Anybody listen at reference level? [Archive]

organ

11-16-2008, 08:51 PM

wingnut4772

11-16-2008, 09:02 PM

Awsome! Glad you are happy. I usually listen at about -10 to -12 under reference.

Polkitup2

11-16-2008, 09:04 PM

Not me, "0" on my AVR is calibrated to 75 DB and I listen at -15 with the sub a couple DBs hot. Seems plenty loud to me. Any louder and most people I watch movies with seem to get uncomfortable.

mantis

11-16-2008, 10:13 PM

Hey all,
Just wondering if anybody here listen to their HT at reference level?

I find it really loud but it's the closest I"ve ever come to a good movie theater. I'm going to play around with the X-Curve setting and see if it will make it more tolerable. The THX Cinema processing sounds really good.

So far, I find the -10db setting on the volume to be the most comfortable with appropriate levels in loud passages.

edit: Wanted to post this on the Pioneer Elite thread but I it's too far back now. So once again, I want to thank Dan and the other members who helped me out.
I got the Pioneer Elite VSX-01TXH last week and I"m soooooo lovin' it! Running 4.1 right now and I"m getting my center 2morrow yay!

You are very welcome. Glad to hear your digging that awesome receiver. It has a warmth to it. But in the same breath a beautiful amount of dynamic range for a receiver at that price point. Very hard to beat which I don't think it can. The Ipod interface is a bit dated which I thought they where going to upgrade it as it's on the front now with USB connection instead of a rear connection. I don't think it does video over Ipod as well. I tried with a few things I had on my iphone and Ipod and It didn't come up in the Ipod menu. But who cares it does everything else.

I don't watch movies at reference. Hardly never. For demoing or something for a few minutes to blow up my house.

Kex

11-17-2008, 01:08 AM

I used to watch movies about 10db below reference, and music about 5-10dB below that, but since I got my new NAD, a few weeks ago, I almost always listen to movies at reference level. Music, about 5-10dB below reference (sometimes lower, if I want to be able to converse with somebody at the same time). It just doesn't seem that loud any more. The sound is powerful, and you cannot really speak over loud parts of the movie, but it does not seem noisy or uncomfortable at all. It's incredible, and I am enjoying listening to movies that I have already seen all over again ... The NAD has really surprised me on that score ... there is just so much extra, without the impression of excessive loudness or noise.

Lowell_M

11-17-2008, 01:14 AM

I'm sorry...i can't hear you.....i listen to my HT:eek::D:cool: at referrence levels!!!!!

mmadden28

11-17-2008, 01:45 AM

I'm sorry, a_mattison, what did you say? I couldn't hear you, its too loud in here. Can you please repeat?

;)

ben62670

11-17-2008, 02:10 AM

I like explosions to be at least 120db

Edit: BTW a shotgun blast is 130db;)

Face

11-17-2008, 02:25 AM

Only for short periods of time. I'd like to enjoy listening to tunes for a very long time to come.

Lasareath

11-17-2008, 02:59 AM

http://38.161.195.8/Huh.jpg

......

Ron Temple

11-17-2008, 03:49 AM

Normally between -10 to -5, but the other night we had some friends over and watched Iron Man BD at reference. The dialog was perfect and the FX and LFE were pretty astounding.

McLoki

11-17-2008, 08:38 AM

mmadden28

11-17-2008, 02:17 PM

I'm going to setup an emergency CD. And hang a button aorund my neck.
When I collapse because of cardiac arrest, I'll press the button, then the system will kick on and play the CD. It will play some specially designed tracks that will cause some immese sound waves to do chest compressions on me and force air into my lungs at just the right timing and intervals.
:rolleyes::cool::D

Kex

11-17-2008, 02:26 PM

I am pretty sure my system could play at reference, but damn is that loud.... Most moves for me are -12 to -18 (depending on if I am alone or the wife is home... :) )

I have done some demos at -5 and found it sounding great - but needlessly loud. (only so much detail you can get out of a SD DTS track....)Well, I guess we need to be clear on what we mean by listening at reference level. Here is what I mean when I say I listen at reference level:

- System calibrated manually to 85dB at the 0dB setting on the volume knob.
- Volume knob set at 0dB when watching movies.

When I spent a few minutes measuring under those conditions, explosions and similar loud passages would be in the 90 something to 110 range, but, that is using the C weighting. According to the RS meter manual:

C-weighting has C-curve (flat) frequency characteristics. This setting casues the meter to respond mainly to frequencies in the 32 to 10,000Hz range. Select C-weighting to measure sound levels of musical material.

A-weighting has A-curve frequency characteristics. This setting causes the meter to respond mainly to frequencies in the the 500 to 10,000Hz range, which is the human ear's most sensitive range. Select A-weighting to determine an area's noise level.

If I measure my listening with the A weighting, the values recorded by the meter are significantly lower than with the C weighting, and peaks are not nearly as pronounced. So, with the that in mind, when I watch movies "at reference level", it is possible to converse during a lot of the movie, but not during louder portions, such as a spaceship passing overhead etc. (but then, who would expect to be heard over a spaceship?!). I also find that, with my new receiver, the movie will frequently not sound loud at all, until you try to speak to somebody, and then it's like trying to talk when somebody else is already speaking right next to you.

This also seems to be a safe listening level, according to http://www.sightandhearing.org/soundcenter/nihl.asp. Some extracts:

The maximum exposure time for unprotected ears per day at 90 dB is 8 hours. For every 5 dB increase in volume, the maximum exposure time is cut in half.

- 95 dB = 4 hours
- 100 dB = 2 hours
- 110 dB = 30 minutes
- 120 dB = 7.5 minutes

Some common sources of loud sounds:

- Lawn mower: 90 dB
- Snowmobile: 100 dB
- Car horn: 110 dB
- Baby's cry: 115 dB
- Rock concert: 115-120 dB
- Farm implements: 90-110 dB
- Firearms: 125-140 dB
- stereo headphones: 105-110 dB

And another fun fact:

Hearing damaged by noise is permanently lost and cannot be repaired. Hearing aids amplify sound for remaining hearing, but they do not fix hearing like eye glasses fix vision.

It doesn't matter whether you like the sounds you are exposed to. An orchestra playing Mozart at 120 dB will damage your hearing as quickly as Metallica playing at 120 dB.

Mike Kozak

11-17-2008, 02:33 PM

how can I calibrate my Onkyo to play louder? It only gets loud at the extreme volume setting, just does not seem tight to me

organ

11-17-2008, 02:33 PM

Dan,
I agree. I didn't expect this much dynamics from a receiver. Also, it sounds pretty good with music.

I LOVE the auto MCACC feature. I find that using the "adj. all speakers" setting is best where each speaker is equalized to produce a flat response in the given room. It took care of some standing bass issues as well.

Before getting this receiver, I always thought THX was pure hype. But I don't know what it is, it sounds much better for me with the THX Cinema processing engaged. More body to the sound and much better envelopment. Same goes with the THX Games setting when I play my PS3 (also my blu ray source).

The RF-35's are vikings at HT. They just blast. I couldn't find any dealer with leftover RC-35's so I'm getting the RC-62 which according to a shop I called is an improved version of the RC-35 and a direct replacement.

OK back to the reference level setting. For those who think I can't hear, I haven't watched an entire movie at reference level. I only tried it a few times on movie trailers and a few action scenes. Not even 10 minutes. Like I said, I watch at -10db but usually back it off to -12 or -15 as the movie goes on.

The intro in AVP:R is pure aggression! DTS:MA is super dynamic, I could't believe it.

Mike Kozak

11-17-2008, 02:34 PM

I meant right, not tight

mmadden28

11-17-2008, 02:51 PM

...
- Baby's cry: 115 dB
....

Is that serious??
No wonder I about went out of my mind. I even had over the ear hearing prtection on (that I use with my chainsaw) an at the same time had the foam plugs in --double protection, and the cries still pierced right through :eek::(

Kex

11-17-2008, 02:58 PM

Is that serious??
No wonder I about went out of my mind. I even had over the ear hearing prtection on (that I use with my chainsaw) an at the same time had the foam plugs in --double protection, and the cries still pierced right through :eek::(
I know! I had the same reaction when I saw that! :p

zingo

11-17-2008, 03:16 PM

My system just has an analog knob on it. I don't get to enjoy "reference". :(:p:(

polktiger

11-17-2008, 03:54 PM

Well, I guess we need to be clear on what we mean by listening at reference level. Here is what I mean when I say I listen at reference level:

- System calibrated manually to 85dB at the 0dB setting on the volume knob.
- Volume knob set at 0dB when watching movies.

Is this the same for all systems? I thought I read from my Yamaha manual that its YPAO would calibate to THX settings which for that reciver would be 75db at -27.5 on the volume control.

Regardless, we usually listen to movies between 65db - 70db. Anymore it seems like most of the movies we watch are dialogue intensive, and any louder than that and it seems like the actors are yelling at you instead of talking to you.

nikolas812

11-17-2008, 05:41 PM

0 is reference level on my receiver. Which translates to 85db.

I usually watch movies are -10 on the receiver. Which translates to 75db...

Sounds the best too me at this level.... Reference is a little to loud for most material.....

Nick

wallstreet

11-17-2008, 06:13 PM

how can I calibrate my Onkyo to play louder? It only gets loud at the extreme volume setting, just does not seem tight to me

Not much you can do here. Buy more efficient speakers which will play louder given a constant input or buy a more powerful amplifier.

I normally listen -15 below reference. 0 is just too damn loud with 7 speakers and 1 sub.

McLoki

11-17-2008, 11:03 PM

Well, I guess we need to be clear on what we mean by listening at reference level. Here is what I mean when I say I listen at reference level: <Snip>

Ok - belive it or not, I know what reference level is... :)

It is a dolby standard that defines an average volume level of 85db per channel and 105db peaks. All speakers should be set to small and crossed over to your subwoofer at 80hz. Due to this, your subwoofer will experience 115db peaks.

All of these number (105db from all speakers but sub, 115db from sub) are based on your listening position, not the 1meter typically mentioned for efficiency. I sit about 12' - 14' back from my speakers meaning that at 1 meter I need to add about 6db to those totals.

(111db from all speakers but the sub and that will need 121db)

For my LSi's (88db efficient 1watt\1meter) to hit 111db will require 256 clean watts. (no problem with my Cinepro - I should be able to hit 118db peaks with a clean 1024watts for a short term - provided my speakers don't burn up in the process) My main concern is with my subwoofers. I know on the darla tap test (in finding Nemo) I bottomed the sub at about 113db when I just had one. My subs are close enough together, I should get an additional 6db due to co-location, but that will only get me to 119db, still a little shy of the required 121db it will have to be able to hit.

I need to add more subs (or more capable ones) in order to survive reference level on a dolby digital action movie track. (Where stuff blows up - I am sure I will be fine playing terms of endearment REALLY LOUD)

Also keep in mind this is only for dolby tracks. DTS tracks are often 3-6db hotter than the Dolby tracks on the same movie so will be even harder to hit reference on without clipping the hell out of everything (i.e. you better have close to 1,000wpc peaks to do it and some really serious subwoofers - a pair (or quad) of SVS ultras or conquests should do it)

The reason you calibrate your system to 75db (using Video Essentials) or 85db (using Avia) is because the tracks you are using to set reference level is 30 or or 20db under reference (105db).

For your calibrations, you will want to use C-Weighted (and it says so in your manual for video essentials and Avia), because much of your volume will be coming from bass.

Michael

Kex

11-17-2008, 11:53 PM

Ok - belive it or not, I know what reference level is... :) ...I knew that you knew that, but did you know that I knew that you knew :eek: ? I was just trying to make sure we were all talking about the same thing, and that I had understood myself.

Anyway, my point in my previous post was, if I calibrate to 85dB on C-weighting, using pink noise (not Avia, just test tones, but I don't think it changes much on my system either way), then when I play a movie with the volume knob still at 0, I'm not actually listening at 85dB with A-weighting. Even with C-weighting, I will dip below 80dB (with peaks between 90dB and 110dB, depending on the movie, and what type of action is being portrayed). I can't imagine watching a movie at 85dB with no explosions, as measured by A-weighting, which, as previously stated, is more appropriate for measuring what the ear actually hears. As for music, I don't think I ever even peak in the triple digits under normal listening circumstances.

What I was hoping somebody might comment on is how do you actually measure reference level, officially? A-weighting or C-weighting? Pink noise or dialogue? If it's A-weighting, I'm not interested. If it's 85dB dialogue (raised voices excepted), I'm still not interested.

With each channel calibrated with pink noise, to 85dB C-weighting, with the volume knob set at 0, I will listen to movies at that level most of the time (volume knob at 0dB) and think it's great! Music 5-10dB lower. That would probably not equate to an 85dB average, A-weighted.

Does this make any sense?

McLoki

11-18-2008, 12:03 AM

You measure reference level with C-Weighting using a calibrated test disk. (Avia or Video Essentials)

For Avia - tones are 20db under reference so with volume at 0, calibrate to 85db.

For Video Essentials - tones are at 30db under reference so with volume at 0, calibrate to 75db.

The volumes I mention for the different channels (85db average with 105db peaks) are just that averages and peaks. There will be plenty of sounds under 85db (and a few peaks at 105db or under - they are just not supposed to exceed 105db). Like I said - DTS is often 5 or 6db hot from those numbers, especially in the bass tracks.

Using the built in test tones in an AVR will calibrate to the same thing - it just depends on the manufacturer whether they use 20 or 30db under reference for their test tones.

Music does not follow any reference level (unless it is a DVD recorded in Dolby Digital)- so it could be way louder or quieter than a movie on a calibrated system.

danger boy

11-18-2008, 02:22 AM

how loud is reference level? is it different for everyone? Is reference level equal to say 95db? I am so lost here.

brody05

11-18-2008, 04:53 AM

I used to be in the LIKE IT LOUD CLUB but as I got a bit older and some would even say a little wiser I have come to respect the -15 range, in saying that though I do like the odd flutter at 00 with some music in two channel but not for too long.:eek: Not to mention I dont get much chance by myself so hang out for the next time the wife and kid are out.

It is not the level and loudness in hearing loss it is the frequency range more specifically the lows and highs are the first to go...... I want to be able to enjoy the full range for longer.

It was hard at first but in increments of -3 to -5 over a month or more and I adjusted, now when I do go to 00 it is LOUD and I am all too aware of my ears being damaged so it is not for long, a quick fix for the loud junkie....:cool:

I set 00 to 80 Db on the test tone but the rest of my settings are done by ear and to what I like, I have my crossover set at 70hz in the front and 65 hz in the rear not the industry standard 80hz. I know the 65 is low for the rears but the 3000's just dont like that 65 to 80 range and the sides pick up the slightest of drop off in the sine wave sweep but it sounds great and thats all that matters......

Lasareath

11-18-2008, 05:16 AM

how loud is reference level? is it different for everyone? Is reference level equal to say 95db? I am so lost here.

My Reference level is a tad below the level where my downstairs neighbors will start complaining ;)

Kex

11-18-2008, 12:44 PM

how loud is reference level? is it different for everyone? Is reference level equal to say 95db? I am so lost here.
I thought McLoki's post gave a good expanation. The C.W. usually mentions 85dB. The confusion for me is between what happens during calibration vs. what happens after calibration, during actual listening.

I don't like things loud, as brody05 mentioned. I like them to sound real, if that makes any sense. If a piano is playing in the room, a piano is playing in the room: I don't like it turned down so that I can talk over it. If a spaceship, or jet passes overhead, I don't expect to be able to talk and say "how cool is that!" at the same time.

kuntasensei

11-18-2008, 01:07 PM

You measure reference level with C-Weighting using a calibrated test disk. (Avia or Video Essentials)

For Avia - tones are 20db under reference so with volume at 0, calibrate to 85db.

For Video Essentials - tones are at 30db under reference so with volume at 0, calibrate to 75db.

Two caveats here:

1) It's a known issue that the C-weighting curve causes proper subwoofer calibration with Avia to actually read 83dB when all other channels are at 85dB with volume set to reference level. This is not due to any problem with the SPL meter itself so much as the nature of C-weighting with low frequencies. I've verified Avia digitally by extracting the tones and running them through frequency analysis, and this is confirmed.

2) If we're talking Digital Video Essentials, don't use the DVD version to calibrate your system. ALL of its speaker tones are incorrect. The "75dB" tones are actually more like 73dB and the subwoofer tone is off by 10dB (though it will show as a 7dB inaccuracy on a C-weighted meter).

And I have to say: Don't get caught up in the numbers. Reference level is just so you know where the reference is. If you're using an absolute volume scale or just don't care that 0 relative = reference, just make all the channels match and you're good.

McLoki

11-18-2008, 01:38 PM

I set all channels with a spl meter based on the dvd. The deviation from that I do is to play familiar music after I am done and ajust the sub up or down to make it sound right to me.

Kex

11-18-2008, 01:50 PM

... Don't get caught up in the numbers. Reference level is just so you know where the reference is. If you're using an absolute volume scale or just don't care that 0 relative = reference, just make all the channels match and you're good.
Agreed! I just find it convenient to calibrate the test tones to 0 on the volume knob with the NAD (I didn't bother with the h/k, since it adjusts the sound levels first, when it starts EzSet/EQ). This is more so that I make sure I don't play above reference, so that I don't inadvertenly play loud enough to cause hearing impairment (it's easy enough to do when you get enveloped in the music). I do notice a lot of extra detail in movies with my NAD receiver when played at, or within 5-10dB of reference. With the h/k, I found it useful to at least know where reference level was, approximately, to avoid the possibility of any accidental clipping or distortion.

Once I've calibrated all the channels so they are balanced, I just stick to 0dB to -5dB for movies, and varying levels for music, usually at or below -5dB, depending on the occasion and/or atmosphere. I do not currently crossover at 80Hz, even if that may be a part of the "reference" setting.

Sherardp

11-19-2008, 11:39 AM

Awsome! Glad you are happy. I usually listen at about -10 to -12 under reference.

+1 on this. Anything else and my ears beg for mercy.

danger boy

11-19-2008, 12:56 PM

Wow if some people are listening to music or movies at reference level.. that is hella loud. if reference on a system is "0" then i could only listen to a one scene in a movie at -5 before my ears started to feel the burn.

I was watching the pod racer scene in Star Wars, and while it sounded good.. the sub was kicking harder than I have ever felt it thump before. I could feel the pressure in the room hitting the couch. I thought it would blow the surround speakers. but they held on.

SPL meter readings in my small room were between 91db and 101db. Plenty loud.

Kex

11-19-2008, 01:33 PM

... the sub was kicking harder than I have ever felt it thump before. I could feel the pressure in the room hitting the couch. I thought it would blow the surround speakers. but they held on.

SPL meter readings in my small room were between 91db and 101db. Plenty loud.
Are you running your sub hot (a lot of people seem to like it that way)? Since I seem to be one of the few that listens louder, that might explain why my sub is never run hot, for movies or music (that, and my dislike for excessive boominess). In your case, listening louder than usual would be increasing the subwoofer output also.

Those SPL readings sound similar to what I would experience for louder passages also, in which case you should have been getting down to readings of 75-85 for normal, conversational scenes. I haven't listened to the Pod scene in a while, but another good scene is the opening passage in Revenge of the Sith, where a spaceship thunders slowly accross the screen. If your sub is usually running hot, it might be a good idea to be ready to adjust it down for that scene!

danger boy

11-19-2008, 08:32 PM

mmadden28

11-19-2008, 09:24 PM

nope. I don't run my sub hot. I'm always very aware of it's loudness whenever i play something. I am very particular about the sub being balanced and not boomy. One thing I hate is a boomy subwoofer. :eek: ;)

My wife complains about that all the time. Seems the sub-bass is so different when watching different shows. Movies, it always seems to be OK, but some TV shows, like Dancin with the Stars, just has the sub-bass way up. I am constantly adjusting the volume on the sub to make the wife happy. At times I like it hot, but sometimes its just so dang annoying, esp when its just single notes, and its not smooth.

Kex

11-19-2008, 11:46 PM

... Seems the sub-bass is so different when watching different shows. Movies, it always seems to be OK, but some TV shows, like Dancin with the Stars, just has the sub-bass way up. I am constantly adjusting the volume on the sub to make the wife happy. ...
I hate subwoofer boom too. I think it's great that my receiver has a dedicated volume rocker on the remote for the subwoofer, as well as five preset memories which allow for different crossover frequencies and speaker levels (including the subwoofer), although I haven't used them much as yet. I thought the Onkyo 805 had similar control options ... maybe I'm confused with the Yamaha 663 ...

danger boy

11-20-2008, 01:45 AM

Seems the sub-bass is so different when watching different shows. Movies, it always seems to be OK, but some TV shows, like Dancin with the Stars, just has the sub-bass way up. I am constantly adjusting the volume on the sub to make the wife happy. At times I like it hot, but sometimes its just so dang annoying, esp when its just single notes, and its not smooth.

i agree... some shows just pump up the bass.. and it's annoying to me too.

wingnut4772

11-20-2008, 02:26 AM

I just got m Integra 9.9 all hooked up with the Audyssey Dynamic EQ and it's awesome! Basically if you don't listen at reference levels the Dynamic EQ adjusts the volume of the channels so that you still have the impact as if you were. It's terrific.

Audyssey Dynamic EQ (http://www.audyssey.com/technology/dynamicEQ.html)

John K.

11-20-2008, 02:40 AM

Kex, the sound level exposure limits which were quoted in your post #14 really shouldn't be considered acceptable when the context is home audio. They appear to be based on exposure limits considered to be acceptable in the workplace when some hearing loss is tolerated(at least by some). A more appropriate set of "community" limits (not in a working environment) which should be applied to listening at home can be found in the table linked here (http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=2438596&rendertype=table&id=Tab1). The limits in the third set of numbers are those suggested by the EPA and World Health Organization for general community exposure which should impose no significant risk of hearing loss, and are far lower than the two preceding sets which contain suggestions for the workplace.

No, along with most others who've replied, I certainly don't listen at "reference level", but rather typically about 10dB lower. This level is safe even over extended periods of home listening. Unfortunately some appear to like to "crank it", and I recall one past thread here involving amplifier power requirements where I'd described levels over 100dB as being "unbearably loud" other than on very brief peaks. This drew a reply that apparently my equipment was inadequate, since 100dB was just the starting point for him. The point that was being made there was that with speakers of typical efficiencies(including the Polks), the speaker used about 1 watt at a comfortably loud level in the mid 80s of dBs. For more quiet moments in the music perhaps a thousandth of a watt would be used and for brief peaks on highly dynamic material such as some classical recordings perhaps a hundred watts would be required, but again nothing beyond the capabilities of the typical HT receiver. Reality should be applied to listening levels in the home and the power requirements to satisfy them.

brody05

11-20-2008, 03:09 AM

I think a lot of it comes down to room size too though, as stated before I am in the -15 to -20 range a lot of the time.

My room though is 6 meters by 6 meters with 3 meter high ceilings, a lot of volume to power up and can handle loud bursts on the occasion when I want it, but in a smaller room as in the past I have noticed it took less to fill the room so to speak.

Even with that volume, I am still careful to protect the ears of myself, family and friends, having spent a few years in the 'like it loud club' I can honestly say I dont miss the ringing in my ears after a big night at reference level.

It is more the quality, tightness of bass and getting the impact when required for me, my system is well capable of exceeding 120db without issue as is a lot of others on this site so the above is not secondary to limitations within the system.

Kex

11-20-2008, 12:48 PM

... Unfortunately some appear to like to "crank it", and I recall one past thread here involving amplifier power requirements where I'd described levels over 100dB as being "unbearably loud" other than on very brief peaks. This drew a reply that apparently my equipment was inadequate, since 100dB was just the starting point for him. ... Reality should be applied to listening levels in the home and the power requirements to satisfy them.
I think there's some sort of macho thing that goes on about who has the biggest badest truck (that they usually don't even need to haul anything), the car with the most HP and the fastest 0-60 time, the system with the most watts per channel and/or that weighs the most, and the ability to listen to music really loud with that most impressive system. Does all this equate also to an increased probability that the person making all these claims probably also has the longest, biggest d!ck? I completely agree with those that want extra power for tighter bass and more dynamics, and they probably are the vast majority here.

With those figures you linked to, it's still not clear if A-weighting or C-weighting should be used. I would assume A-weighting, since as stated previously, that setting equates to the human ear's most sensitive range.

The EPA/WHO are the most conservative, allowing only 47 minutes at 85dBA, and 15 minutes at 90dBA. If this is A-weighting, I'm probably doing fine, just about, but if it's C-weighting, I might want to modify my listening habits significantly! Either way, I do not experience the "ringing in my ears after a big night at reference level" that brody05 refers to (but I think if "big night" refers to disco or a concert, it's probably well above reference according to the first list of acceptable numbers in post #14).

For those reading this:
- OSHA is the Occupational Safety and Health Administration,
- NIOSH is the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health,
- PEL is Permissible Exposure Limit,
- REL is probably Recommended Exposure Limit.

organ

11-20-2008, 03:35 PM

The "0.0db" setting is obviously too loud. This is recommended by Dolby and they claim that the listener shouldn't suffer hearing loss from this volume level. But of course, the comfort level does change at such high spl. In fact, I came across a site that talked about "reference level" and they mentioned that many theatres actually had to lower their levels due to customer complaints. Now I understand why it seemed so much louder at home than when I go to the movies. But there were times when at the theaters when I think they kept the movie at reference. One example was when I went to see Batman Begins.

Here's something I just noticed as well. It seems like DTS movies usually have much higher peaks than DD (even for the newer HD formats).
I watch Dolby stuff at -5db and DTS at -10db.

It seems some receivers are equipped with very useful features to lessen the bite at high volumes. The movie theatre environment is quite different than our home. THX being is of them. Another setting to play around with would be Re-EQ and the X-Curve.

So if your receiver/processor have some sort of feature like that, you should give them a try. I'm using the X-Curve using the recommended drop of 0.5db/oct starting at 2kHz for my room size. That's how I was able to get down to -5db on the volume without it being painful.