AMERICA! F*** YEAH. WERE OFF TO SAVE THE MOTHER ****ING DAY NOW!

sorry, i love that song though...
-Cody

[audiobliss]

haha! Never heard that one, either! lol

[neomagus00]

hehe... rock and roll F*** YEAH! the internet F*** YEAH! slavery F*** YEAH!

but as an addendum to mac's "Even with a war on, unemployment is down, personal income is up, gross domestic product is up, new home starts are up and you can go out and buy an excellent set of speakers for $200!" i remind him that the same thing happened in WWII... an interesting parallel...

unusually, i agree with him on this one, though i wouldn't exactly call the economy 'booming' - farming out call-center jobs to india may make support calls suck, but we also don't have to waste people on them here, and we're supporting another country... perhaps one day, in some way due to our support, india will become a force of its own and make all the cool little gadgets we want, and so 'pay' for itself in some capitalistic way...

this does create somewhat of a concern for the 'lower class' in this country, though... it's pretty much necessary to have a bachelor's degree to even be considered for a job anymore (and yes, that's a mild exaggeration, but not by much). what happens to those that can't afford college? they used to work in call centers... now what? (and that's an actual question, not a rhetorical one)

[MacLeod]

That doesnt fly either.

Any nimrod can get a job in a warehouse loading trucks for $10/hr. Again, dont think of the job market as a static entity.

The economy recovered in WWII because of all the industry and manufactuering that came with a World War. The war on terror isnt quite the same. Especially when its in the middle of oil fields possibly disrupting the free flow of oil at market prices.

I would call the economy booming! Back around 1996 you wouldve thought we were in Utopia! Vitrually every newspaper hailed the economy as the best ever. GDP was unreal, unemployment was awesome! Personal income was at an all time high!! Wow! It was paradise! Well according to the numbers, the economy is better now! Hell, it wasnt too long ago that something like 6% unemployment was considered full employment! We're in the low 5%'s now!!

Hell, here in Chattanooga, unemployment is 3% and the suburbs are exploding in new houses being built. Yet, we've lost a bunch of manufacturing jobs but yet our local economy is one of the best in the WORLD!

[neomagus00]

i'm wondering, though, where those people go when their manufacturing job dies? what happens to them?

[swerve]

Originally posted by neomagus00
i'm wondering, though, where those people go when their manufacturing job dies? what happens to them? they go down to the local swimmin' hole and say...

YYYYEEEAAAHHHHH.

[aaharvel]

i'd like to chime in here if that's ok.


Originally posted by MacLeod
Just because we farm out the mindless "put round peg in round hole" jobs to China doesnt mean we're losing jobs over here. While we may loose the mindless jobs here, there are plenty more created by the booming economy to replace them.

Come on MacLeod: "Put round peg in round hole jobs"? Compared to their replacements, many, of these jobs being outsourced were higher-tech, higher skilled, and higher paying. Many of these jobs were in the computer and call-center industries. No- these jobs aren't dream careers by any means-but they're better than their replacements. Service industry jobs, customer service jobs. The kind of jobs you see highschool kids or less educated people working, Part-time jobs aka jobs with no health benefits.

So while the unemployment numbers aren't changing- the standard of living has. A 6% increase since 1996 specifically, yet minimum wage hasn't been increased in 9years. Based on that alone, the lower classes and working classes are making less money now than in the 90's- and this correlates into a class-struggle tug o'war so to speak. When the rich get richer, and the poor get poorer- it's the middle class that's going to be ripped apart. This doesn't happen when crappy jobs are replaced with better ones; and it's not because incomes are on the rise in the lower and working classes; and it's DEFINTELY not because the economy is better than ever.

jmo =)

and btw Mac.Leod- who do you like for the U.S. Open?

[swerve]

i guess my job come the end of the month (call center) is a round peg in a round hole job then.

[neomagus00]

but aren't round pegs supposed to go in round holes? :)

and obviously these things are not universal truths, for anyone that's missing that point...

[MacLeod]

So we're headed for soup lines because the minimum wage hasnt been increased in 9 years? The minimum wage is a total sham as are all price/wage controls. They dont work!

Hell, I bet youd be hard pressed to even find a job that pays $5.15/hr! McDonalds pays $7!!! The wages are rising with the economy. Thats the way capitalism works. The marketplace determines prices and wages.

And this class warfare thing is getting tired. Its been going on since the 80's and it infuriates me. Back about 500 years ago you were either born into royalty or a peasant. Thats it you had nowhere else to go. That isnt the case today. You dont like your economic situation, change it! There is no excuse to be poor in todays world! Not everybody can be Bill Gates but nobody has to be living in a beat up trailer out in a field somewhere.

The rich are getting richer but SO IS EVERYBODY! That is what is meant when the national average income goes UP! Everybody is making more money! And always remember, there is a big difference in being "poor" and being "broke".

The wages in lower skill/entry level jobs are substantially higher than before! Again, McDonalds pays $7/hr, convenience stores pay $8/hr. Loading trucks pays $10/hr!

And why is working in a foundry pouring molten steel for $30,000 a year a "real job" and working as a customer service manager for $30,000 a year is not? My wife has been in retail for about 20 years now and has always made great money and has unreal benefits. Like everything there are choices and different levels. Yes there are the part time jobs the high school kids take but there are full time positions and management positions available which make excellent careers.

I will just never understand how somebody can look out over the fruited plain and see how GOOD we have it here and how BLESSED we are and see nothing but soup lines and poverty and sickness.

Federer seems to be on fire but Im pulling for Roddick!

[neomagus00]

i didn't hear anyone call the foundry worker 'real' and the retail worker 'fake'. both are respectable jobs, both are necessary for the economy to work, and both pay the bills, that's all there is to that.

class warfare - i dunno about warfare, and i'm in complete agreement with you about today's class mobility, but nothing can change the fact that most people that are born in a trailer park die in a trailer park. MOST, not all. of course you're going to have the exceptions, the ones that rise above their situation. that also means that you have rich kids that fall into the gutters; such is life. the imbalance is that it's so much easier for the rich kid to fall - and get back up - than it is for the trailer park kid to rise.

the original debate here was about outsourcing jobs to asia. the retail job you mentioned is in no jeopardy - people always want to buy stuff. the manufacturing job, on the other hand... let's hear the story of Bethlehem Steel, or at least the end of it. at the end of 1982, the workers at this company were making $26.29 (that's over $50/hour, if you adjust for inflation!). In addition, they got health, dental, and eye care, unemployment benefits, paid vacations (the senior 50% of the workforce got more than 3 months of paid vacation every five years above and beyond their normal paid vacation). there are two reasons they went down - minimills (smaller, more agile companies that could outmaneuver the big 'uns in the marketplace) and foreign steel. long story short, Bethlehem Steel crashed and burned and left an entire town without jobs.

i see the same thing happening today with entry- and lower-level white-collar jobs. i work in a building that's about 25% consultants, who are 'on loan' from an indian consulting company - they weren't here five years ago. i suppose that my question is why, on a larger scale, don't americans have these jobs? is it because they're too proud? do americans do too little at a job to earn the rewards they want? what is it? yes, yes, it's all in the market, but this is a part of it - americans are getting pissed at this sort of thing but are doing nothing to change it.

P.S. yes, the trailer park kid up above has it real good compared to, say, middle eastern kids, but he doesn't care about them, he's looking at the richies and wondering why they're where they are and he's where he is.

P.P.S. who're federer and roddick?

[swerve]

answer to PPS.

Tennis Playas

[MacLeod]

OK, so that steel mill was pure Utopia and then they went out of business, mainly because it seems like they priced themselves out of business. That sucks. I know. Its also life. Its also progress.

With progress comes change and with change people get screwed. Thats inevitable and there is nothing you can do about it. However, for the country as a whole, we benefit from the progress. Also, a company cant pay its people $60/hr with 6 months paid vacations and expect to remain competitve. Thats why unions are on the decline. They tend to price their members right out of a job. UPS employess' day is coming. You realize they make over $23/hr!!!! Eventually theyll demand more money than UPS can afford to pay them and bammo! Same thing happened to a big trucking comany here in Chatty. Their drivers were making $25/hr and eventually the company went bankrupt. I fully support unions coming to a profitable agreement with both employees and employers, but both have to be realistic.

What about all those companies that made buggy whips and wagon wheels? They may have been the best employers in the world. Would you rather us go back to the days of horse and buggies just to keep them employed?

Youre always bitching about trucks and SUV's and oil. What about when we develop an engine that can run off a water? What about all those poor people that work for Exxon and Shell? Theyre gonna get screwed right? But still, isnt the country and even the world better off as a whole?

[audiobliss]

Originally posted by MacLeod
But still, isnt the country and even the world better off as a whole?

Nope!! I like my 427s with dual 4 barrel carbeurators, pouring out that burned leaded gas!! Mmmmm...I can smell it now!! The smell of raw power.......:D

[MacLeod]

LMFAO!!!

Touche'!

Got me on that one!!

A 1966 Pontiac GTO with about 1000 horsepower stock! :D

[neomagus00]

exxon people won't necessarily get screwed, no... take BP for example, they're expanding in that direction already to be ready for said advancements... if properly prepared, their people (hehe... properly prepped people) will be able to slide over into the new jobs. same with the horse people - they stopped making buggies and used their marketable skills to get a job building cars. the steel worker, though...

and strangely enough, i'm with you on unions (we seem to be agreeing about everything, yet there's still controversy :p). yes, they are pricing themselves out of a job, and people will fill the job, and that's their own damn fault. i've got no issue there.

the issue is not progress, it's how to make progress and not leave any more people behind than absolutely necessary, cause it can be done, it's just a matter of balancing the needs of society with the needs of the individuals that make up the society.

and gas ain't goin nowhere till there's no oil left... and thus, of course, no ANWR...

[MacLeod]

Yeah, those steel workers got screwed. Thats a shame and it sucks but it happens. It couldnt have been stopped by legislation or some cruel business man being run out of town, it happens. Nothing is forever especially in the business world.

Look, you cant keep every single company in business forever. It would be great if you could and nobody could lose their job but you cant. Its a part of life. The world is constantly changing and we have to adapt with it. Sometimes people get screwed, hell a lot of times people do but they keep going.

And Im of the belief that there will always be oil. More and more scientists are signing on to the theory that oil is MADE by the earth or rather as a byproduct of the processes going on in the earths core. My gawd! We've been drilling and using oil by the billions of gallons and we keep finding more. There is more oil seeping out of the ocean floor into the ocean than is used thruout the entire human race and yet we keep finding more! Besides, capitolism will ensure there will be a fuel alternative soon. Any idea how much an engine powered by tap water would be worth? $$$$$$$$$$$

[aaharvel]

Welcome back MacLeod- I thought you had dropped off the face of the earth. I'm pulling for Roddick as well.

:D

[swerve]

okay this is bad but most likely the best thing i've ever thought of.

I drink gasoline//
which allows me to spit fire//
terrorism? nah I'm the reason the bush administration had to conspire//


someone said fuel so... yea.

[audiobliss]

...please.....no one say fuel again.......

[swerve]

Jay-Z will be bitin' that most likely on his "return album"

then we will know a true legend reads the polk forums.

[ND13]

Here's a scenario for you guys to ponder about unions.

DaimlerChrysler has a foundry here in Indy that makes blocks for the 3.3 v6, 3.8 v6, and a couple of others. About 4 years ago, when the new hemi was coming to fruition, this plant was offered the block and the dumbasses turned it down. So guess what..... Mexico got it. They said that there wouldn't be enough demand for the engine except for the trucks. Well as of now there are at least 6 vehicles that use the engine and Mexico can't keep up with demand. In two months the Indy plant will be shutting its doors. If they would have taken on the block they would be keeping their jobs. That would have meant working while retooling the plant, though. Ironic.....

Unions were once a very necessary and great institution. If it weren't for unions, Henry Ford would have kept paying his workers chump change and they couldn't even afford the cars they were building. They became too powerful and corrupt while the workers(not all) became fat and lazy. They have definitely hurt themselves. I live in an extremely blue colar town(New Castle, In) and have family members that are UAW, so I've seen it first hand. You wouldn't believe some of the stories I could tell you about some of the things those guys did and got away with and they wonder why the plants are getting closed.

[audiobliss]

Perhaps this sums it all up best: People are.....people.

[swerve]

Originally posted by audiobliss
Perhaps this sums it all up best: People are.....people. are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are people....are birds....

[audiobliss]

ROFL

I don't think you have enough to do!

[MacLeod]

I totally support unions. I think they are what capitalism is all about. Employees using their combined bargaining power to come to an agreement with employers benefitial to both sides. For years its worked out great and both manufacturers and employees have benefited. But sometimes the unions get greedy or make bad decisions and price themselves right out of work.

[ND13]

Originally posted by MacLeod
I totally support unions. I think they are what capitalism is all about. Employees using their combined bargaining power to come to an agreement with employers benefitial to both sides. For years its worked out great and both manufacturers and employees have benefited. But sometimes the unions get greedy or make bad decisions and price themselves right out of work.

Exactly what I said, maybe it didn't read that way, though.

[MacLeod]

Nah, I just always have to have the last word! :D :p

[Thom]

$10 an hour around here won't get you close to buying a house. Townhouses are going for more than $200K, and a "real" house is more than that. It took us forever to find a house in a half decent school district that we could afford. No way we can afford private school, since my salary barely pays the bills as it is. And that's on a month when the kids aren't at the doctor for something or another. We can go through a few hundred dollars in co- pays a month. But at least we don't have any credit card debt, which it seems is quite common nowadays...

[swerve]

I'm about to get my first credit card....! for a computer. I'm thinking of paying 500 up front for it. charging the rest then some how disposing of the card so i never use it again.

I hate doing it but it's clear I need a new comp and my mom can use the old one...

[PolkThug]

Originally posted by swerve
I'm about to get my first credit card....! for a computer. I'm thinking of paying 500 up front for it. charging the rest then some how disposing of the card so i never use it again.

I hate doing it but it's clear I need a new comp and my mom can use the old one...

Its good to get a credit card ASAP to establish a credit history. After 10 years, regardless of whether you use it or not, you'll get a little FICO score bump.

However, don't carry a balance on it. If you can't pay it off at the end of the month, you shouldn't be buying it.

[swerve]

Originally posted by PolkThug
Its good to get a credit card ASAP to establish a credit history. After 10 years, regardless of whether you use it or not, you'll get a little FICO score bump.

However, don't carry a balance on it. If you can't pay it off at the end of the month, you shouldn't be buying it. In order to get a comp I'd have to carry a balance three months unless I go with Dell...

before I make a big purchase (I usually can save) I map it all out taking 2-3 emergencies into consideration..

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by Thom
$10 an hour around here won't get you close to buying a house. Townhouses are going for more than $200K, and a "real" house is more than that. It took us forever to find a house in a half decent school district that we could afford. No way we can afford private school, since my salary barely pays the bills as it is. And that's on a month when the kids aren't at the doctor for something or another. We can go through a few hundred dollars in co- pays a month. But at least we don't have any credit card debt, which it seems is quite common nowadays...

Thats the way Austin is. When we first moved to Texas in '97 we found out real quick we couldnt afford anything there either so 4 months later we moved up to Temple where the cost of living was much lower.

I think Chattanooga has the best mix of both. The job market here is very strong and the cost of living is quite low. We are also one of the lowest taxed states in the union.

[ND13]

Originally posted by MacLeod
Thats the way Austin is. When we first moved to Texas in '97 we found out real quick we couldnt afford anything there either so 4 months later we moved up to Temple where the cost of living was much lower.

I think Chattanooga has the best mix of both. The job market here is very strong and the cost of living is quite low. We are also one of the lowest taxed states in the union.

So true, Tennessee is one of the lowest taxing states. Try living in Indiana where you pay federal , state, county, and city income taxes. Then you pay 6% sales tax on everything and excise tax on you vehicles, which depending on the cost of the vehicle can be over $500/yr gradually decreasing over time. It was twice as high before the lottery was implemented. With me being from the South, it just kills me to pay that many different taxes and not see any benefit from it. The Indiana state government is about as inefficient as one could be. When I moved up here at the end of '97, Indiana had an $11million surplus, and by the end of 2003 there was a massive defecit. The new governor "says" he going to turn it around. I voted for him, so I hope he can do what he has set out to accomplish. Anyways, his administration can't be any worse than the last(fingers and toes crossed). I can't afford anymore tax hikes.

[MacLeod]

Georgia is the same way. Its been run by democrats forever and not only has high city, state and local taxes but you also get a nice income tax as well.

When I was living there before making $9/hr I was paying over $70 a month just in state income taxes!

[ND13]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MacLeod
[B]Georgia is the same way. Its been run by democrats forever and not only has high city, state and local taxes but you also get a nice income tax as well.

Same with Indiana, the donkeys went through the surplus like it was there own cash. The new guy is an elephant, a tiny one(5'4" and that's generous), but one the same. Hopefully the legislative branch will cooperate.

[Toxis]

and I'll say it again... AT LEAST YOU DON'T LIVE IN KANSAS! :p :D

Try living in what once was the 2nd most wealthy counties in the nation (per capita). Taxes are a bitch. You're lucky to find sales tax anywhere around here under 7.5%...

I'm looking at a paycheck stub from the end of last year and when you gross $2200 and take home under $1500... 'nuff said.

[swerve]

Originally posted by Toxis
Try living in what once was the 2nd most wealthy counties in the nation (per capita). Taxes are a bitch. You're lucky to find sales tax anywhere around here under 7.5%...
same here in normal. if i go get something after work I drive over to bloomington (Twin Cities so they are connected) and it is a tad lower....

[PolkThug]

Originally posted by Toxis
and I'll say it again... AT LEAST YOU DON'T LIVE IN KANSAS! :p :D

Try living in what once was the 2nd most wealthy counties in the nation (per capita). Taxes are a bitch. You're lucky to find sales tax anywhere around here under 7.5%...

I'm looking at a paycheck stub from the end of last year and when you gross $2200 and take home under $1500... 'nuff said.

I'm in Johnson County too... :mad:

I should get free classes at Johnson County Community College!!! (I can't believe how much of my property tax goes straight to them)

[swerve]

JCCC... that's alot of C's for a college... jeeze.

[Toxis]

yeah, that's why we just pronounce it Juco... much easier :)

[swerve]

community colleges rock!
the one here has the universities profs. pretty much just helluvalot cheaper. for my 4 classes and books it was 1050 for one semester. so not too bad.

[MacLeod]

Thats why the only places to live anymore are Tennessee, Texas and Florida (assuming it doesnt wash away).

Income taxes should be unconstitutional!

Im all for a national retail tax.