Talk about bright speakers; my maggie 1.6QR's gotta go [Archive]

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 01:58 PM

I knew all along that they were bright but they sound great with vinyl and classical so I kept them. I added a tube pre and tube cdp and that helped a little. I put on Yes, Extended Versions cd yesterday which is kind of a bright cd to begin with and that may have convinced me.

I'll keep them until I can find some 1C's or SRS 2's to replace them which probably won't be anytime soon.

I might consider trading them even up for 1c's or srs 2's even tho the 1.6's are worth twice as much.

It is what it is :)

TroyD

03-19-2008, 03:38 PM

If you think the SL2000 is ok and the maggies are bright you need your hearing checked AND your head examined.

Ricardo

03-19-2008, 03:45 PM

If they are bright, why not solder some capacitors to them? I've heard they make wonders.

ShinAce

03-19-2008, 03:46 PM

Coil hater!

Sami

03-19-2008, 03:51 PM

I might consider trading them even up for 1c's or srs 2's even tho the 1.6's are worth twice as much.
When do we do this? :)

dkg999

03-19-2008, 03:54 PM

or put the resistors that came with them in the tweeter connections! I also wonder if you have your Maggies totally broken in? The Magnepan tweeters take several hundred hours to fully break in. I have had mine for close to two years and I would consider them just getting broken in.

Are you running any silver IC's or speaker cables? Those aren't a good match for Magnepans with their emphasis of the high-end.

My 1.6's are detailed on the high-end, but have ultru-smooth highs that aren't fatiguing at all. I've heard a lot of speakers I would consider "brighter" than the 1.6's, including any speaker with the SL2000 in it!

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 03:55 PM

When do we do this? :)

Are yours stock and/or have the sl2000's?

Sami

03-19-2008, 04:00 PM

Stock.

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 04:25 PM

Stock.

I've been hoping to find some 1c's or srs 2's locally but maybe a halfway point swap is do-able. I'll do some more listening and see if I have the resistors to play with. I'm running single strand solid core 10 ga romex to them. Bi-amped with 2 carver tfm-45s, cj pv-7 pre with tf, ah! 4000 tube cdp with tf so I'm running the warmest equipment that I can afford :)

I listen to mostly jazz, classical and vinyl which all sound pretty good on them.

They are several years old so they should be broken in as I bought them used.

zingo

03-19-2008, 04:35 PM

I agree, the tweeters on my monitors seem to be a little bright as well...

dkg999

03-19-2008, 04:39 PM

Poee7R

03-19-2008, 05:10 PM

I agree, the tweeters on my monitors seem to be a little bright as well...

Haha, thats great.

Dave

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 05:51 PM

The Carver amps are your problem IMHO. I've never heard a Carver powered Magnepan that sounded good. A recent listening session with Carver amps reinforced to me why they don't sound good with Magnepan's.

That is probably the case since you have more experience and have done more testing than I have. In that case, the maggies have to go :)

The carvers ain't goin nowhere ;)

marvda1

03-19-2008, 06:23 PM

candy, could you list your entire system including interconnects (where they are located in the setup if you have different brands,models), speaker cables, and brief description of your room.

SolidSqual

03-19-2008, 06:36 PM

Kill the carvers. Get more musical amps.

dkg999

03-19-2008, 06:45 PM

Kill the carvers. Get more musical amps.

Totally agree! The Carvers are way too analytical for the Magnepans. If you like the sound of the Carvers, then you should get different speakers to mate with them.

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 06:56 PM

dkg999

03-19-2008, 07:07 PM

I see another part of the problem! You need more room for them to breathe behind the speaker! At least 24" to 30" (30" prefered). Magnepan's don't like to be closed in with stuff around them.

I am agreeing with you that the Magnepans might not be the best speaker choice for your room. I would put them on Agon, as they'll sell for $1100 to $1300 easily and you can get a nice pair of SDA's if that's what floats your boat!

madmax

03-19-2008, 11:22 PM

Oh, now I see the problem. Turn the chair around so you are facing the speakers. :)
madmax

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 11:26 PM

dorokusai

03-19-2008, 11:30 PM

Room is 14.5' wide x 17' long with cathedral ceiling

Speakers are 5' apart from inner edge of each other. About 20" away from back wall and a good 24" from both side walls.

Bi-amped: tfm-45 & tfm-42
Pre: cj pv-7 with all tf
cdp: ah! 4000 with tf e88cc
all aq king cobra ic's
solid core single strand 10 ga romex speaker wire

That's not the worst Magnepan setup I've seen but its close. You should sell them......you're not ready for that level of audio.

I'm questioning why you have taken a fancy to "modifying" crossovers, yet you have zero idea on how to properly setup a loudspeaker. Most of us have imperfect listening areas but that placement is just silly. You can read the owners manual and figure that out.

Sell the Magnepan.

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 11:32 PM

Oh, now I see the problem. Turn the chair around so you are facing the speakers. :)
madmax

I should have seen that coming :)

Actually these have a soundstage that rivals the sdas which fills my small house up with music so I don't usually sit in front of them. I usually on the puter or watching tv (closed caption) while the music is playing.

madmax

03-19-2008, 11:41 PM

For what its worth I've noticed large speakers in a small room suck for backround music. If you play them while moving around something a lot smaller could work out better.
madmax

SolidSqual

03-19-2008, 11:44 PM

Man, that photo makes my ears hurt. How could you do that to such nice speakers?

candyliquor35m

03-19-2008, 11:50 PM

Man, that photo makes my ears hurt. How could you do that to such nice speakers?

That's what happens when I live in a 1074 sq ft house. My friends make fun of it because everything is so cramped but I do what I want until I have a WAF to deal with.

dorokusai

03-19-2008, 11:52 PM

You should stick to monkey coffins.

SolidSqual

03-19-2008, 11:56 PM

That's what happens when I live in a 1074 sq ft house. My friends make fun of it because everything is so cramped but I do what I want until I have a WAF to deal with.

Screw the WAF factor. You've likely never heard good sound with a mess like that.

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 12:10 AM

I've been quite happy with them until I threw in the Yes cd the other day. I do get used to the warm sound of the polks with tubes and carvers so that spoils me and it's quite a shock sometimes when I turn on the maggies.

TroyD

03-20-2008, 01:27 AM

JHC....Dorokusai nailed it.

If you can't read a manual, you have NO business opening up a speaker.

BDT

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 01:35 AM

Hello I didn't get a manual with them. The seller says he mailed it but I never got it.

dorokusai

03-20-2008, 01:46 AM

Hello I didn't get a manual with them. The seller says he mailed it but I never got it.

Again....you're a loudspeaker "rebel" and yet you can't find this?....it took 4.5 seconds.....with zero attenuation.

http://www.magnepan.com/product_manuals

dragon1952

03-20-2008, 01:59 AM

I've been quite happy with them until I threw in the Yes cd the other day.

Maybe you need to chuck the Yes CD.

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 02:02 AM

Again....you're a loudspeaker "rebel" and yet you can't find this?....it took 4.5 seconds.....with zero attenuation.

http://www.magnepan.com/product_manuals

much obliged.

TroyD

03-20-2008, 08:01 AM

Ok, if you aren't bright enough to obtain a manual or read any of the plethora of reviews that detail the setup of a dipole in particular and a maggie in specific....then you shouldn't be allowed to own a pair.

Lame excuse, that's no better than the dog ate my homework.

Do you WONDER why no one takes you seriously??

BDT

Sami

03-20-2008, 12:05 PM

All this hostility over a modified tweeter?

dkg999

03-20-2008, 12:15 PM

Where did the modified tweeter come from? I thought this was over the setup and placement of his Magnepans?

Sami

03-20-2008, 12:25 PM

Where did the modified tweeter come from? I thought this was over the setup and placement of his Magnepans?

Well, it seems (to me) like the "SL2000WC" debate is carrying over to this thread. I could be wrong, that's why it really was a question. Could be just the usual roughness of Club Polk talk...

SolidSqual

03-20-2008, 12:51 PM

Or could be some guy with excellent speakers using them like crap. He's probably the same guy who chugs a 50 year old brandy.

honda cber

03-20-2008, 01:04 PM

Or could be some guy with excellent speakers using them like crap. He's probably the same guy who chugs a 50 year old brandy.
ha... quite a way to put it. i have certainly known a handful of folks that i could say similar things about. i mean, i witnessed (and partook with disgust, lol) a genuine romeo y julieta being split open for a blunt skin. how many crimes were committed that night?

a

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 01:11 PM

I found the resistors last night and hope to try them today. A 1.0 ohm pair and a 1.2 pair.

One speaker at a time tho so I can do a side by side comparison.

dkg999

03-20-2008, 01:28 PM

I found the resistors last night and hope to try them today. A 1.0 ohm pair and a 1.2 pair.

One speaker at a time tho so I can do a side by side comparison.

That would mean you would need to run mono to both speakers. Stereo means that the sound from each speaker is different, which would invalidate an apples-to-apples comparison.

SolidSqual

03-20-2008, 01:38 PM

somebody shoot me. this is like a med student operating on a heart before learning where all the blood goes to in the first place.

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 01:38 PM

That would be the norm but when comparing tweeters I can get by with stereo since I'm mostly worried about harshness as opposed to soundstage, depth, separation, etc. And when comparing tweeters I don't listen in the middle. I walk back and forth between the speakers and listen to them one at a time.

dkg999

03-20-2008, 01:54 PM

Well then by all means go ahead with your eval! Let us know what you think after you do.

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 01:57 PM

Has anyone used the resistors when you're bi-amping? The manual doesn't touch on that. Maybe for testing I won't bi-amp.

Yashu

03-20-2008, 02:01 PM

If you think the SL2000 is ok and the maggies are bright you need your hearing checked AND your head examined.

Hehe... Troy, I hate to agree with you, but you are right. The maggies are great speakers, and I wonder if the problem is not somewhere else in the chain, or, room modes.

BTW, I have most of Yes's 70s work on vinyl, and I have to say, it sound great, even my CD copy of Fragile sounds smooth, so it may be a crappy digital "remastering" where they just compress things to push the dynamic range, but you end up with a bright, or more truthfully, a noisier HF band that gives the perception of bright.

dkg999

03-20-2008, 02:17 PM

I have the recent MoFi CD release of Yes-Fragile, and it sounds fantastic on my Magnepan 1.6's. I also have the Yes boxed CD set from years ago and it sounds fantastic also.

Too many variables in the chain of components and room to offer quick fixes. Buy a set of monkey-coffins and be happy!

obieone

03-20-2008, 06:37 PM

Um....NOT a guru, but these speakers are, IMHO, 'Sweet spot only' speakers.
If you don't have them set up correctly, and are in the right spot, they're gonna sound 'out of balance'.
By out of balance I mean the highs, mids, lows. Not L/R.
And all the resistors in the world ain't gonna help.
If you're looking for 'walk around speakers', these ain't them.

dkg999

03-20-2008, 06:41 PM

Um....NOT a guru, but these speakers are, IMHO, 'Sweet spot only' speakers.
If you don't have them set up correctly, and are in the right spot, they're gonna sound 'out of balance'.
And all the resistors in the world ain't gonna help.
If you're looking for 'walk around speakers', these ain't them.

Have you owned them? Mine are not in the best placement at all currently, and they have a very wide sweet spot. I have found most of the comments on narrow sweet spot to be not based upon experience. Every speaker in every room has that one "golden" spot. My Magnepans are very listenable over a wide range of listening positions. The key with Magnepans is to give them some breathing room around them.

obieone

03-20-2008, 06:59 PM

No, I haven't owned them, but just from the 20-30 minutes of listening to them, and getting up from the spot I was sitting in, I lost something in the sound-don't remember which. I wasn't trashing the speakers, just trying to aleviate some frustraion IF he's expecting different results from these type of speakers.

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 07:40 PM

Preliminary results: high fives to everyone and beers for everyone on me at the new hooters in katy.

The 1.2 resistors weren't strong enough but the 2.0's seem to be a good compromise so now I can listen to a little rock now.

The sacd I just got from stubby is nice and warm sounding with no hint of brightness.

Yes: Extended Versions was edgy but not bright but that's r&r for ya.

Thanks to everyone for the constructive comments.

Those that made derogatory comments will have to solve your own personal problems.

Face

03-20-2008, 08:27 PM

You need to have your hearing checked.

SolidSqual

03-20-2008, 09:13 PM

One thing . . . every speaker has a sweet spot . . . PERIOD! You can't change the laws of physics. In the center is the only place to listen critically. Anything you hear about wider sweet spot is crap. Unless you can make water into wine, the only place your 2 channel system will ever sound best is at the point of a triangle equidistant to the speakers.

sucks2beme

03-20-2008, 10:01 PM

:DOutstanding. Candyliquor got help, improved his setup.
Although there were some harsh words, no one lost it and got banned.

Bad news, no one got a great deal on 1.6's.

Oh well. Enjoy your Maggies. :D

candyliquor35m

03-20-2008, 11:09 PM

Thanks. They sound like speakers I've never heard before. I'll be listening to quite a few cds in the next few days to see how they sound on my new speakers :)

heiney9

03-21-2008, 01:32 AM

Why don't you try sticking the caps or resistor in your ear (one at a time of course) that way no matter what speaker you listen to it won't be bright and harsh. :rolleyes:

H9

candyliquor35m

03-21-2008, 01:55 AM

hmmm I wonder why magnepan includes resistors with their speakers. Maybe because this is how ppl have been fine tuning their speakers to their own personal taste for decades.

And it's being done in place of the jumper on the back of the speaker instead of at the x-over.

Those idiots at magnepan are some crazy mofos for sure.

F1nut

03-21-2008, 02:07 AM

No sh!t Sherlock! What have been we telling you all this time? You use resistors for high frequency tuning, not caps. Duh!

candyliquor35m

03-21-2008, 02:10 AM

SDA's are not maggies. Your comments mean nothing until you try the caps.

F1nut

03-21-2008, 02:13 AM

You're a moron. I don't have to try it to know what it's doing. It's not rocket science, it's basic speaker design.

Face

03-21-2008, 02:24 AM

http://www.partsexpress.com/imageslarge/500-035L.jpg
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=500-035

jakelm

03-21-2008, 02:29 AM

Am I reading this thread right?? We are modding Maggies now??? Adding resistors to Magnepans?

candyliquor35m

03-21-2008, 02:32 AM

You're a moron. I don't have to try it to know what it's doing. It's not rocket science, it's basic speaker design.

This thread isn't about caps. If you wanna talk about caps, start your own thread.

F1nut

03-21-2008, 02:36 AM

Please re-read the first sentence of my post that you quoted.

I'm done with this one.

candyliquor35m

03-21-2008, 02:38 AM

No comment. This thread isn't about caps.

cmy330go

03-21-2008, 03:55 AM

Normally I'm all for spending money on Audio, but damn, you might consider spending some on new furniture.:eek:

candyliquor35m

03-21-2008, 11:10 AM

Normally I'm all for spending money on Audio, but damn, you might consider spending some on new furniture.:eek:

No comment. This thread isn't about furniture :D

jdhdiggs

03-21-2008, 01:20 PM

CL, glad you had some luck. Here's another, and I think better, way to tune your maggies: Active bi-amp. Get a RCA splitter and some inline crossovers and then put a real tube amp on the treble side and take the resistors out and give that a try.

Oh, and caps don't do squat to tweets! :p

ShinAce

03-21-2008, 01:50 PM

candyliquor35m

03-26-2008, 01:35 PM

These magnepan supplied resistors really transformed my 1.6qr's into everything I hoped for. No more harsh, bright, digital sounding speakers. Very warm, rich and full now.

Thanks to dkg999 for the suggestion: http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showpost.php?p=825696&postcount=6