Good setup or not?

[Mendo]

Alright guys I have almost decided on what I’m putting in. Again I’m the one with the 97 Dodge Neon. Ok here is a list of what I am thinking of.

• Kenwood KDC MP7028 HU
• Polk MMC6500 components
• Polk C300.2 2/1 Channel amp to power components
• Polk MM2104 subs x2
• Polk C500.1 Monoblock amp to power both subs

I was just wondering how well this would work.

Also

If I’m just going to use the two amps how many preamp outputs would I need. I was also wondering if this is a good HU for the money. I am a little hesitant with it because of the price so if I don’t need 3 preamp outputs the I’ll look for something different.

here's the site for the HU http://www.crutchfield.com/S-PwfJaGZYB9J/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?i=113MP7028

[MacLeod]

That looks perfect. Those amps are near perfect matches for those speakers.

As for pre-outs, you only need 2 with this setup but you should try to get one with 3. This will allow you room to upgrade if you wish to do so in the future. Plus a subwoofer level control is a little different from a fader and kinda works better.

[Mendo]

where would be a good place to put the tweeters in my car

should i look at getting a couple of kick panel enclosures or is that just a waste of money

and are there any web sites that i should stay away from when purchasing online

[audiobliss]

Man, that is an awesome set-up!! You'll be happy with that for life! I'm not real fond of Kenwood stuff, but that looks like a pretty nice HU!

[audiobliss]

Well, make sure the retailer is authorized! That's a biggie! As for where to put the tweets, I'm not that familiar with Neons. I'll see one Tuesday, so I'll peep in and see what I can find out. I'd try to do something other than kick-panels. There are several cons to using them, and they're not that cheap. You can probably find something better.

[Mendo]

thanks all the help is greatly aprieciated

[Mendo]

another question

what is the difference between the MM2104 and the MM2104DVC subs?

[Toxis]

single or dual voice coil for wiring configurations. You'll want the single so you can get a 2 ohm load out of the amp.

[MacLeod]

The only cons to using kick panels is that they eat up some of your leg room and in a Neon you aint got much to start with.

But they put the speakers at a more equal distance to your ears then having one in each door with one twice as close as the other. This put the image right in the middle of you where it should be.

Sounddomain.com and Crutchfield.com are the best places to buy. They are fully authorized dealers of the stuff they sell and have excellent reputations. Sounddomain is a little cheaper tho. You can find sites with cheaper prices but if you buy something from an unauthorized dealer you cant be sure what youre getting. Could be remenufactured, repaired or an outright knock off!

[AustinKP]

Sounddomain.com does pricematch though. Even to unauthorized dealers. Even if they can't match, they'll ususally drop their price a ton...

[Mendo]

need some more help please. I was originally going to go with the Kenwood KDC-MP7028 but after searching around some more I have found another that looks good too, the Panasonic CQ-C9700U. The only thing that concerns me is the RMS Power Bandwidth on the Panasonic. I don’t know what the number is supposed to be but it’s at 1k while the Kenwood is at 30-20k. just wondering what one I should use. Thanks

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-1BDXe9xo9oX/cgi-bin/prodcomp.asp?g=62700&ITM133C9700=on&ITM113MP7028=on&hidesimilar=n

[audiobliss]

When I first saw that, I didn't have a clue what it meant. However, I clicked on it on Crutchfield's page, and they describe it as being the frequency (or frequency range) at which the HU's internal amp's RMS power output was measured. Thus, the Panasonic was rated as putting out it's advertised RMS power at 1,000Hz, while the Kenwood was rated as putting out it's advertised RMS power at 30Hz-20,000Hz.

If you were actually comparing the amps of the two HUs, you would definitely not want the Panasonic. Since it's rated at 1,000Hz, it probably doesn't make near it's advertised RMS power throughout the entire frequency range (which is where your music is). However, this shouldn't really matter too much, as I believe it only reflects on the amp (and the manufacturer), and not its pre-amp section. Since you're looking at using amps with it, this shouldn't be a big deal. Just make your decision based on cosmetics, design, ease of use, and features.

However, this does make me dislike Panasonic and like Kenwood a lot more. I don't like it when manufacturers make the limiting factors in a test so narrow that it renders the results meaningless, just to make the figures more impressive.

-5 for Panasonic
+1 for Kenwood

However, despite the manufacturers different attitudes, this shouldn't directly affect you much since you're using external amps.

[MacLeod]

Both these measurements are irrelevent. Both will make about the same power which is about nothing.

A head unit is a horrible power source. They cant help it, they are limited by their size. Compare a 50x4 head unit to a 50x4 amp. Notice the amp is about 5 times bigger than the h/u? How can the h/u make as much power? It cant. A h/u will only make about 10 watts real world. Anything beyond that will be quite dirty.

So choose your head unit by features, looks and price. The amp sections are going to be identical, at least as far as youll be able to hear.

[Toxis]

a lot of companies (even in the home audio world, cheap shit of course) rate their amplifiers at 1k frequency because it's the easiest frequency for an amplifier to play, thus will give more power than it will at say 20 or 20k. More power rated means better for advertising... but in the mobile audio world, how many "popular" companies HONESTLY rate their amps accurately? Popular usually rolls with bling... let that be enough said.

[exalted512]

toxis, is there as much crap in the HT world as there is in CA? i dont really think so because CA is geared more towards kids and kids are more susceptible to bling and the like...
-Cody

[swerve]

Originally posted by exalted512
toxis, is there as much crap in the HT world as there is in CA? i dont really think so because CA is geared more towards kids and kids are more susceptible to bling and the like...
-Cody you mean this nitro flip down LCD i bought wasn't worth 100 dollars?

man I knew something was fishy....

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by Toxis
but in the mobile audio world, how many "popular" companies HONESTLY rate their amps accurately? Popular usually rolls with bling... let that be enough said.

Well in the car audio world, most quality manufacturers underrate their amps signifigantly. A 100 watt amp from MTX, Crossfire, PPI and the like will likely be a 150+ watt amp.

From what little experience Ive had with home audio, the opposite seems to be true.

[audiobliss]

Now, wait a minute. What amps have you had experience with in the HT world? If you're talking about Sony, Yamaha, Denon, Onkyo, JVC, etc, that doesn't count. MTX, Crossfire, PPI are 'good' CA amps; you have to also look at 'good' HT amps. If you look at NAD, B&K, Carver, Anthem, Rotel, Sunfire, etc, I'm sure they'd be underrated just as much as the previously mentioned CA amps.

And of course since we're talking about amps, that excludes receivers; we're now talking separates.

[exalted512]

i dont know much about home audio, but i do know some of the amps you just listed are much better than mtx and crossfire are in the CA world...
-Cody

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by exalted512
i dont know much about home audio, but i do know some of the amps you just listed are much better than mtx and crossfire are in the CA world...
-Cody

To some people anyway.

:rolleyes:


Originally posted by audiobliss
Now, wait a minute. What amps have you had experience with in the HT world? If you're talking about Sony, Yamaha, Denon, Onkyo, JVC, etc, that doesn't count. MTX, Crossfire, PPI are 'good' CA amps; you have to also look at 'good' HT amps. If you look at NAD, B&K, Carver, Anthem, Rotel, Sunfire, etc, I'm sure they'd be underrated just as much as the previously mentioned CA amps.

I admit to not having much experience with seperate HA amps. Im basing my opinion on home receivers boasting 120x7 and barely making 50x7. At least car audio h/u's rate their 50x4 as "peak". HA receivers try to pull this 120x7 crap off as RMS!

[VR3]

Seperate Amps and Receivers are completely different animals.

Most seperate amps in HA are overbuilt at any price point, from 100 to 40,000

[neomagus00]

hmm... i happen to use a 5-channel rotel separate amp... i'll have to go home and take a peek, see if it's telling the truth...

[audiobliss]

I thought you said you were outta the HA world? Man, a 5-channel Rotel...sweet. What is it driving?

[neomagus00]

nah, i'm not out, i'm just not expanding at the moment. the one i have is driving stand-mounted B&W fronts and center, and Bose direct/reflect surrounds. it is fed by a rotel reciever and both are conditioned by a rotel line conditioner.

[MacLeod]

Definitely do that Neo!

Ive read several reviews on receivers and seperate amps in home audio magazines and Ive never seen an actual "tested power". Im curious as to how they perform.

[Mendo]

how well would the Kenwood KAC-7202 (http://www.crutchfield.com/S-PAL7tBLtr9g/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=110&I=113KAC7202) amp work for polk mmc6500? im going to use the Panasonic CQ-C9700U cd player

[MacLeod]

It would work like a charm.

[audiobliss]

Looks to me like it'd do just fine.

[Mendo]

sorry i need more help

the deal going on at crutchfield says that if you spend $399 on polk/momo stuff you get a free 10" momo sub or pay just $20 and get a 12" momo sub

now i was thinking of putting in a single 15" polk sub but now with the deal im thinking of going with the single 12" sub. the other thing is that with the 15" you can get a q-logic box for only $10

can you tell me if there is a big difference between the two subs or not

thanks

[ND13]

Originally posted by Mendo
sorry i need more help

the deal going on at crutchfield says that if you spend $399 on polk/momo stuff you get a free 10" momo sub or pay just $20 and get a 12" momo sub

now i was thinking of putting in a single 15" polk sub but now with the deal im thinking of going with the single 12" sub. the other thing is that with the 15" you can get a q-logic box for only $10

can you tell me if there is a big difference between the two subs or not

thanks

Historically, 12" subs are more accurate than 15" subs. Now with that being said, things have progressed since my days in the car audio scene, so that may not be true anymore. It'll depend on how you like your bass. I prefer 10" subs in sealed enclosures, but that's me.

[MacLeod]

It depends. 500 watts thru a single sub will sound just like 500 watts thru 2 subs (250 each). Its the total watts used that make the difference, not the number of subs.

I dont like 15's. Theyre the loudest but I prefer 12's if the sub is going to be in the trunk and 10's if the sub is going to be in the cab with me like in a hatchback or SUV.

[Mendo]

• Panasonic CQ-C9700U HU $280.00
• Polk MMC6500 components x2 $300.00
• Polk C300.2 2/1 Channel amp $210.00
• Polk MM2124 sub $20.00
• Sub enclosure $55.00
• Kick panels $130.00
• Sub grill $20.00
• Polk C500.1 Monoblock amp $400.00

Total $1415.00

this is what im planning on buying. i know there's is other stuff i need like wires, but i have no idea what is good or bad. could you guys tell me what else im going to need and what stuff i should get.

here is the other stuff i get for free on line crutchfield (http://www.crutchfield.com/S-rmSd4Kd3q4P/cgi-bin/ViewCart.asp) and cardomain (http://www.cardomain.com/cart) thanks

[MacLeod]

For wires dont spend a ton.

Power wire and speaker wire are all the same. Pep Boys has 12 guage wire for $20 for a 50' spool from Lightning Audio, thats all you need.

For power wire just go to an audio shop and buy 20 or less feet of wire and about 5 foot of ground wire. Its usually cheaper this way.

As for RCA's dont fall for the $500 per foot cables. The only difference between a crappy set of RCA's and a mega buck set is the amount of noise they let in, thats it. Go to Circuit City and get you some Monster Standard RCA's. Theyre shielded and well made and go for $14 for 20'! Ive been using them for years and they let in no noise.

[exalted512]

Originally posted by MacLeod
It depends. 500 watts thru a single sub will sound just like 500 watts thru 2 subs (250 each). Its the total watts used that make the difference, not the number of subs.


do you really believe that?
-Cody

[MacLeod]

I really know it!

Ive even done it several times. Right now Ive got a single 8" MTX sub and every once in a while I take my JL Audio box with dual 8's in it and hook it up to my amp for shits and giggle and even though it sounds better it is NO louder.

Im sure its not identical down the decibel but the difference aint much.

[exalted512]

maybe those subs dont get as loud as your mtx because theyre different subs?? or are they the same?
-Cody

[Toxis]

same power + doubling # of subs = 3db gain. If you can't hear 3db, you're retarded. :D

[MacLeod]

The MTX sub is more of an SPL sub where the JL W1's arent. Still, I notice virtually no difference in the volume. Actually the JL's should be louder. Their getting nearly 400 watts and theyre 350 watt subs where the little MTX is only a 150 watt sub. The JL's are tighter and the MTX is boomier but the volume is pretty much the same.

And a 3db increase aint much. You could hear it if you were A/B'ing from 0 to + 3 but even then it wouldnt be drastic.

Bottom line is 500 watts is basically 500 watts, (assuming youre using the same subs) doesnt matter if its coming out of 1 sub or 50. Its gonna have virtually the same volume.