Not getting enough bass on the RTi10's

[1lakerfan]

I have the Polk Audio RTi10's and love them. I have read alot of reviews on this website and many of the people say that the bass is so good you dont even need a subwoofer. When I listen to music whith just the RTi10's I dont here that much bass. Do you need good speaker wire? I am using cheap speaker at the moment. I think the guage is like a 22. I do have an excellent subwoofer (Velodyne DLS-400R) so Its not that big of a deal to me but, I just wanted to know. The RTi10's are currently hooked up to a Denon AVR-2807,I am using the Polk Audio CSi5 as the center and some 3 Onkyo speakers as my surrounds. How do I get the bass out of my speakers.

[Ern Dog]

Sounds like a set-up problem.

Are the fronts set to small or large?
What is the crossover set at?

My Rti's go pretty dang low with 220 wpc from a separate amp and quality speaker cables.

[hangon]

I had a Denon AVR-3805 hooked up to my old 10's and I was getting more bass from them than the rti12's. Then I hooked up my CineNova 300wpc amp #10 wire, and now I have more bass than the wifes china hutch can handle. You need power!!

[ben62670]

Change your speaker wire first, and then get a good 2 channel amp. Watts don't mean anything when it comes to a receiver being able to handle the currant demands of good speakers when the bass kicks in.
Welcome to Club Polk
Ben

[1lakerfan]

I had my fronts set to large but then put them back to small since it didnt seem like I was getting much bass from the speakers and it was taking away from my subwoofer. I dont really know about all the technicle stuff about home theatre but the crossover is set at 80 on my reciver. Thats what audioholics.com recommeneded. Heres the link to the pictures of my system.
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/3/297154.html

[Midnite Mick]

If you weren't getting much bass even if they were set to large you may want to double check your speaker wires. Make sure that the positives on the receiver are hooked up to the positives on the speakers. Same for negatives.

Mike

[1lakerfan]

If you weren't getting much bass even if they were set to large you may want to double check your speaker wires. Make sure that the positives on the receiver are hooked up to the positives on the speakers. Same for negatives.

Mike

There are four terminals on the back of the speakers where the speaker wire connects. I put them on the top two terminals going across leaving the gold plate under the terminals right?

[Midnite Mick]

Sure, that's fine...just make sure that the red post on receiver is hooked up to the red post on the speaker with the same individual run of wire. Same goes for black. If this is correct then it is about the best you can do for your given receiver until you get more power. You could also try and bump up the bass a few decibels if your receiver has those controls within it.

Good luck,
Mike

[dane_peterson]

You could also try using the "LFE + Mains" for subwoofer output.

[danger boy]

beyond checking the speaker connections.. also check to see if maybe your bass adjustment isn't set to - 2 or something like that.. set to zero for both bass and treble.

post a picture of your system if you can.. speaker placement can sometimes affect bass output as well.

first order though, would be to get heavier gauge speaker wire.. go for 14 guage at the minimum, 12 would be great, 10 is the largest i'd go. 12 is just right for most people.

[JeffBowser]

I have the same issue with my RTi10's. They make plenty of bass to hear, but not much bass to FEEL, which is what I want. My sub compensates nicely, but my opinion is these speakers simply do not have big enough subwoofers built in to generate really pounding bass. I will say, though, if you are using 22guage speaker wire, that's waaaay too small, you'll be current limited there...

[F1nut]

IMO, people expect too much bass when listening to music because of the over emphasis on bass from HT and the over use of subwoofers in general. The key to good music reproduction is balance, not pounding bass.

[zombie boy 2000]

I agree...
as if watts, quality over quantity any day of the week.

[Midnite Mick]

A lot of people do confuse tight, controlled bass with a lack of bass.

Mike

[surfntomm]

definitely get thicker gauge wire, 22 ga is like dental floss. my rti70's sounded infinitely better when i went from 18 ga to 12 ga on some sold shitty pioneer receiver and now they sound great with my denon. once you upgrade your wire you will love the sound im sure. good luck.

[treitz3]

When I listen to music whith just the RTi10's I dont here that much bass. How do I get the bass out of my speakers.
I have the Rti-10's and trust me when I say that there is no shortage of bass [or midbass]. Alot of it has to do with your amplifier. I have mine hooked up to a Carver M1.5t and there is absolutely no shortage of feeling the music accurately when played at performance levels. IMO you do need a sub to complete the entire spectrum of frequencies, just make sure that they are blending well [sub and speak's]. I have switched the amp out with other (lower powered, including Best buy's top of the line Denon [forgot the model #]) amps and the bass seems to dissapear a little bit [to alot], to the point where you don't feel the punch. The Rti'10s will reverb a 10x13' room quite nicely when suppied with an ample amplifier.

See if you can borrow another amp that has some accurate juice and you'll see exactly what I am talking about.

[MADGSF]

I agree with most of the above and do think you should try heavier wire. However I think your main issue is a lack of power. I recently added the amp in my signature to my system and now run my RTi-10s full range and turn off the sub for music. It helped at all volume levels and with all kinds of music.

Before with just the Elite powering them I had to use the sub if I played music which in my room would make some music sound too boomy, if that’s the right word. Now the sound is much more full, rich and stealing a term from F1 balanced.

For HT I set the sub to “Plus” and the Rti-10s to “large” and there was a positive change. I did not think for HT the change in impact would be that great since I have an Ultra sub but it hits even harder now!

[1lakerfan]

beyond checking the speaker connections.. also check to see if maybe your bass adjustment isn't set to - 2 or something like that.. set to zero for both bass and treble.

post a picture of your system if you can.. speaker placement can sometimes affect bass output as well.

first order though, would be to get heavier gauge speaker wire.. go for 14 guage at the minimum, 12 would be great, 10 is the largest i'd go. 12 is just right for most people.

Heres the link to my set up.
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/3/297154.html

what should the crossover be set at? I do know that the speaker wire that I am using is to thin but will the speaker wire make that big of a difference? I thought for the most part buying thicker speaker wire was to help make the spekaers last longer.

[1lakerfan]

can someone give me a link to a website where I can buy 12 guage speaker wire at a good price. And what type of connectors should I use?

[zombie boy 2000]

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/

[1lakerfan]

what brand of speaker wire should I buy. Everyone says that monster is a ripoff even though I am using that brand for my subwoofer.

[cfrizz]

Welcome 1LF! You were given a very good site right above your last post. These are well made cable & they won't bankrupt you.

www.bluejeanscable.com

Check them out.

[crd2002]

you are definately missing a amp cause I have the rti12 and a earthqauke cinenova7 and if I want I dont even have to use the velodyne sub there is plenty of bass coming from my speakers

[Ern Dog]

[QUOTE=what should the crossover be set at? QUOTE]

80 Hz seems to work well for most people. Run some experiments and see what sounds good to you. I've got mine set at 40hz.

Signal cable is also a quality company that makes decent cables at a good price. Plus you'll get a 5% discount if you mention that you're from Club Polk.

[MSALLA]

IMO, people expect too much bass when listening to music because of the over emphasis on bass from HT and the over use of subwoofers in general. The key to good music reproduction is balance, not pounding bass.


This is the smartest statment I have ever read about stereo by far. Car audio and rap music has also lead to the misconception about bass. It shouldn't feel like a hammer blow to your head.

[F1nut]

I do know that the speaker wire that I am using is to thin but will the speaker wire make that big of a difference? I thought for the most part buying thicker speaker wire was to help make the spekaers last longer.

You have much to learn, Grasshopper. Stick around, we'll get you on the right path.

[F1nut]

Car audio and rap music has also lead to the misconception about bass. It shouldn't feel like a hammer blow to your head.

We have a winner!

[1lakerfan]

What type of connectors should I use for the Rit10's. I am looking to buy twelve guage speaker wire. I am also going to buy the Polk Audio FXi5 surround speakers in the future, so should I also use a 12 guage.

[treitz3]

What type of connectors should I use for the Rit10's. I am looking to buy twelve guage speaker wire.Bananna style clips for the speaker end. I would recommend soldering them on -vs- screw on type deals based upon personal experience [and frustration].

[MSALLA]

I like banana clips, as far as wire goes the choices are endless. Get something you can afford. You can spen $10.00 at home depot or over $1000 from an audio wire mfg.

[JeffBowser]

Re:wire - don't let marketing departments fool you. It's all about guage when running speaker wire, not about fancy coatings and dielectrics, etc. (unless you live next door to a power plant and run your speaker wires for miles). Anyway, I reinvestigated my RTi10's last night after perusing this thread (and no, pounding bass did not originate with rap, my young posters). I discovered that my receiver cuts the output to the front speakers at 120hz, even whe I tell it I have large speakers. Deep bass was not even reaching my Polks.

[F1nut]

So Jeff, care to enlighten us as to what high end cables you have owned/tried?


(and no, pounding bass did not originate with rap, my young posters)

I'm not young, but I am curious. Where do you think it originated?

[JeffBowser]

I decline to be sucked into arguments, especially with someone at the 12k post level.

[m00npie]

I decline to be sucked into arguments, especially with someone at the 12k post level.

Who’s arguing? 1 post or 20000 posts…. Who cares! Please tell us why you think that gauge is the only importance. If you make statement like that, back it up with something other than a power plant in the back yard. Seriously, I have RTi10’s, I currently use BetterCables brand cables and I’m getting ready to purchase Audioquest Mont Blanc cables. Help me save a big wad of cash if you have something concrete to add…

[JeffBowser]

I interpreted F1's post tone (agreed, it's hard to read a tone) as negative, and it was that I was declining to get into. However, if concrete evidence is truly asked for, I can provide, as well as, I suspect, other members up here. Basically you are simply passing AC current, roughty 20hz to 20Mhz across relatively short distances. This is not a stressful environment at all, your main worry is enough copper to carry the current. I'll dig up backing research later for posting.

[tonyb]

I decline to be sucked into arguments, especially with someone at the 12k post level.

Jesse sucking people into an argument ??? Naaaaaaw.........:)

[F1nut]

If you're going to post your opinion on a matter, especially how you posted yours as all knowing, then you should expect a response such as mine and what's my post count have to do with anything?

Stating that you know music back to the late 50's does not answer the question about pounding bass. I honestly can't think of one genre that has pounding bass like rap and hip/hop do today. So please, enlighten me/us.

As for you trying every cable known to mankind, I have to call BS on that one.

A degree in EE, eh!?! Why did I know that from the moment I read your original post?

The only concrete evidence that counts is what a person hears on their set up, with their ears. Granted, not everyone can hear a difference. Perhaps it's their hearing, perhaps it's their gear or perhaps it's in their mind, I don't really know. However, other people can and do, so please don't tell me/us that it's all about gauge.

BTW, my intent wasn't to suck you into an agrument. Rather, I wanted to know more about how you arrived at your opinion, such as was it from actual experience or something else? I believe you have answered at least part of that now.

[treitz3]

Re:wire - don't let marketing departments fool you. It's all about guage when running speaker wire, not about fancy coatings and dielectrics, etc. (unless you live next door to a power plant and run your speaker wires for miles). Anyway, I reinvestigated my RTi10's last night after perusing this thread (and no, pounding bass did not originate with rap, my young posters). I discovered that my receiver cuts the output to the front speakers at 120hz, even whe I tell it I have large speakers. Deep bass was not even reaching my Polks. Um. Well....uhhh, I have less than 200 posts and I agree with F1nut, so if you want to feel comfortable, you can respond to me. You make a claim like that, and you do not have to back it up, but in the audio world such a claim is bound to get some questions. Gotta expect that.

Oh, and please don't take this as a negative reply. Take it as genuine, please.;)

[engtaz]

This is not a slamming forum. It is a info holic forum that feeds off of idea and info.

When ask to back it up it is a effort to find more information.

Boy I sound like a Borg.LOL
engtaz

[cfrizz]

Naw, you are waaay too wordy. Borg would say "EXPLAIN, COMPLY!!!":D


This is not a slamming forum. It is a info holic forum that feeds off of idea and info.

When ask to back it up it is a effort to find more information.

Boy I sound like a Borg.LOL
engtaz

[MSALLA]

Wow, haven't seen a good wire fight in a long time.:rolleyes:
Look, we like good wires, you think they are a waste. This subject is taboo on here. Tends to bunch the panties pretty fast.

[JeffBowser]

I gather quickly that the wire subject is a heated one up here. I also gather that it won't matter much what I say at all, I'm not going to convince anyone of anything. I'm only on this board to learn what I can of my new speakers, it is not my intention to bunch panties.

[jdhdiggs]

Um. Well....uhhh, I have less than 200 posts and I agree with F1nut, so if you want to feel comfortable, you can respond to me. You make a claim like that, and you do not have to back it up, but in the audio world such a claim is bound to get some questions. Gotta expect that.

Oh, and please don't take this as a negative reply. Take it as genuine, please.;)

Well, I have more than 200 posts and disagree with Jesse and agree with Jeff so there you go...

I gather quickly that the wire subject is a heated one up here. I also gather that it won't matter much what I say at all, I'm not going to convince anyone of anything. I'm only on this board to learn what I can of my new speakers, it is not my intention to bunch panties.

Exactly!

[MSALLA]

This is a grate fourm. You can (as I have ) learn alot and meet new friends. However, wires seem to be a cause for civil war on here. You can ask which ones to buy and questions like that, but never bring up "they work or don't work" the sides are split and the fights are a plenty.

[JeffBowser]

Ok, in the interest of keeping the peace, I'll leave well enough alone, but for the one or two that seemed interested in seeing something backing my claims, one article I typically use is here: http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/cable-distortion-and-dielectric-biasing-debunked Also, here is an interesting article: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_10_2/ultralink-CL414-cable-5-2003.html

All that being said, I supply the above simply for reference. Those who think otherwise, fine, not gonna affect me any.

[F1nut]

Ok, I read though Mr. Putzeys article and find little merit in it as he is all over the place. He starts off saying, "Recently I've done a collection of measurements and tests on interconnect cables to see what I could find that would explain the sonic differences that many people, including myself, have grown accustomed to hearing." and then talks about condenser microphones, which I find odd as I thought his focus was on IC's for home audio. He then goes off on a tangent about balanced cables and concludes with, "to make cables disappear from the sonic equation, all that is needed is balanced transmission combined with sub-1ohm output impedance line drivers. I would like to propose this as a standard for audiophile equipment makers.

It shows that people who claim that cables do not make a difference are plainly deluding themselves. On the other hand, those that say that cables should not make a difference, are dead right."

HUH??? All it shows me is that he has no idea what the hell he's talking about. The obvious contridiction between his opening comment and his conclusion are enough to dismiss the article outright.

[ohskigod]

I'm friends with an engineer who for many reason engineers say, cables shouldnt make a difference. He has yet to find out why his guitar amp sounds different depending on where he plugs it in. I tell him not to think about it much, just accept the differences and plan accordingly

I hear differences in interconnects and speaker cables. not huge of course, they are subtle.

[JeffBowser]

OK, I ran a search on this very forum about wires, something I should have done before I commented. I see this has been a pretty touchy subject. F1nut, it is obvious to me you desire an argument, and with a newbie to the forum to boot. I respectfully decline, your tone and attitude, inasmuch as I can gather from words alone, is one of antagonism and closed-mindedness. Cheers.

[strider]

OK, I ran a search on this very forum about wires, something I should have done before I commented. I see this has been a pretty touchy subject. F1nut, it is obvious to me you desire an argument, and with a newbie to the forum to boot. I respectfully decline, your tone and attitude, inasmuch as I can gather from words alone, is one of antagonism and closed-mindedness. Cheers.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[1lakerfan]

I have my subwofers low pass crossover set to direct and the switch on the back that says high-pass crossover is set to 80 HZ. Is there anything I should change on the subwoofer (Velodyne DLS4000R).

[F1nut]

OK, I ran a search on this very forum about wires, something I should have done before I commented. I see this has been a pretty touchy subject. F1nut, it is obvious to me you desire an argument, and with a newbie to the forum to boot. I respectfully decline, your tone and attitude, inasmuch as I can gather from words alone, is one of antagonism and closed-mindedness. Cheers.

Gee, I thought we were having a discussion. I quess if I disagree with your opinion or shoot holes in examples you provide, which by the way you still haven't answered some of the questions asked of you, then you view it as an agrument. So, who's the antagonist with the closed mind?

Good luck to you, sir.

[1lakerfan]

I have my subwofers low pass crossover set to direct and the switch on the back that says high-pass crossover is set to 80 HZ. Is there anything I should change on the subwoofer (Velodyne DLS4000R).

Also I am going to buy 12 gauge speaker wire should I use 12 guage on the surround speakers also.

[Ron Temple]

I have my subwofers low pass crossover set to direct and the switch on the back that says high-pass crossover is set to 80 HZ. Is there anything I should change on the subwoofer (Velodyne DLS4000R).

Also I am going to buy 12 gauge speaker wire should I use 12 guage on the surround speakers also.I'm not familiar with the DLSR sub, but you should let your AVR handle the crossover...set the speakers to small and crossover to 60hz. On the sub either disable the crossover if there's a bypass switch or turn it all the way up.

12 guage wire will be fine for your surrounds.

[1lakerfan]

Alright I just got some 12 guage wire with the Gold Plated Locking Banana plugs from bluejeanscables.com. I unscrewed the set screws put the wire through the banana plug and wanted to know do I tighten the set screws on the insulation on the insulation or the copper wire or both? Here is the link to the instructions.
http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/Speaker_cable_termination.pdf

[1lakerfan]

I connected the speaker wire to my speakers and seen much improvement in my bass and it mesh my subwoofer with the speakers alot better.

thanks for the advice

[BigA524]

I just bought the rti10s and a new onkyo 105wpc..is it necessary to buy a amp for these? Can the reciever handle these speakers without any problems? So I take it 16g wire isnt enough either?

[danger boy]

your Onkyo should do ok. it's up to you if you want to add an amp.. adding and amp will give you more clarity and depth and sound to your speakers.. that's why alot of people add amps.

betting to used 14 guage wire or even 12 then 16 guage.