The Cube was the worst thing Carver offered, IMO.
I fully agree with you in the Bob Carver's role in audio history. His story is an amazing one, and his Stereophile showdown is the stuff of legend. He has a legacy no one can deny and we all benefit from that.
And just to reiterate on the Carver tubes, they are truly a beautiful thing. I've only heard them the once, so I had no reference, but the rig utilizing those amps sounded beautiful.
(I know Polk SDA's and SRS's arent the definition of transparent speakers, but still, they're transparent enough to let me know these are amps meant for lesser speakers)
And what amps do you recomend that are a better value for the money?
Not the last word in resolution, but they are cheap and were popular at the same time SDA's were available new.
Good lord, I'm getting to it.
The cube comment was replying to Jinjuku's post. I will address yours in due time, as well. There are a lot of other posts I wanted to get to first. I'm not the fastest typer in the world, and I've got other things going on simultaneously.
Personally, I almost feel I should keep you waiting, since you're very nearly demanding I pay attention to you. And as far as my eloquence, I was unaware that I was addressing the royal court. I humbly beg your forgiveness, sire.
Why does anyone prefer raisin bran over cornflakes, rap over real music,paper over plastic ?? Personal preference mainly,that would be my guess.:biggrin:
I posted a thread about a Pioneer elite receiver that replaced a B&K 307, and wasn't happy with the SQ. That is until I realized I had different IC's going to the amp, popped the old ones back in and bang,synergy was back. Experimenting with cables should be on your list before kicking a piece of gear down the road.
My post was directed at Carver owners to help me understand this whole thing. When I said I wanted someone to explain it to me, I was being serious. I really want someone to show me what these amps can do! I just need help. If I rattled the cage a little in doing so, well it seems that that happens around here. And I've gotten a lot of great responses. I'd like to keep the dialog positive.
We have a saying around here, "Everything Matters". Your source,cables,amps speakers, the room. Some gear just works better for some than others. It becomes too easy to say a certain speaker sounds like crap,or this or that amp,blah blah, when really it's more so a synergy thing. As posted before, most carvers out there are in need of some updating due to age. Yeah, even the best have some lemons and Carver is no different. Lots of people use Carvers/Sunfire with SDA's because they like the sound in their environment, no need to read any further into it. You had a bad experience with them,thats cool, you should be able to move on and try something different. Thats what this hobby is all about.
You're not doing anything wrong, if your ears, gear and synergy don't work with Carver......they don't work. I've heard quite a few pieces of Carver in the heydey and I never cared for it as in it was never anything that blew my skirt up. Yamaha, Onkyo, Carver all sound the same to me, bland and boring. Doesn't mean it's necessarily poor gear, just not what I would consider great.
At Lou's at Polkfest the Carver amp sounded a whole lot better than the Emotiva, a whole lot better on the Amazings and Phil's AAD's.
Just my .02c
Parasound Halo A23
Parasound HCA-2200 mkII
Bel Canto (Don't recall the model, but was <$500 used)
Stax (can't remember model, but it was class a and somewhere around 50W)
Sunfire Symphonic reference
this is off the top of my head. Some other models I've not had much experience with but personally know others have preferred:
Classe CA-150 great amp for the $.
I keep trying Carver amps but they never float my boat.
I recently bought a TFM-35, had high hopes, brought it home, hooked it up, and in a very few minutes (maybe moments) knew I didn't like the sound.
Sounded thin and somehow "electronic", but it would play "loud".
Tried it on SDA's, RTA12's, Magneplanar MMG's, Dahlquist DQ-10's, ADS-810's, and some others, so I think I gave it fair shake.
On the other hand, I have (and instantly liked) amps like Adcom GFA-1, 454, 555, Citation 16's, Dynacos, Luxman, Quad, Rotel, and others.
I can't figure it out. Maybe someone who has a system that sounds fantastic with a Carver amp, but they should try swapping in an Adcom, Rotel, or similiar "value" amp of similar power rating and see if it doesn't sound even "better".
I'm actually glad you started this conversation as it's something I noticed as well when I was new here. I think it really boils down to synergy though. A Carver may sound like a$$ with brand X speakers, pre, and source. Change the pre and it may sound golden. Use a high end TT or CDP and it may change for the good. Use brand X cables and you may get something different altogether. Like you said to each his own and in the end it's about what your ears find pleasing. Have a great Christmas newrival!!!
PS.. I still haven't tried tubes with SDA's but everyone who has raves about them. I'm working on a deal at a local pawn shop for an old Eico ST-70 integrated that I'd love to try with the 1C's
Since I have Carver ALS Platinum speakers, I haven't found an amp that has the power to drive them anywhere close to the price of my Carver Silver 9t's. The Carver 180W tube amps did sound better than the 575W 9t's, but they cost three times as much. Trying to compair SS to tubes is an apples and oranges thing though. Not counting tube amps, I'm very satisfied with my 9t's. Crystal clear mids and highs, and the bass will bulge the window glass with no distortion. The best bass reproduction I've heard from an amp/speaker combo.
I really like my Carver TFM-42 with my Amazing Platinums.. I've been changing things around recently since I think my front room is just too small for the Amazings..
When I paired the TMF-42 with my SDA-II's i didn't like it as much.. currently have the SDA-II's powered with a Parasound HCA-1200mkII and I like that better than the SDA/TFM-42 pairing.. but I think I liked the Amazing/TFM-42 combo in the room better than what I've accomplished with the SDA-II's (although I'm going to try to upgrade teh xovers, etc to make my final determination)..
Just trying to re-iterate the point most are making, that synergy is the key..
SRS's as a garage rig??? Somehow that just sounds wrong to me.:confused::wink:
I had a Kenwood KA-9100 integrated that made my RTiA7's totally sing. Kenwood made some great stuff back in the 70's. Interesting though snow that your little Kenwood sounded better than it's bigger bro's. It truly is about synergy. In my main system I have two turntables, one a medium priced Pro-ject 6.9, the other an old Technics SL-1700 on which I'm using an Audio Technica AT20SLa cart. It sounded totally awesome with a Marantz headshell I borrowed off another table. I'm selling the Marantz table and needed the headshell back so I switched it to a generic I had lying around. Totally changed the sound!! The new one is a little lighter so I had to reset the counter weight for tracking force. I know I have the alignment right but it just doesn't have the same punch or super wide soundstage it did while using the Marantz headshell. The point is that it's all about synergy. Change anything and the synergy changes. I guess a lot of SDA owners simply enjoy the sound of Carver with SDA. That said, as stated on this thread and in others there are many who have found audio nirvana with SDA's and other amps.
just a quick clarification:
I'm fully aware of that video, and have been vocal on how big of a fan I am of Sal's work on his speakers. I had forgotten he uses Carver gear, so that probably means his comment earlier in the thread was one of passive condescension rather than a joke, which is why I originally returned in favor (or so I thought). *sorry for he mix-up there*
Back to the point: The fact that you are offering up a youtube video as evidence of how well a piece of audio equipment reproduces music is absolutely comical. I hope I don't have to explain why.
A TFM-35 amp + C-11 pre + SD/A-450 cdp + pin/blade SRS2s sound better to me than half the mega-dollar rigs I've seen at audio parlors/shows ! (brand X speaker cables & low-end Audioquest ICs) An Adcom 555 sounds like a dentist's drill to me compared to my Carver ! But, then again, my mileage always varies !:cool:
my apologies to the Adcom fans ! I didn't mean to bash or flame!:redface: