More TT Chat

[seeclear]

I'm psyched!! This probably seems really lo-fi to you vinyl junkies, but I just received my first TT today!! By that, I mean another of the first TT I ever owned once I started buying a nicer audio setup 30 years ago when I was in college.

Back then, there weren't many choices for a guy living in a small town in upstate NY, especially considering I was pretty naive about stereo stuff (still am, by Club Polk standards!). So, I got my stuff at the local Radio Shack. My first TT was a Realistic Lab 400, direct drive fully automatic. I don't even remember at this point what happened to that original one I had, I just remember some years later when I was living in Rochester, I went and got a cheapie Sony to replace it, funds being low at the time.

Recently I started thinking about trying to find another one, and I found several that have been offered on Ebay. Won an auction last week and it arrived today. It needs a new stylus, as the one on it currently is bent. I was worried about it traveling all the way here (from Fla), but it arrived intact other than the bent stylus, and who knows if it wasn't that way before. Anyway, I may try and upgrade the cartridge at some point, but for now I plan to just get the new needle and see how it does. (It has a shure r1000xt cartridge and shure 8x stylus currently.) On this website

http://www.lptunes.com/Stylus-for-Shure-R1000XT-R1000-XT-cartridge-p/shsr1000xt.htm

it seems to show three different styli (2 in the related products), does that mean that any of those styli will fit and work with that cartidge?

I was reading with interest thsmith's other thread about his TT, and thinking about simple ways to try and tweak this unit. I will be using it with a dedicated 2 channel rig, so I don't have to worry about the HT bypass. Would it be feasible to add some mass to the platter, and would that generally help the sound? It has a 3.1 pound aluminum platter as it is. Would adding weight potentially be damaging to the motor at all? Looking at the skimpy interconnect I am wondering if I couldn't put on a better one of those, also.

Anyway, these guys on the Steve Hoffman forum seem to think this is an OK TT,

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=128372

I know this can't hold a candle to some of your rigs, but I'm jazzed about it, and I'd like to maximize its potential. I just can't wait to get it hooked up and start spinnin' some vinyl! I might have to go to some pawn shops and thrift stores to find some vinyl, tho, since all mine is in storage for the next few months.

Thoughts?

ps the attached photos are not my "new" one, but some I found on google. Mine is in very good (similar to the photos) condition.

[inspiredsports]

The fact that your new analog TT gives you the ability to reproduce 100% of the musical vibrations present in the original recording, versus just the sampled subset that digital yields, is a benefit no matter what you spent!

[Fongolio]

Very decent looking vintage table. Enjoy!

[Keiko]

Looks like a pretty good little table to me. All kinds of cheap tweaks & cartridges for analog. Enjoy it.

[SCompRacer]

Congrats on your find. The important thing is listen to the music.


does that mean that any of those styli will fit and work with that cartidge?

Styli are available in different shapes and facets. The higher priced elliptical stylus upgrades offered will have a smaller side radius. The smaller the side radius, the better it’s potential to retrieve information from the grooves.

I’ve purchased replacement styli from LPGear (which has the same address as LPTunes) and have been satisfied with the quality/service.

Adding mass to the platter would have to be approached carefully so you won’t create an imbalance (using clay, for instance). You could also try a different mat, like Herbies open-cell Way Excellent II. He has a 90-day no-risk trial for all his products.

[Keiko]

Seeclear, I can recommend this seller highly on ebay for used vinyl.

http://stores.shop.ebay.com/musicmusicalldaylong__W0QQ_armrsZ1

I've picked up a lot of good quality Lps. from her that have been in excellent condition. She also combines charges and ships fast.

I recall reading something recently somewhere about using Plasti Kote 265 on the underside of tt platters. It's like the spray on bed liners used on truck beds. I've never tried this, but it's supposed to act as a deadener and help with ringing. SCompRacer's suggestion on using a different mat would be the safest approach.

[Keiko]

Forgot...Try experimenting with record weights. Those help greatly with the fidelity of an Lp. Hearingimpared will encourage you to invest in a clamp which is something I plan getting on later on.

[seeclear]

I'd love to get my hands on one of hearingimpaired's clamps ;) ;) , but I don't think there are any of those left.

Keiko, that ebay seller looks to have some sweet deals, thanks for the link.

I've got to decide which stylus to go with, I suppose if I'm going to pay for shipping I may as well go for the better stylus right off the bat. Any other suggestions?

[Keiko]

I'd love to get my hands on one of hearingimpaired's clamps ;) ;) , but I don't think there are any of those left.

Keiko, that ebay seller looks to have some sweet deals, thanks for the link.

I've got to decide which stylus to go with, I suppose if I'm going to pay for shipping I may as well go for the better stylus right off the bat. Any other suggestions?

Yeah, Sharon (ebay) is a real pleasant lady to deal with. I just got some albums I ordered from her yesterday that were like new and played flawlessly. I can't recommend her enough.

Look at the Shure M97xE seeclear. I've heard really good things about that cartridge and it can be had for around 50.00 if you shop around. Check amazon. If you really want a performer, check out the Denon DL-160. I think it's on buy.com now for 105.00, which is a bargain. I paid full retail for mine @180.00, but lpgear set it up on the headshell for me included. It is one sweet cartridge and I really should snag another one for backup. I've read positive reviews on the AT-440MLa to.

[SCompRacer]

+1 for the Audio-Technica 440MLa. It has a MicroLine stylus. LPGear has them back in stock for $120. I have one on my old Yamaha YP-D10 in the basement rig.

[seeclear]

Hey, I appreciate the advice, but I am not sure I want to get involved with mounting a whole new cartridge on there. How hard/technical is it, and do you need special tools to get it aligned properly and setup? I was thinking I would just change the stylus first and work my way up to the more technical stuff. Also, couldn't those old leads on there be brittle after all these years? I'd hate to snap them off in the process.

[SCompRacer]

Yes, you can replace just the stylus, but you should still check to see if the cartridge is setup properly. I am always leery of used cartridges I don’t know the history of, and look at what a stylus costs versus purchasing a new cartridge.

Check out KAB’s Cartridge Mounting guide.

http://www.kabusa.com/setup.htm


Do you have a manual for your table? You would find the alignment procedure in there. Basically, you would adjust the stylus overhang and square the cartridge in the headshell. Overhang is the amount the stylus extends past the center of the platter spindle. Some tables had a mark on the headshell where the stylus should be located, or provided a headshell gauge. If your table does not have an overhang gauge for the headshell, you would have to provide an aftermarket gauge or protractor. Protractors can be downloaded for free from the vinyl engine.

http://www.vinylengine.com/

They also have turntable manuals for most tables. You do have to join and log in to download anything. Los of free info there along with a forum.

I’ve never run into headshell leads being brittle, just loose. You can tighten up loose connections by removing them from the cartridge pins and closing them up a bit with a small pair of needle nose pliers. Go easy or you can smash and render them unusable.

[inspiredsports]

Yeah, Sharon (ebay) is a real pleasant lady to deal with. I just got some albums I ordered from her yesterday that were like new and played flawlessly. I can't recommend her enough.

Look at the Shure M97xE seeclear. I've heard really good things about that cartridge and it can be had for around 50.00 if you shop around. Check amazon. If you really want a performer, check out the Denon DL-160. I think it's on buy.com now for 105.00, which is a bargain. I paid full retail for mine @180.00, but lpgear set it up on the headshell for me included. It is one sweet cartridge and I really should snag another one for backup. I've read positive reviews on the AT-440MLa to.

Denon DL-160 (about $150), Stanton 681 EEE MK III ($120) and Shure M97xE ($56 amazon.com) are 3 very similar sounding cartridges in that order with Denon edging out the Stanton by a tad. Shure is only a bit behind and the Shure is the hands down price winner at $57 delivered from amazon.com: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006I5SB/websitementcommu

Keiko shared Sharon's eBay store with me and I have recently purchases about 100 LP's from for an average cost of about $1.50 each. Just one had problems and she immediatelyu took care of it. Buy in bulk and she will cut shipping to a very reasonable price.

[Keiko]

Keiko shared Sharon's eBay store with me and I have recently purchases about 100 LP's from for an average cost of about $1.50 each. Just one had problems and she immediatelyu took care of it. Buy in bulk and she will cut shipping to a very reasonable price.

So that's where all the good stuff went! :p :cool:

[seeclear]

I do have the manual, in fact, I think I found it on vinyl engine after a google search and dl'd it there.

OK, you've convinced me, I guess I will try the shure cartridge, and at least that way I can learn, hopefully, how to set it up. Now I need to find a good (inexpensive) way to clean the vinyl; I can't spend a few hundred on a record cleaning machine. ;)

[SCompRacer]

The best way is to use dedicated cleaners and vacuum the LP’s, but you can achieve good results with hand washing. Use a lint free cloth to dry them. This method was handy
http://www.gallagher.com/clean_records.htm
as I recently saw it in a thread over at Steve Hoffman forums. There are many magic potions out there, just research before using 'special' formulas that might damage vinyl.

Down the road, if you are interested in a budget cleaner, check out the manual one from KAB. You supply the vac.
http://www.kabusa.com/ev1.htm

[Keiko]

I hand wash and steam my vinyl because a RCM just isn't in my budget right now. This little device was and it does an excellent job. I will also recommend this carbon fiber brush by AudioQuest. It's great just before spinning.

Linkys:

http://www.amazon.com/Euro-Pro-SC710S-Shark-Super-Steamer/dp/B0000E6EE5/ref=pd_bbs_4?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1238905610&sr=8-4

http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-LP-record-clean-brush/dp/B0006VMBHI/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1238905911&sr=8-1

Check back on amazon. IIRC, I got my Shark Steam for 39.00 w/supersaver shipping. Check your local Wally World or K-Mart also. It can be had for less than what amazon is showing now @ 47.49

[Fongolio]

I agree with Keiko but be careful with steam cleaning. You cant ruin an lp with it easily. There are some prior posts where people give their methods. A carbon fiber brush is a must for getting rid of dust and lint just before a spin. Cartridge alignment is tricky but once you've done it a few times confidence will build and you'll be doing it like routine everytime the upgrade bug hits to put a new one on. Proper alignment is critical to good sound and a little out can have a large effect so be fussy, take your time, and do it right. There are many good guides and tools for properly aligning. Keiko recently posted an excellent link that I've lost. Perhaps he can post it again. Have fun!!!

[Keiko]

Keiko recently posted an excellent link that I've lost. Perhaps he can post it again.

This link, post #9 and download the PDF from vacuumstate.com. Very good info on setting the anti-skate.

http://www.vinylengine.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=15610&highlight=setting+bias

[Keiko]

The best way is to use dedicated cleaners and vacuum the LP’s, but you can achieve good results with hand washing. Use a lint free cloth to dry them. This method was handy

http://www.gallagher.com/clean_records.htm


I have a few Lps. Rich that no matter how much I cleaned and scrubbed them they always had a fair amount of surface noise I couldn't get rid of. So, just for the heck of it I went and bought a 3 inch paint brush yesterday from the hardware store and some Dawn to try this. I am pleased! This did the trick and I'm going to use this method from now on. I don't mind doing a little more work. A RCM would make it easier I'm sure, but this provided good results. I'll save my $$$ and stick with this. Thanks for the link. :)

[jimbo1421]

The best way is to use dedicated cleaners and vacuum the LP’s, but you can achieve good results with hand washing. Use a lint free cloth to dry them. This method was handy
http://www.gallagher.com/clean_records.htm
as I recently saw it in a thread over at Steve Hoffman forums.
(snip)
http://www.kabusa.com/ev1.htm

I wouldn't dare wash and rinse one of my records with my tap water. Anything that gets wet here gets water spots, i.e., carbonate scale, if not dried off immediately. I can't see any way to get these deposits out of a microgroove.

Jim

[SCompRacer]

I hear you Mike. I've also got some used LP's that no amount of cleaning and steaming/vacuuming will fix. I'm not too fond of the drip dry method though. I did pick up one of them Groovmaster label savers a while back and they do work great.

EDIT:

Jim, I don't even drink our tap water but do use it to pre clean nasty used LP's. If they look decent I use my Tergitol mix/distilled rinse and vacuum them with my RCM.

[fast1]

thanks for the amazon links here guys, it has helped me greatlyhttp://photosnag.com/img/3322/n09x0302vnsn/clear.gif

[Keiko]

We're fortunate here on the islands to have clean water as it is, but we do have a water purifier and a softener that provides extra clean water throughout our house. I also have one of these on the kitchen tap for drinking water. I bottle up some from this and use it for steaming and rinsing vinyl.

http://www.therichwaybiomat.com/alkal-life.html

Edit: Rich, where did you pick up your groovemaster label savers at?

The link you posted above gives an email addy and a cost of 50.00 bucks. I have a few spent CD coasters here and have thought about fabricating something from these, a couple of kitchen cabinet knobs from the hardware store and a dow. Yeah, I'm cheap. :p

[SCompRacer]

Nothing wrong with being thrify. He has an ad up on ebay now and then. Starts at $44.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Groovmaster-Label-Saver-45-LP-Vinyl-Record-Cleaner_W0QQitemZ150337443374QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_0?hash=item150337443374&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1546%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

This completed auction went for $51.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Groovmaster-Label-Saver-45-LP-Vinyl-Record-Cleaner_W0QQitemZ150333739762QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_0?hash=item150333739762&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A13%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318

[Keiko]

Nothing wrong with being thrify. He has an ad up on ebay now and then. Starts at $44.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Groovmaster-Label-Saver-45-LP-Vinyl-Record-Cleaner_W0QQitemZ150337443374QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_0?hash=item150337443374&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1546%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

This completed auction went for $51.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Groovmaster-Label-Saver-45-LP-Vinyl-Record-Cleaner_W0QQitemZ150333739762QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_0?hash=item150333739762&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A13%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318

Thanks Rich...Think I can rig up a couple of my own lids for less. ;)