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  1. #91

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    Default Overhead squat

    The easiest way to embarrass random Joe-showoff in the gym is to ask him to do some overhead squats. Most guys can do ZERO.

    Check this out. This video is total inspiration. Watch it, then go to the gym and try a bodyweight OHS, and watch it again!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjuULPqI-WY

  2. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by jcandy View Post
    The take-home message is that as soon as you feel EVEN THE SLIGHTEST DISCOMFORT when running, its time to STOP and do something else. There are countless routines/protocols that are really superior to running for overall fitness.
    The same could be said for ANY EXERCISE KNOWN TO MAN. An exercise is only as good as the person doing it, and only useful if a person does it. Which for MOST people means something they enjoy. So if someone enjoys running, and that's how they'd prefer to get in shape, more power to them. Just cuz you guys have fragile bones of paper doesn't mean everyone does.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.

  3. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by jcandy View Post
    A colleague who I work closely with (she was my postdoc for a few years) recently ran a marathon -- just 6 seconds over the 2012 female Olympic qualifying time. Alas, she is now in a cast and can barely walk because of a severe stress fracture.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, the 2012 female Olympic qualifying time for a marathon is 2 hours and 39 minutes? She ran 26 miles in 2 hours, 39 min, and 6 seconds or a little over a six minute mile? Wow, that's fast.

  4. #94

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    Moderation...as bobman suggests is the key. Your body WILL tell you when you're going too far. I had a number of colleagues who were avid runners, they were addicted to running and ran every day--as they aged, the hip replacements started coming in. They were not listening to their bodies!

    Or remember "W", he ran and ran hard up to somewhere in his 50s, then he switched to biking, if I'm not mistaken--under advisement.

    I know I can't run any significant distance without messing something up, but I have some minor knee injuries, I ain't 25 or even 40 anymore, and my back is starting to feel about as flexible as a very old tree trunk. As for my bones, well the weight training probably means that my old bones have greater 'density' than a lot of youngsters here so that's not the problem.

    In any case, for you guys and gals that are past your mid-40s and more. Listen to your body and stretch well, rest well, sleep well, eat well and you'll be OK.

    cnh
    Last edited by cnh; 04-05-2011 at 11:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fatchowmein View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong, the 2012 female Olympic qualifying time for a marathon is 2 hours and 39 minutes? She ran 26 miles in 2 hours, 39 min, and 6 seconds or a little over a six minute mile? Wow, that's fast.
    2:46:18 ... just over 6 minute miles. She told me 6 or 8 seconds over Olympic qualification, I didn't look up the actual qualifying time. Its unreal.

  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    In any case, for you guys and gals that are past your mid-40s and more. Listen to your body and stretch well, rest well, sleep well, eat well and you'll be OK.

    cnh
    I agree with you yet I find it hard to listen to my body. Exercise involves some discomfort and sometimes it's hard to tell an ache from a sore. I was running for 60 min with various aches that either stopped when I stopped running or were easy to rub out. Heart and lungs were fantastic and that runner's high can really zone you out.

    But I sidelined myself because my outer right foot throbbed even though I'm not sure if it's something minor that may lead to something major or whether it's just my body adjusting to my new running regime. I did get a physical and my doc said to just slow down so I switched to my bike but not a day goes by that I do not look at my running shoes longingly. I'm sure my attitude will be different once it hits 90 around here but right now it's gorgeous outside.

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    I don't think I've seen it mentioned yet, so here's my 2cents - Stretching after a workout is easily as important as stretching before your workout.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrNightly View Post
    "Dr Dunn admitted that his research could also be interpreted as evidence that women are shallower than men. He said: "Let's face it - there's evidence to support it."
    Quote Originally Posted by mystik610 View Post
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  8. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    Moderation...as bobman suggests is the key. Your body WILL tell you when you're going too far. I had a number of colleagues who were avid runners, they were addicted to running and ran every day--as they aged, the hip replacements started coming in. They were not listening to their bodies!
    Agreed. The "run through it" mentality is very common.

    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    In any case, for you guys and gals that are past your mid-40s and more. Listen to your body and stretch well, rest well, sleep well, eat well and you'll be OK.
    Perfect advice. With respect to designing a routine, now any time I feel any issue developing (say, a pain in the elbow, shoulder, etc) I switch protocol to take emphasis off that body part.

  9. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    Moderation...as bobman suggests is the key. Your body WILL tell you when you're going too far
    Exactly, thats true for every part of being healthy. But to say don't run at all because it could cause knee problems is just ridiculous. If you eat too much, you'll get fat and risk other health issues. If you lift too much, your muscles won't be able to rebuild themselves. Trying to find a good balance between the three I think is key.

    Like I said before, I try to not run (or other cardio workouts) more than an hourish a week, and it seems to be working.. My lifting is still increasing and I feel better overall because I'm in beter cardio shape.

    In the end, maybe running is not for you. But if you do the elliptical or something else and you aren't sweating, then you're not getting a good cardio workout sorry.
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  10. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    In any case, for you guys and gals that are past your mid-40s and more. Listen to your body and stretch well, rest well, sleep well, eat well and you'll be OK.
    Well, relatively. You're still gonna die someday.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.

  11. #101

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    Quote Originally Posted by bobman1235 View Post
    The same could be said for ANY EXERCISE KNOWN TO MAN. An exercise is only as good as the person doing it, and only useful if a person does it. Which for MOST people means something they enjoy. So if someone enjoys running, and that's how they'd prefer to get in shape, more power to them. Just cuz you guys have fragile bones of paper doesn't mean everyone does.
    No, and no. Whether you like it or not, some training protocols are actually much better than others, and some may in fact do more harm than good. Even competitive runners do special training that does not include running so as to minimize distance-related bone damage. Running in so many cases is just a bad idea, in particular if you have had knee surgery (this includes lots of people who've been very active their whole life). Alternatively, if you are fat and out of shape with little to no history of sporting activity, running is also a bad idea. Both these facts are pointed out in the article. Moreover, people through their own ignorance can cripple themselves by attempting to train through injury. Some people run because they don't know much, or how to get a proper workout that includes core/strength conditioning. There was a recent post that detailed a really nice protocol that integrated running with strength training.

    It is critical to STOP RUNNING when you feel something is wrong.

  12. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by tommyboy View Post
    Exactly, thats true for every part of being healthy. But to say don't run at all because it could cause knee problems is just ridiculous. If you eat too much, you'll get fat and risk other health issues. If you lift too much, your muscles won't be able to rebuild themselves. Trying to find a good balance between the three I think is key.

    Like I said before, I try to not run (or other cardio workouts) more than an hourish a week, and it seems to be working.. My lifting is still increasing and I feel better overall because I'm in beter cardio shape.

    In the end, maybe running is not for you. But if you do the elliptical or something else and you aren't sweating, then you're not getting a good cardio workout sorry.
    Nobody is saying don't run at all. What is being suggested is to limit running and never run through pain. Regarding cardio, there is a whole realm of brutal cardio protocols (HIIT including tabatas and circuits) that do not involve running or elliptical and will dramatically improve your VO2 max and overall fitness level.

  13. #103

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    Quote Originally Posted by jcandy View Post
    No, and no. Whether you like it or not, some training protocols are actually much better than others, and some may in fact do more harm than good.....

    It is critical to STOP RUNNING when you feel something is wrong.
    Strong Bad earlier said the following :

    Unless you're in the military or you have a specific need to be conditioned to run long distances, then I wouldn't recommend running/jogging to anyone. It's very hard on the feet, ankle, knees, legs, hips and low back. Exercise is to make the body healthy and strong!
    My post was in response to the idea that running is always a bad idea. It is not. I do not argue that it requires a bit of preparation. I also don't see how any person with a brain would argue with the idea that one should continue doing an exercise through pain. But blanket statements like "no one should run unless they have to" are stupid. I've heard the same argument applied to free weights, and they're equally stupid. The same logic applies to free weights as running : don't do beyond what your body is ready for. Period.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.

  14. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by bobman1235 View Post
    You're still gonna die someday.
    LOL! That would make a great running tshirt.

  15. #105

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    Passed my physical and the blood work came in today clean. Must be all that scotch I'm drinking.

    Gonna celebrate by resting and not doing anything today (suppose to be doing Plyometrics).

    Cholesterol
    Total (normal<200): 178
    LDL ("bad type" normal<130): 118
    HDL ("good type" normal>40): 51
    Triglycerides (normal<150): 47

    Glucose, kidney, liver, blood count, urine, thyroid all normal.
    Last edited by fatchowmein; 04-05-2011 at 07:39 PM.

  16. #106

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    Yesterday's workout

    Warmup:
    Run 100m
    10 pushups
    10 airsquats
    10 ring-ups

    Do 3 times

    WOD (workout of the day)
    20min AMRAP (as many reps as possible)
    3 OH squats (65lbs) - I'm not flexible enough for these, so I did front squats at 95lbs
    10 Ring-rows
    10 wallball burpies ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45GnV4DjkjU ) I can't watch the video at work, but based on the name it should show what these are.
    3 pullups
    Quote Originally Posted by MrNightly View Post
    "Dr Dunn admitted that his research could also be interpreted as evidence that women are shallower than men. He said: "Let's face it - there's evidence to support it."
    Quote Originally Posted by mystik610 View Post
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  17. #107

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanjoachim View Post
    Yesterday's workout
    3 OH squats (65lbs) - I'm not flexible enough for these, so I did front squats at 95lbs
    Cool that you gave the OH squat a try! There is something to be said for movements or exercises (like skipping rope) that require coordination. I think it makes things the whole ordeal more interesting and fun.

  18. #108

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    Quote Originally Posted by jcandy View Post
    The easiest way to embarrass random Joe-showoff in the gym is to ask him to do some overhead squats. Most guys can do ZERO.

    Check this out. This video is total inspiration. Watch it, then go to the gym and try a bodyweight OHS, and watch it again!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjuULPqI-WY
    Correct me if I'm wrong. But I've always thought that full squats of 'any' kind, including the ones above that require stability and coordination, were OK for folks under 25 or so but wreaked havoc on your knees if you were past your PEAK years.

    I know at my age one should really think 'twice' about something like that. I, myself, never do more than 1/4 to a little less than 1/2 squats with any 'real' weight and even then I take 'great' care to stretch out, warm up, and start out light before I get a little heavier.

    If I did what the woman in the video is doing I'd need knee surgery after the first or second set? lol

    cnh

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong. But I've always thought that full squats of 'any' kind, including the ones above that require stability and coordination, were OK for folks under 25 or so but wreaked havoc on your knees if you were past your PEAK years.

    I know at my age one should really think 'twice' about something like that. I, myself, never do more than 1/4 to a little less than 1/2 squats with any 'real' weight and even then I take 'great' care to stretch out, warm up, and start out light before I get a little heavier.

    If I did what the woman in the video is doing I'd need knee surgery after the first or second set? lol

    cnh
    I suppose it depends on the person. We've got women and men ranging from 20 years old up past 50 doing all sorts of squats.

    If you have the right form, and the right weight, there's really not that much pressure going on your knees. If you do it right, most of the pressure is actually on your thighs and calves (I don't know the specific muscle groups off the top of my head).
    Quote Originally Posted by MrNightly View Post
    "Dr Dunn admitted that his research could also be interpreted as evidence that women are shallower than men. He said: "Let's face it - there's evidence to support it."
    Quote Originally Posted by mystik610 View Post
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  20. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by jcandy View Post
    It is critical to STOP RUNNING when you feel something is wrong.
    My brain tells my body that even before I run that something is wrong normally when I have to get out of bed early in the morning, I guess that means I should stop then.
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    It is critical to STOP RUNNING when you feel something is wrong.
    I'd rephrase that to: "it is critical to stop running when you feel real pain". "Real pain" meaning anything more than just uncomfortable or sore or burning muscles.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrNightly View Post
    "Dr Dunn admitted that his research could also be interpreted as evidence that women are shallower than men. He said: "Let's face it - there's evidence to support it."
    Quote Originally Posted by mystik610 View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong. But I've always thought that full squats of 'any' kind, including the ones above that require stability and coordination, were OK for folks under 25 or so but wreaked havoc on your knees if you were past your PEAK years.

    I know at my age one should really think 'twice' about something like that. I, myself, never do more than 1/4 to a little less than 1/2 squats with any 'real' weight and even then I take 'great' care to stretch out, warm up, and start out light before I get a little heavier.

    If I did what the woman in the video is doing I'd need knee surgery after the first or second set? lol
    Of course some people will tolerate squats better than others. I have had three knee surgeries, and so I am extremely sensitive to any stress on the knees. Running is immediately painful as so I have stopped running entirely. Yet (butt-to-the-floor) squatting is fine; I do approx. 100 squats in each circuit. Skipping rope is also O.K., as is kicking (with a few exceptions).

  23. #113

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanjoachim View Post
    I'd rephrase that to: "it is critical to stop running when you feel real pain". "Real pain" meaning anything more than just uncomfortable or sore or burning muscles.
    Actually, I would say that "anything more than just uncomfortable or sore or burning muscles" is better described as something wrong, because burning muscles are real pain. For example, last night I did mostly heavy bag work. Of course if you throw 1000 left jabs you will finish with a burning shoulder, but underneath that pain there was also something "wrong" happening so I stopped what I was doing. I have a chronic shoulder injury that was less painful but more worrisome than the burn. Its pretty good today because I stopped immediately. If I had gone a few more rounds I am sure it would be killing me now.

  24. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanjoachim View Post
    I suppose it depends on the person. We've got women and men ranging from 20 years old up past 50 doing all sorts of squats.

    If you have the right form, and the right weight, there's really not that much pressure going on your knees. If you do it right, most of the pressure is actually on your thighs and calves (I don't know the specific muscle groups off the top of my head).
    Yes, good form is critical. I think if the motion is slow and controlled, and you work up very slowly starting from bodyweight

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6ZE3...eature=related

    then most people will tolerate squats just fine. Again, for me, squats are incomparably easier on the knees than running.

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    Been working like crazy and sleeping like 3 to 4 hours a night, so I have no energy to work out. Don't even have time to shower. Today is the 3rd day no shower. Maybe tomorrow I'll take a shower and get some sleep and then wake up at 11 and do a nice big workout!
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    I've been wondering about you Las...how've you been lately after your surgery?
    Quote Originally Posted by MrNightly View Post
    "Dr Dunn admitted that his research could also be interpreted as evidence that women are shallower than men. He said: "Let's face it - there's evidence to support it."
    Quote Originally Posted by mystik610 View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanjoachim View Post
    I'd rephrase that to: "it is critical to stop running when you feel real pain". "Real pain" meaning anything more than just uncomfortable or sore or burning muscles.
    I'm beginning to think my pain problem is just arthritis, which has been diagnosed before in my knees. It comes and goes under normal conditions but I think the running has really aggravated it. It can get debilitating and hurt just as bad as any tear or sprain.
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    P90x Shoulders & Arms; Ab Ripper X

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    I tried out slow-carb diet starting about 3 weeks ago and so far I'm down 12lbs... not bad, for a diet where I can still eat all the steak and grilled fish & chicken I want and never starve myself :D
    Last edited by ysss; 04-06-2011 at 09:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dragon1952 View Post
    I'm beginning to think my pain problem is just arthritis, which has been diagnosed before in my knees. It comes and goes under normal conditions but I think the running has really aggravated it. It can get debilitating and hurt just as bad as any tear or sprain.
    That is your sign to change what you are doing, and change it NOW. Cycling, skipping rope, and squats are all excellent alternatives to running in your case. My knees are so damaged that I simply cannot run, but can tolerate all the above exercises. Cycling in particular is good to lubricate the knee before moving on to other exercises. Kicking, if you are able, is an alternative to the warm-up provided by cycling.
    Arthritic knees can lose mobility in both the ability to flex/bend and the ability to extend/straighten the knee. The use of a stationary bike has been demonstrated to be effective in improving knee mobility. The easy repetitive motion of the knee that occurs with stationary biking stimulates production of synovial fluid, the natural lubricant of the knee. Riding a stationary bike 10 to 15 minutes on a regular basis can keep the joint lubricated and improve the ability of the knee to bend.

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