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Thread: LoMC Cart

  1. #1

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    Default LoMC Cart

    I recently secured the matching SUT for my Wright tube phono stage.

    My TT is the Marantz badged ClearAudio using Satisfy tonearm.

    Looking to get a LoMC cart.

    Budget is 2 price points $500 and $1000.

    Considering the following.
    Ortofon Rondo series specifically the Blue Rondo
    Dynavector 20x2 and 17D3
    Micro Benz Ace or Glide

    Looking for feedback or other Carts I should consider. I want the giant killer.

    I believe the Satisfy tonearm is light to medium compliance.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    I like my Dyna 20 xl -- cannot comment on the 17D3,, shoot Rich(scomp) a pm,,
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    Thanks George. The Dyna 20 is a serious contender. Also looking at the SHelter 501 MK2 but between the 2 some people seem to prefer the DYna.

    I have to get this right as I want to cry just once.

    Come on vinyl guys let hear your thoughts and experience.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    What voltage output do you need from the cart? The cart and SUT output should match the input on your stage. You could underload or overload if you are not careful in chosing the correct gain. Random choices could provide additional tears.
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    Excellent point and thank you. All I know about the Wright SUT is "stock" load of 100 ohms and is 1:10 ratio.

    I have read about people changing the stock load to closer match their cart by adding resistors via Y connectors on the input of the SUT.

    What other information would I need to know to determine best match for cart voltage?
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    Is there a calculator online that will help me match SUT and cart?

    Here is the data on the Dyna 20x2.

    Technical Data:
    •Type : High/Low output MC cartridge with Flux damper and Softened magnetism
    •Output voltage : 2.8mV / 0.3mV (at 1KHz, 5cm/sec.)
    •Frequency response : 20 - 20,000Hz (?2dB)
    •Channel Separation : 25 dB (at 1KHz)
    •Channel balance : 1.0 dB (at 1KHz)
    •Compliance : 12 x 10-6 cm/dyne
    •Impedance : R=150 ohms / 5 ohms
    •Stylus tip : Micro Ridge Nude diamond
    •Cantilever : 6mm length hard aluminum pipe
    •Tracking force : 1.8 - 2.2 grams
    •Recommended load impedance: >1000 ohms / 30 ohms
    •Weight : 9.2grams
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    There are other issues to contend with but this is a start.

    http://www.hagtech.com/loading.html

    Vinyl Asylum and Vinyl Engine has some helpful reading.
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    IIRC my dyna has an output voltage of 0.28 mv,,and my denon is less than .5,, with my Cinemag SUT,,I can switch between 1:10 and 1:20 ,,can't hear that much of a difference,,to my old ears,,I will say that the Dyna and SUT is just simply stellar,,90% of my listening is vinyl,, a year ago,,it would have been different.YMMV-- consider the dyna line though,,well worth the price of admission.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    If you're looking for a cart and will go up to a 1000, you have to consider the Empire 501 Mk II. There's a really good reason that everyone that hears one says you'd have to spend at least 3K to get a better cart.
    Are you part of the dirty digital peasants or a member of the great Analog Master Race?

    SDA Recommended Playlist https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...FZCRkdxYXVNanc

    Open for editing.

  10. #10

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    Thanks Rob but do you mean Shelter or Empire? I think you mean Shelter
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    I am currently using the Benz Glider M2. They make an updated low output version that is supposed to be even better than mine. It must be mind blowing because the M2 is the best cart I've had on my system. Beautiful highs, if not slightly laid back, amazing bottom end, and the best mids I've ever heard on an analog system. This cart makes poorly recorded LP's sound good and well recorded albums sound fantastic. The only downside (if you can call it that) is that the stylus hangs out in front and you must be really careful when mounting. However, that's one other thing that makes it good. Because you can see the cantilever so well, it makes aligning easy. Just use the cantilever. I've got mine nearly perfect. I strongly recommend this cartridge, you won't be disappointed.

    Kelvin
    SDA-1C (full mods)
    Carver TFM-45
    NAD 1130 pre
    Rega Planar 3 TT/Shelter 501 MkII
    Nitty Gritty 1.5FI RCM
    The Clamp
    Thorens TD160/Mission 774 arm/Stanton 881S Shibata
    Nakamichi CR7 Cassette Deck
    Rotel RCD-855 with tube output stage
    Cambridge Audio DACmagic Plus
    DBX 3BX-DS
    DBX 224-DS
    ADC Soundshaper 3 EQ
    Ben's IC's

  12. #12

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    Interesting you mention the Benz Glider. I spent about 45 minutes with Matt at NeedleDoctor yesterday looking for more clarity on carts that are a good match for my tonearm and SUT.

    Looking more like the Benz Glider SL is what I will get.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    I'm using my Benz with my Pro-ject 6.9 table with 9" arm and a PS Audio head amp (which is really a step up transformer in one box and an adjustable in/out module in another) in combination with my Eico's phono pre amp is total magic. The Benz sounds really good with my Carver TFM-45 and C1 pre but it's just in another world with the Eico and PS Audio. You'll really enjoy that Benz if you get the right combination. Your table with Satisfy arm should play really nice with the Benz SL.

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    I'll follow up in this thread soon.I just received an e-mail that my Dyna 20 XL is ready to ship back from Soundsmith,,I had the cart. retipped with the ruby cantilever option,, prior to it's removal in did sound fantastic with the SUT (cinemag) that I was using.Always wondered what the rave was about,,now I'll find out if they are true.The Benz carts' that I have heard were very "organic" with nice detail/seperation.Good luck in your journey down the rabbit hole.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    Look forward to hearing your impressions George !
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by thsmith View Post
    I recently secured the matching SUT for my Wright tube phono stage.

    My TT is the Marantz badged ClearAudio using Satisfy tonearm.

    Looking to get a LoMC cart...
    Just noticed you have a Wright phonostage and thought I'd mention, in case you hadn't heard, that Allen Wright has just recently passed away:

    http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/gen...58/585284.html
    http://www.avguide.com/blog/allen-wright-passes
    all the best,
    mrh

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    The Wright that thsmith has is a George Wright(washington state) piece,,and sadly too,he passed about 1 1/2 years ago.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    whoops... I knew of both gentlemen and still managed to mix them up :-(
    all the best,
    mrh

  19. #19

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    Guys,, first George,,then Allen,, Gary Dodd hospitalized with apparently life threating/changing issues,,and we lost a co-worker today,who is 10 years youger than me,,just makes me realize my own mortality.I suppose that it's a road that we all will travel eventually.My heart is heavy today gents.well,, at least the re-tipped dyna is on the way,,now to discharge those 500 volts caps,,it's all good.George,,over and out.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

  20. #20

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    the thermodynamics (end state) is never in question, only the kinetics (rate at which the end state is achieved) :-(
    all the best,
    mrh

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    I suppose you are right,,,reminds me of a sayin' I recall,,,something like,, "it's good to have an End to journey towards,,but,in the end,,it's the journey that matters",,thats as close as i can get the quote,,but you get the point.
    found it,,

    “It is good to have an end to journey toward; but it is the journey that matters, in the end”
    Last edited by george daniel; 03-02-2011 at 09:49 PM.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    Tough times for sure.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by thsmith View Post
    Thanks Rob but do you mean Shelter or Empire? I think you mean Shelter
    DOH... shelter. Invite to try the Shelter with your SUT. Also, recommended impendence is 100 Ohms, so your SUT should be a good match.
    Are you part of the dirty digital peasants or a member of the great Analog Master Race?

    SDA Recommended Playlist https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...FZCRkdxYXVNanc

    Open for editing.

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by quadzilla View Post
    DOH... shelter. Invite to try the Shelter with your SUT. Also, recommended impendence is 100 Ohms, so your SUT should be a good match.
    Hummmmm, that is a very nice offer. Let me think on it.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

  25. #25

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    I am casting another vote for the Dynavector 20X. I love mine! George your in for a treat, mine has also been retipped by Soundsmith with the ruby cantilever and diamond stylus. I never heard it stock, I bought it off the 'Gon already modified. The original owner said it made a pretty signifigant difference. It has good accurate lows, sweet mids, and very detailed, yet smooth highs. I love the soundstage,imaging, tracking, and overall tone of this cartridge. I must note I am running this on a heavily modified KAB-Technics SL-1200 table using a Jolida JD-9 phono Pre with NOS RCA 12AX7 tubes. It sounds fantastic!

    George let us know what you think of the Soundsmith mods. I'm curious how the it compares to the stock cart since I never got to here it stock. Cheers.

    Steve

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    will do-- the stock dyna 20/cinemag was very good.soon,guys,,soon
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

  27. #27

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    Pulled the trigger on the Benz Micro Glider SL.

    George how is the Dyna sounding ?
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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    still waiting on it-- should be here any day.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    Quote Originally Posted by george daniel View Post
    still waiting on it-- should be here any day.


    I like the Dynavector line. Anxious to hear what you hear with the Soundsmith retip George.

    Good choice thsmith. Congrats!
    Make yourself necessary to someone. Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    My BMS Glider SL arrived yesterday but probably won't get it mounted until Saturday.

    One thing that surprised me was they do not provide a stylis protective cover.

    For the money this cost it should but I can see where a nude body cart would be hard to attach it to.

    Need to have my A game handling this cart for the install.

    I do like that the body is threaded so no pesky nuts to deal with.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

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