High Budget 7.1 Polk HT... Need advise...

[Snagglepuss1318]

Im attaching a pic of my basement floorplan that is currently under construction. Drywall is not up yet but will be in about 2 weeks. I have a high budget and want to get good quality but not outrageous things ill never use, like the denon avr-5805 (ya its great but ill never use all of its features). Considering the dimensions of the Home Theater, what do you "polk enthusiasts" suggest? I need everything from speakers, sub, receivers, amps, etc., etc., etc... The room is pretty narrow at 13' wide but is fairly long at 22.5'...

Also have some speakers in the Rec Room and Home Gym, I need suggestions on some wall mount speakers for those as well. All wires home run to my HT Equipment Closet...

[sickicw]

before you put up the drywall, i would run 10 gauge wire to all possible locations of speakers around the room. Then get at least two 20 amp deticate dedicated power lines to the location that will be used for all of your equipment.... now since you said you have a high budget, here is what i would go with....

lsi speakers all around. I would go with the lsi9s for left and right. I think they sound the best, but its up to you as to buy them vs the lsi15s or 25s.

for amps i would get a krell TAS (theater amp standard) plus a krell KAV2250. These are really expensive, so if you can’t afford it, then go with the krell showcase 7 channel amp. This is also expensive, but less than the TAS and KAV2250. By the way you can find these used on audiogon.com for a lot less. LSi speakers need very high current amps to make them sound best.

Now with this setup you will have to get a pre amp. Best bet here is to find one that is compatible with the blu-ray and hd-dvd multichannel PCM outputs. Not sure how easy this will be to find right now, but im sure someone on the forum can help.

For a sub I would pick up a high end velodyne. Maybe a DD-12 or DD-15

[Snagglepuss1318]

Already ran 12 gauge to all of the locations indicated in red. I have 4 wires for my surrounds pulled because im not quite sure if ill put them toward the center set of columns or the rear set of columns. Inbetween the columns will be decorative acoustical treatments so I cannot put them there.

Right now I have 1 20A dedicated circuit for my equipment closet and 1 20A dedicated for my HDTV at the front of the room. Do you suggest I pull 1 more for the equipment closet??

[sickicw]

Right now I have 1 20A dedicated circuit for my equipment closet and 1 20A dedicated for my HDTV at the front of the room. Do you suggest I pull 1 more for the equipment closet??

If i were you I would run a extra duel 20A line (dedicated 20 amps on top plug and another on the bottom plug) to the equipment closet. you might not ever need all that power, but you never know.

I am currently experimenting with different amplification setups with my lsi speakers, and I am quickly coming to the conclusion that I will need much much more power (more current actually) that what I currently have available and wish I would have ran a few 20 amp lines when I built my house.

[Frank Z]

Make sure you add adequate ventilation for the equipment closet.
Lsi15's up front, LsiFX's on the sides, Lsi7's outback, Sunfire Truesub EQ.
Just like ME!!!!

I also use an Anthem AVM-20 mated to an Outlaw 7100 7 channel amp.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright, Lsi's it is... Not sure the dimensions of the Lsi15's & Lsi25's but they look a little big for my room. I still have to shove some seats in there and not be cramped.

With the LsiFX's as surrounds do I need to run another cable for these or is 1 adequate?

[sickicw]

One speaker wire to each LsiFx should be enough (unless you were planning on bi-amping them), but I am not sure if 10 gauge would be better than 12 gauge. It really depends on your amp and how much current you are planning to deliver to the speakers. Personally, I would run a 10 gauge wire to each one and use that for the connection. You could leave the 12 gauge ones in the wall too just in case. One thing you might want to consider is nailing a block of wood between the 2x4s where you want to mount the speakers. They are pretty heavy speakers and it would be better to be mounted into something that can really hold up the weight.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Will do. I have a question on mounting positions too. The fronts I will put at approx ear level. But im not sure about the surrounds and rears. My problem w/the surrounds is that I have sconces roughed in at about 5.5' up on every column. I will have to mount them either above or below this height, and the ceilings are 9'...

[Frank Z]

The surrounds should be 2-3' above the seated listeners noggin.

[Joey_V]

Not going to go into the intricacies of positioning, but I would go:

LSi15x2
LSi9/FX all the way around (probably FX since this is more HT oriented)
LSiC for center up front
Velodyne DD18x2 (subs, run the eq and wallah.... flat down to 16hz or less with room gain!)
Amps - I would go with a Rotel 1095 + RB1090 (mains) for the 7 speakers

This probably costs a cool 15 to 20K.

[amulford]

Scratch the cross corner mounts in the other rooms. Two channel music is not recorded for that type of presentation. It will sound like crap.

Find one wall and put the pairs on it.

as far as suggestions, not to be a smart ass, I suggest you get a listen on.

For receivers, I'd look a little higher end than Denon. The Krell is nice. Others to look at would be Rotel, B&K, Sunfire, Lexicon.

Or go seperates.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright, im making some progress... Think I decided so far on:

Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi9 rears
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

I need a sub tho... If im not mistaken there are 8's in the Lsi15's so I should be good w/1 seperate sub, right? I think that 2 velodyne DD-18 would be a little too much bass for me w/the 8's in the Lsi15s too.

[Frank Z]

9's in the rear are a waste, also...they do not have an integrated mount like the 7's do.

[Snagglepuss1318]

9's in the rear are a waste, also...they do not have an integrated mount like the 7's do.

Why are they a waste?? Are you suggesting:
Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi7 rears
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

[tdeluce]

For a sub I would pick up a high end velodyne. Maybe a DD-12 or DD-15

You also go with a HGS-15X and SMS-1 to provide the same features
and SQ as a DD-15 for less money and more flexibility :-)

[tdeluce]

Alright, im making some progress... Think I decided so far on:

Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi9 rears
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

I need a sub tho... If im not mistaken there are 8's in the Lsi15's so I should be good w/1 seperate sub, right? I think that 2 velodyne DD-18 would be a little too much bass for me w/the 8's in the Lsi15s too.

I cut my LSi15s off at 60Hz and send everything below that to my HGS-15X.

The 8 in. woofers in the LSi15 are great for music but for real a "explosive"
HT experience you are you going to want at least a HGS-15X + sms-1 ( or DD-15 ).

I get a flat frequency response from 15 Hz to 60 Hz with a lot of headroom
on a single HGS-15X so I would start with one sub, check out the Frequency
Response for your particular room and go from there. My subwoofer volume
is only one-third of the way and my room is caibrated at 85 dB from the center
listening position.

[Frank Z]

Yes, that's what I'm suggesting.

The 9's are a big bookshelf speaker that sound better than speakers costing 2-3 times as much. They would be a waste of money to be used simply as a rear suround speaker. The 7's can hold there own against many speakers as well but are more suited to surround duty than the 9's because of their size, built in wall mount, and cost. You don't need a $900+ set of rear surround speakers to get a great sounding 7.1 system.

[Toxis]

LSi15
LSiC
LSiFX for sides
LSi9's (buy a heavy duty mount to support them)
Sunfire Solitaire 12 sub. Single 12" sealed. Built in EQ w/mic. Phenominal sub and has plenty of output without losing any sound quality. No sloppy bass there!
Lexicon Preamp (can't remember model number right now)
Sherbourn 7/2100 amp.
Denon 3910 dvd player
Furman power conditioner/surge protector
Cables by Signal, Bettercables, Cobalt, Blue Jeans or Audioquest (no monster!)
Home Theater Master MX-850 universal remote
Home Theater Master MRC-250 rf adapter (so equipment can be run in closet)

I think that covers it. Am I the only one who really gave him everything he needed? hehehe

[Joey_V]

I think that covers it. Am I the only one who really gave him everything he needed? hehehe

Braggart...

J/K!

[Snagglepuss1318]

Hey, you guys are a great help! Was just thinking tho if I were to go w/Lsi9's in the rear the LsiFX's are the same price. Wouldn't it be better to go w/those for the sides and rears??

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright, after some research and alot of help from this board...

Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi7 rears
SVS PB12-Plus
Outlaw 990
Outlaw 7700
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

Ill worry about the DVD player, remotes later... What else do I need?

[a_mattison]

Alright, after some research and alot of help from this board...

Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi7 rears
SVS PB12-Plus
Outlaw 990
Outlaw 7700
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

Ill worry about the DVD player, remotes later... What else do I need?

Sounds awesome. Do you have a decent power conditioner/surge suppressor that can handle the current you will require and protect your gear? I don't know what to recommend to you, but I'm sure others can. I have a MonsterPower HTS 3500 MKII that I got pretty cheap, but dont really have any recommendations otherwise....im sure others will.

[cfrizz]

Looks great. Now you need all the interconnects to hook everything up to each other & speakerwire!

Alright, after some research and alot of help from this board...

Lsi15's fronts
LsiC
LsiFX surrounds
Lsi7 rears
SVS PB12-Plus
Outlaw 990
Outlaw 7700
Atrium 55s for rec room and gym

Ill worry about the DVD player, remotes later... What else do I need?

[Joey_V]

I would replace the 7s with 9s. If you're going multichannel music audio and you wanted to go 15s, C, 9s.... it would be better since the 9s have, what I feel, a better midrange than the 7s.

I would go:
15+C+FX+9

SVS 12+/2 (at least... not the single... I had the single + and it wont be enough once you get volume happy).

[Snagglepuss1318]

Ok, so im guessing the Outlaw 990/7700 will take place of a reciever. Or do I still need it. Probably an obvious answer but im new to all of this... Any other things I missed?? Speaker wire is ran, and I was about to purchase a monsterbass 300 interconnect @ 36' but this board seems to cringe at the name MONSTER. Anything else im missing before I present the quote to my wife?? LOL

[cfrizz]

Yes the Outlaws replace the receiver. Only thing missing are interconnects. check out, http://www.bluejeanscable.com/index.htm for those.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright 1 - 36' Canare LV-77S Subwoofer Cable...
What are the balanced/unbalanced cables? Do I need those as well?? Looking at the floorplan where do you suggest I place the Sub? Want to make sure I get a long enough cable...

[Toxis]

from what I've been told (I have no experience with Outlaw but other's do) that their processor is nice but for the money and a few bucks more, you'll get more dynamics and headroom from a Sherbourn amp. I'd consider it...

BTW, your dvd player is as important as what amp/pre you run IMO.

[wingnut4772]

I would have to say that you are gonna have a really nice HT here. Check out my link for gear recommendations and ESPECIALLY the amplifier. My Earthquake Cinenova has been incredible with the LSIs. I also used to have the LSI center and ditched it for the 9 as a center. A few here have also done that and have preferred the sound.
LSI9 Center (http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36357&highlight=lsi9+center)
More LSI9 as center (http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27175&highlight=lsi9+center)

The Outlaw 990 is reputedly similar to my Sherwood P-965 and I have to tell you that I LOVE my Sherwood. It is fantastic sounding so I think for the $$$ the Outlaw may be a good choice for now. I am not sure that I would want to spend more money on a pre right now with all the new HD audio on the horizon. I would get the nicest , most powerful amp that you can afford now as you will never need to upgrade that due to technology.( I hope !):D

Good Luck and have fun!:)

[Snagglepuss1318]

What equipment do I need to hook up those 2 sets of speakers in my Rec Room and Gym? They will be for music only...

[Toxis]

Basically you just need to get a small, low powered amp capable of 4 channels. Then you can run all the processing through the receiver for zone 2 (I'm assuming the outlaw has zone 2 capabilities). If it doesn't have that option, you can just get a small 2 channel receiver like a denon dra-395 and run it off a seperate receiver all together.

[Joey_V]

So are you going with 7s for rears or 9s?

[Ferres]

The Lsi series is great and all but also take a comparative audition of the Tannoy Sensys DC series. Clean, clear, easier to drive than the LSI series and very rewarding if given more power. :)

Subwoofer; the Paradigm Servo 15 and match it with the Velo Sms1 for eq if you want that feature.

Speaker Cables; Xlo ER-11's

[Snagglepuss1318]

So are you going with 7s for rears or 9s?

Pretty sure I am going to go w/the 7s...

[Snagglepuss1318]

I just looked at the manuals for the outlaw 990/7700 for connections. Says to use either balanced or unbalanced cables between the 2 units and 1 to the sub. What is the difference between balanced and unbalanced? I need to know so I can order and run a cable before drywall goes up soon.

[mldennison]

http://www.balanced.com/faq/balanced.html

i have no experience with balanced cables but those that do seem to claim that they sound better. you could use either although you might get some benefit from balanced...

[Frank Z]

Don't spend your coin on XLR Cables unless your amp is going to be a long distance from your preamp. 1 meter IC's are a better choice.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright, Ill order a 36' Canare LV-77S Subwoofer Cable from blue jeans then. Any suggestions on where to place my sub?? I think what im going to do is put in a conduit behind the wall for this sub cable before drywall goes up. I can move the sub around until I find a good place for it once its all setup. Ill then pull the cable through the conduit to where I need it..

This is where im at now:
LSi15 - Fronts
LSiC - Center
LSiFX - Surrounds
LSi9 - Rears
SVS PB12 - Plus/2
Outlaw 990/7700 Combo

Atrium 55 x 4

Still up in the air about the LSi9s rears, and need an amp for my Atriums...

[sickicw]

use the outlaw amp for the atruim, and get something more high current up front.
have you looked into krell showcase?

[Joey_V]

Do 9s for rears.

[Frank Z]

Joey,
You keep saying "use 9's for rears but I've yet to see you offer a plausable reason for this guy to pony up the extra coin for a pair of speakers of that caliber for rear suround duty. Explain, in detail please, why 9's are a better choice for minimal use rear surround speakers than the 7's.

Signed,
Me...eagerly awaiting an enlightened reply.

[Joey_V]

Not sure if this this is an enlightened reply Frank...

Anyway, the reason why I think he should pony up the extra what... $150 for each speaker (should be peanuts since he is building an almost $10K system)... is because he would probably use the 7/9 for rears during multichannel music playback instead of the FX (I assume).

Now, if he wants to do multichannel right, you might as well try your best to match the 15s up front. I say, the 9s have a dedicated (pseudo dedicated) midrange driver down low and a bass driver up top.... the 9s (to me) sound closer to the 15s while the 7s dont have the midrange resolution that the 15s or the 9s have... IMO.

So, why short yourself out with the 7s? You obviously have the extra cash so why not do it right (IMO)?

I know there are people who prefer the 7s to the 9s, but I much prefer the 9s. It's my opinion to go with the 9s for rears unless you:

A: Dont want to spend the extra $150 per speaker (or so).
B: You've heard both and can honestly say that you like the 7s more.

[crmfmly]

Yes, that's what I'm suggesting.

The 9's are a big bookshelf speaker that sound better than speakers costing 2-3 times as much. They would be a waste of money to be used simply as a rear suround speaker. The 7's can hold there own against many speakers as well but are more suited to surround duty than the 9's because of their size, built in wall mount, and cost. You don't need a $900+ set of rear surround speakers to get a great sounding 7.1 system.


I'm doing a complete 7.1 LSi series system and in the end after I had my 5.1 all setup I was gonna get LSi 9 for rear surround. But do you really think it's a waste of money for just rear surround and music? So what would you suggest then for rear surround sticking with Polk Audio?

[Tour2ma]

crmfmly,
Now I'll fuss (a bit)... hijacking another member's active thread is not proper forum etiquette. And if you reread all Frank's posts, your questions were answered.

Moving on....
Krell? C'mon... the 7700 can do ~23 amperes x 7. That should do. If he wants to get extra frisky and bi-amp the front stage, he can do that later.

Snagglepuss1318,
No doubt you're approaching opinion overload at this point. I'lll try not to compound it...

Sub - you were set on the SVS a bit earlier. I own one. I love it. While I do not guarantee you will as well, SVS does.

Rears - easy one here... go listen to the 7's and the 9's. If in a 2-ch audition you hear the 7's midrange hold Joey V is describing, buy the 9's. If not... Just b e sure that you listen at equal volume levels, as in SPL, not AVR setting. Otherwise the louder one will likely sound "fuller".

Welcome to the Club...

[Frank Z]

If multichannel music was the primary focus then a dedicated 5.1 channel ssytem with 5 matching speakers setup IAW the little flier that comes packaged with just about every multichannel SACD/DVD-A disc would be the absolute best option. BUT!!!! The system being built isn't a dedicated music only system, it's an HT setup that MAY be used from time to time for multichannel music. With this in mind, the additional cost of the LSi9's and and pair of suitable mounts isn't a wise choice...IMHO.

Yes the 9's are a great speaker, had a pair and wish I still owned 'em for another 2 channel rig. Would they make a huge difference in place of the 7's for movies, nope. The amount of audio present in most soundtracks is fairly minimal. It's mostly ambient, should not be localized, and therefore a larger speaker isn't needed.

It all boils down to personal taste, opinions, and available budget. Just because the coin is available doesn't mean it has to be spent.

[sickicw]

crmfmly,
Moving on....
Krell? C'mon... the 7700 can do ~23 amperes x 7. That should do.


- The outlaw amp can not drive low impedance loads very well. I own one for my lsi setup and was not impressed. If you are going to get a high dollar system, at least make sure you have an amp that can double the current as the impedance is halfed.

[polkatese]

If you are going to get a high dollar system, at least make sure you have an amp that can double the current as the impedance is halfed.

Very good advice and an appropriate rule of thumb for LSi! It works very well for my LSis, and I think the most noticeable aspect of it is in the fuller dynamic and resolutions/details at lower volume. In other words, the LSis woke up at half the volume required, otherwise.

[Frank Z]

- The outlaw amp is can not drive low impedance loads very well. I own one for my lsi setup and was not impressed. If you are going to get a high dollar system, at least make sure you have an amp that can double the current as the impedance is halfed.Gotta disagree with ya on this one. I'm push 165wpc (Outlaw7100)with all seven channels driven and have yet to have any problems driving my Lsi's. FWIW, anytime you reduce the resistance, the current will increase. Ohms Law (http://www.the12volt.com/ohm/ohmslaw.asp)

[Joey_V]

If multichannel music was the primary focus then a dedicated 5.1 channel ssytem with 5 matching speakers setup IAW the little flier that comes packaged with just about every multichannel SACD/DVD-A disc would be the absolute best option. BUT!!!! The system being built isn't a dedicated music only system, it's an HT setup that MAY be used from time to time for multichannel music. With this in mind, the additional cost of the LSi9's and and pair of suitable mounts isn't a wise choice...IMHO.

Yes the 9's are a great speaker, had a pair and wish I still owned 'em for another 2 channel rig. Would they make a huge difference in place of the 7's for movies, nope. The amount of audio present in most soundtracks is fairly minimal. It's mostly ambient, should not be localized, and therefore a larger speaker isn't needed.

It all boils down to personal taste, opinions, and available budget. Just because the coin is available doesn't mean it has to be spent.

Understood that perhaps for HT the 7s and the 9s would be a moot point. However, the guy is already spending a LOT on his system so why not have the multichannel music covered?

I dont understand why $150 per speaker is a lot to ask considering his spending of almost $8-10K.

[sickicw]

Gotta disagree with ya on this one. I'm push 165wpc (Outlaw7100)with all seven channels driven and have yet to have any problems driving my Lsi's. FWIW, anytime you reduce the resistance, the current will increase. Ohms Law[/URL]

yea, i never said anything about having problems with driving them. I am just saying that this is not really a high end amp and a krell will sound much much better for the lsi. Have you ever heard a setup in which the amp could double the current as the impedance is halfed with the lsis?

Oh and by the way, Ohms law also says that if your amp can't double the current as the impedance is halfed, then it will reduce the voltage to compensate. This decline in voltage peaks is basicly what kills the dynamics.

Volts = Amps x Ohms

Volts = amplitude of the music waveform (defined by volume and frequency) at a moment in time
Amps = current which should be non limiting (if it can't double down to low impedances, then it will limit current)
Ohms = impedance of speaker at moment in time

[Snagglepuss1318]

300 watts RMS x 7 @ 4 ohms - Outlaw 7700
600 watts @ 4-ohm load - Earthquake Cinénova Grande 7

These are the two systems I was deciding between. My goal here is to knock my own socks off when I fire this thing up EVERY time. Also to knock my friends and family's socks off when we are watching movies / listening to music. I decided on the outlaw because it seems like a great system for the $$ and thought it was AMPle (no pun intended) for what I need it for. Also, I have heard nothing but excellent reviews on the outlaw. Im afraid I might be misunderstanding the wattage aspect of it tho. 300 watts across 7 channels, sounds to me like it is going to be LOUD enough. Why would it be beneficial to have an extra 300 watts per channel??

[Toxis]

^Headroom. Dynamics. Balls.

[sickicw]

i dont think you are understanding the concept of good power.

Lsi speakers are 4 ohms average. Average only. This means they can become as low as 2 ohms, and sometimes even 1 ohm.

Let me give you am example

Amp1 is
100 watts at 8 ohms
150 watts at 4 ohms
175 watts at 2 ohms

Amp1 doesn’t sound very dynamic because when your speaker drops down to 2 ohms (and it does a lot) the amp doesn’t have enough power to properly reproduce the signal.

Amp2 is
100 watts at 8 ohms
200 watts at 4 ohms
400 watts at 2 ohms

Amp2 will sound much better because it has lots of power to deliver when it is given a 2 ohm load.

Amp3 is
300 watts at 8 ohms
350 watts at 4 ohms
385 watts at 2 ohms

Amp 3 will be louder than the other amps, but it will sound like crap.

[Tour2ma]

First, speaker ratings are nominal ratings, not average.
http://www.smarthouse.com.au/Real_Hi_Fi/Full_Sized_Speakers?article=/Real%20Hi%20Fi/Full%20Sized%20Speakers/K9M5D2X5&page=2
Link even quotes our Polk Paul on the LSi line. He says:
"With them, the impedance curve stays below the 8-Ohm line a lot. So there, we thought it important to send the consumer a signal that they need to have an amplifier that can drive a 4-Ohm load."

Look, I'm as much for all the current capacity (which is really what your example is demonstrating, not power) you can afford (better to have and not need, etc.) as anyone, but just how much listening do you do near your amp's continuous, full-rated output? That's the only level where your example has any credence. I've heard 8 W tube amps that sound amazing, albeit on mid-to-upper-90 dB efficient speakers.

With any reasonably sensitive/ efficient speaker (upper 80's) in an average sized room, the average power level for normal listening in the low 90's dB-wise is less than 5 wpc. So even poor old Amp #3 can handle an 18 dB transient peak with ease.... and that's more than plenty.

As for sound quality... there's so much more than "power" to consider.

Sp1318,
The extra 300 wpc buys you exactly 3 dB more output headroom.

One other thing to consider, most of the amp power requirement is in the lower frequencies. With a great sub in the line-up, speakers set to "small" and crossed over to the sub at 60 Hz or so, you've handed off a significant piece of the power puzzle to the sub. Most HT owners run this way.

If, however, it is your intent to run your speakers set to "large" (and there are advocates for running this way), then maybe a bit more amp is in order.

But in any case it is the sub that is going to deliver the real HT shits and giggles to you and yours. Stuff whizzing around the room is cool, but down deep is where the real fun is.

[EricT43]

600w is not going to be much louder than 300w, but it will sound better when driven hard. In any case, I'm sure 300w will be enough to blast you out of your seats while still sounding clean.

I agree with Tour2ma. If you want to blow people away, the sub is the ticket.

[sickicw]

if you set your crossovers high (like 80hz) then you might do ok with the Outlaw amp. If you do this I would get a better sub than the SVS. I have found that when compared with a high end velodyne (or any high end sealed sub), the SVS is way too boomy. Just my opinion, but you might want to demo some subs before you buy.

[Joey_V]

if you set your crossovers high (like 80hz) then you might do ok with the Outlaw amp. If you do this I would get a better sub than the SVS. I have found that when compared with a high end velodyne (or any high end sealed sub), the SVS is way too boomy. Just my opinion, but you might want to demo some subs before you buy.

Getting a DD18 or dual DD15 would do the trick, flat response in a minute or so, with servo control on the woofers. People who've done the DD route swear by them. I hope to get a pair at a later date.

As for SVS, dont be afraid to climb up the ladder. Going for something along the lines of dual PB12+/2 or PB12U/2 would be a solid foundation.

[Toxis]

*Cough*Sunfire*Cough*Solitaire*Cough*

[Tour2ma]

LOL... and when you sneeze it probably comes out "ah shit"...

[Snagglepuss1318]

Holy Sh*t I was just reading the manual for the LSiFX and it said the sucker was 50 freakin lbs. Guess I do need to put in some supports before drywall goes up. Anyone have the dimensions of the mounting holes on the template so I can put these things in the right place?

[sickicw]

that is 50lbs for both of em. But still 25lbs is pretty heavy when you are trying to mount them.

[Snagglepuss1318]

Alright, got insulation done this weekend and met w/the drywallers. They are coming on Thursday! I need help on Sub placement still. I have to run power to where I want it but dont know where to put it yet. On the floorplan the thicker grey wall is concrete and the other is an interior wall. The interior wall I will have access to through the utility closet for me to run power at a later date. Unless i should put it by the concrete wall side. Im doing double drywall, 5/8" on bottom 1/2" on top, dont know if that will play a role in sub placement or not... Any suggestions??

[Frank Z]

Proper sub placement is something that will have to wait untill the room is done. It's not as simple as deciding where it will look the best or be the least visible, although that is important to some people. There are times when the ideal location for the best sound quality just won't cut it because of the intended layout of the room.

The easiest and way to determine placement is to put the sub in your primary listening location and then walk around the room and listen. Once you get to a place that sounds the best, that's where the sub should go.

Corner placement, if not done correctly, can make the sub sound boomy and really detract from the overall sound quality. Generally the sub should go in a the corner of the longest unbroken wall (no doors, windows) and be angled toward the center of the room.

Download and read the Polk Audio Home Theater handbook (http://www.polkaudio.com/downloads/hthandbook.pdf). It contains alot of good info.

The following link is for my sub but the placement info is universal. See page 11.
Sunfire Sub Manual (http://www.sunfire.com/pdf/True%20Subwoofer%20EQ%20Manual.pdf)

[Tour2ma]

Frank's spot on (not all that surprising really, although he's had a bad day here and there... ;) ). With no drywall at present, should you test now, your post drywall results will likely vary.

Given the uncertainties I'd suggest that you go ahead and do two or three (or four) separate runs. Up front do 2 drops, each 1/4 of the way in from their respective corners. I can't see going all the way to the rear of your long room, but maybe one around the mid point of one or both sides would be prudent as well.

At worst you'll have two or three unused wall plates/ coax runs, but will have placement flexibility and ability to add a sub (or two) down the road.

Another resource I'd tap are the SVS boys (you are going SVS, right?). I'm sure they can get you in the vacinity.

I had only one, small candidate area for my sub. It worked OK enough that use of my Pre-Pro's notch filters could smooth the most objectionable humps and bumps out of its FR curve...