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  1. #1

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    Default Streaming Lossless Audio - Best Device?

    OK, so let's say that I'm less than impressed with the sound quality even on lossless audio with Apple TV. The overall functionality of that device is great and I may keep it, but the audio streaming is fairly poor, so I want something else.

    Requirements:

    1 - Needs to be able to stream both compressed and lossless audio.
    2 - Needs to do a good job with lossless audio. I may not get something as good as a high end CD player, but would like acceptable quality on lossless audio, something I could use in all but the most critical listening conditions
    3 - Needs to be something I can can control with my iPad, so where I can browse the library on that device and hit play and have it play through my main HT system.

    That last requirement is why I bought the Apple TV, but the Apple TV fails in requirement #2.

    The only thing I've heard of along these lines is the Squeezebox, but I don't know much about it and it if meets all 3 requirements.
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

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  2. #2

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    squeezebox(touch, original, Duet), Sonos and the Olive O2M

    all 3 have Iapps that allow you to control them and all have high quality streaming. I have heard part of the AppleTV issue is that its not bit perfect, though i'm not sure how much that affects the actual quality b/c i haven't tried it.
    HT - game room
    Yamaha RX V665 - AVR, Polk Monitor 60's,(HT), Polk Monitor 40's, Polk CS 1, Polk PSW 505, Samsung PN50B550 - 50" Plasma, PS3, Wii

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    Squeezebox Touch->AQ Alpha Snake->Music Hall A15.2->Ascend Acoustics Sierra-1
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  3. #3

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    Are you going to be using an external DAC or playing analog out?

    Transport: Oppo BDP-103/USB HDD (flac)
    DAC/Preamp: Benchmark DAC/PRE
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  4. #4

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    I really like using my Netbook -> USB to an external DAC for streaming from my NAS and pandora, etc

    Jason
    2-Channel - So far...
    Pre: Dodd ELP
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  5. #5

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    For now I'll be using the DACs in my Pioneer Elite AVR, may add a DAC later on. Either that or I can go analog, I suppose it depends on the device. That Sonos is nice but I'd be looking at $500 to get up and running with one of those.

    My music server is in another room, so need somethat that work wirelessly. Basically I want an Apple TV, that sounds good, which apparently does not exist.
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

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    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

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  6. #6

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    The Sonos is very appealing....

    Transport: Oppo BDP-103/USB HDD (flac)
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  7. #7

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    It sure does, I just wish they had a product that left out all the speakers and such so that I could just use it to stream and save me some cash.
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

    Bedroom System
    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
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  8. #8

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    Two choices come to mind

    1). Fileshare App with the Ipad. Allows you to share your music directly with the Ipad from PC. Streams directly to the Ipad, so you can connect it to your home audio/video system. Works with video also.

    2). Squeezebox Touch with the Ipad app Squeezepad. Allows you to see all your music on the Touch, see art etc. Create a playlist on the go, save it in the squeezepad app. So much it can it blows my mind. I use it outdoors when jamming the Atrium 60's.

    Check out both.
    Shoot the jumper.....................BALLIN.............!!!! !

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  9. #9

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    With the SB, can I view music on the iPad and have it play through the SB into my receiver like I can with the Apple TV, or how does that work?
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

    Bedroom System
    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
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  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by AsSiMiLaTeD View Post
    It sure does, I just wish they had a product that left out all the speakers and such so that I could just use it to stream and save me some cash.
    Can't you just buy the ZP90 and the remote (or cell phone app)?

    Transport: Oppo BDP-103/USB HDD (flac)
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  11. #11

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    actually the Sonos can be started at just the cost of the Zp90 or used zp80 ,if you can find it, you don't need to buy the controller since you plan on using an Idevice (ipad,ipod,iphone) with it. this is a moot point though if the sonos won't be near the router. then you will need the zone bridge which would put it at closer to $500 to start. I'm currently happy with my laptop to USB dac, but If I ever decide to multiroom or take my computer out of it sonos will be right up there with the SB.

  12. #12

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    Logitech Squeeze Box products are superb!

    http://www.logitech.com/en-us/speake...-music-systems

    I currently have the Touch, Classic, and Squeeze Radio

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  13. #13

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    Does wireless have the bandwidth for lossless? And with error correction?

  14. #14

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    A friend of mine uses his iPad to control a NAS that feeds an external DAC. He uses iTunes too, but I'm unsure what other apps are needed.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    Does wireless have the bandwidth for lossless? And with error correction?
    Huh? It streams lossless, no issues of error correction or dropouts, etc. I've compared a cdp transport and the Touch using the same external dac and I heard ZERO difference. I was a huge skeptic a few years ago and I am convinced with a nice exteral dac you can meet or exceed a cdp easily.

    I am a complete convert

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Face View Post
    A friend of mine uses his iPad to control a NAS that feeds an external DAC. He uses iTunes too, but I'm unsure what other apps are needed.
    Nothing else needed. Computer, itunes, iPad/iPhone/iPod touch with the Apple remote app (free).

  17. #17

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    I'm finding a few versions of the Squeezebox and am wondering if anyone has expreience with these and knows which one may be better.

    I've found the Boom and Radio (I think those are out). I've also come across the Duet, Touch, and what's being referring to as the original, and i think there may be different versions of that.

    I'm reading several bad reviews on the Duet on Amazon, seems that the Classic seems to be the way to go if I can find the v3.

    Any thoughts?
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

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  18. #18

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    The Boom is wireless boom box that is portable and plays in stereo, sounds better than a Bose Wave Radio. Internet radio or streams from your music server.

    The Radio, is a table top mono two way (bass and treble drivers) radio, again something that is portable. I use mine as a clock radio since it has sleep settings and alarm settings and I can stream internet radio or all my music on my music server in the bedroom.

    The Duet is basically the same as the Classic except the remote control has an LCD screen that shows art work and what ever text info would be shown on the Classic's screen which is usually across the room.

    The Touch has a larger built in (color) screen on the actual unit that shows art work and is generally clearer and larger than the text based screen on the Classic. It also has slightly better internal dac's and you can plug in a USB device. It's also Touch activated whe not using the remote, the Classic and Duet are not.

    Don't go singularly by Amazon reviews. My brother had a Duet which a forum friend now has and not a single issue from either or them. If you have a iPod or Android phone there is an app that will give you the same control and features as the Duet remote. It will run all the Squeeze products actually.

    iPeng for Apple; Squeeze Commander for Android.

    H9
    Last edited by heiney9; 03-30-2011 at 03:36 PM.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by AsSiMiLaTeD View Post

    I'm reading several bad reviews on the Duet on Amazon, seems that the Classic seems to be the way to go if I can find the v3.

    Any thoughts?
    v2 and v3 do exactly the same thing and have the exact same size display except the v2 is longer and more slender the v3 is taller and more square. They are identical except for aesthetics.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  20. #20

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    Yeah the control with the app is what I'm looking for. I could care less about the sb remote because I'll be using the iPad for all that.

    I'm gonna try to find a Classic 2 or 3 and if not I'll spend more and get the Duet.

    Thanks for all the help.
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

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    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
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  21. #21

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    Why the Duet if you could careless about the remote. The only thing different about the Duet over the Classic versions is the LCD remote. If are using an app for an Apple or Android product don't pay for the Duet.

    I'd get the Touch since it has a nice screen display.

    EDIT- you can't buy the Duet receiver w/o the controller

    H9
    Last edited by heiney9; 03-30-2011 at 03:44 PM.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  22. #22

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    Exactly my thoughts, the Duet is only an alternative if I can't find a Classic...which is harder than you'd think
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

    Bedroom System
    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
    27" iMac w/Amarra, AudioQuest Dragonfly 1.2, Focal XS Book, Schiit Valhalla, Cypher Labs Theorem 720, Philips Fidelio X1, Sennheiser HD600, HiFiMan HE-500, B&W P7, LG 47LM7600, Sony PS3, Apple TV

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by AsSiMiLaTeD View Post
    Exactly my thoughts, the Duet is only an alternative if I can't find a Classic...which is harder than you'd think
    I'm not getting it. You don't want the remote because you have an iPad yet the Duet is your second choice . Why would you pay double for soemthing you don't even want.

    I would say finding a Classic will be easier.........I assume you mean buying used. The Touch is $100 cheaper than the Duet of which you already said you have no use for.

    I have a Classic that is sort of for sale. The deal fell through and I'm thinking I could possibly have a use for it in my new house. The only problem with it is the digital coax out doesn't work anymore. It still has Toslink out as well as the analog outputs. I've always used the Toslink for my stand alone dac. I also have a Boulder modded ELPAC linear power supply for it which really makes an improvement.

    If you are at all interested let me know. I would sell them as a package deal since I'd have no use for the ELPAC w/o the Classic.

    http://www.boldercables.com/servlet/...squeeze/Detail

    The mod itself is $125 and you supply the ELPAC. When you could get ELPAC's the were about $100.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  24. #24

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    Review in Affordable Audio of v3 and stock and MODDED ELPAC

    http://www.affordableaudio.org/aa2007-09.pdf

    H9
    Last edited by heiney9; 03-30-2011 at 04:24 PM.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  25. #25

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    Here's what I'm doing and it has given me outstanding results. I'm using J River Media Server on the computer and I stream it via my router and cat5 cable (but it will also work wireless) to an Apple Airport Express. Then from there to a DAC via toslink. Sound quality is on par with my Rotel RCD855 with tube output. My son's newest generation Ipod can control it. J River is by far the best PC based media server I've used. It will even upconvert to 24/192 and beyond if you have a dac that can accept it. The dac I'm using is the best bang for buck dac I've ever used as well. Super DAC Pro 707. It handles usb, toslink, and coax. It came with cables for all three. It's tiny but sounds superb and best of all it's around $100. The results I'm getting are fantastic.
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  26. #26

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    Actually on Amazon the Duet is cheaper than the Touch, which is why I had it second in line if I cannot find a Classic. The Duet is $220 and the Touch is $290

    Yeah I'd never use the remote on the Duet, I'd likely just throw it in the box and never use it.

    Your classic is probably going to be higher end than what I'm looking for with the modded PS, but I'll PM you anyway.

    Thanks again

    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    I'm not getting it. You don't want the remote because you have an iPad yet the Duet is your second choice . Why would you pay double for soemthing you don't even want.

    I would say finding a Classic will be easier.........I assume you mean buying used. The Touch is $100 cheaper than the Duet of which you already said you have no use for.

    I have a Classic that is sort of for sale. The deal fell through and I'm thinking I could possibly have a use for it in my new house. The only problem with it is the digital coax out doesn't work anymore. It still has Toslink out as well as the analog outputs. I've always used the Toslink for my stand alone dac. I also have a Boulder modded ELPAC linear power supply for it which really makes an improvement.

    If you are at all interested let me know. I would sell them as a package deal since I'd have no use for the ELPAC w/o the Classic.

    http://www.boldercables.com/servlet/...squeeze/Detail

    The mod itself is $125 and you supply the ELPAC. When you could get ELPAC's the were about $100.

    H9
    Main HT
    Magnepan 1.6QR fronts, POlk R15 surrounds, Pioneer SC-25, Parasound Halo A23, Oppo BDP-105, Panasonic TC-P60ZT60, Sony PS3, Apple TV

    Bedroom System
    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
    27" iMac w/Amarra, AudioQuest Dragonfly 1.2, Focal XS Book, Schiit Valhalla, Cypher Labs Theorem 720, Philips Fidelio X1, Sennheiser HD600, HiFiMan HE-500, B&W P7, LG 47LM7600, Sony PS3, Apple TV

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by AsSiMiLaTeD View Post
    The Duet is $220 and the Touch is $290

    Yeah I'd never use the remote on the Duet, I'd likely just throw it in the box and never use it.

    Your classic is probably going to be higher end than what I'm looking for with the modded PS, but I'll PM you anyway.

    Thanks again
    Are you sure the Duet you're looking at is for the whole unit and not just the controller?

    The Duet retails for $399 so if it's $220 that's an incredible price. The Duet controller retails for $299 and the $220 is much more likely to be for the controller only. Not too many retail outlets carry these and they are current so no reason to blow them out.

    The $290 is about the normal discount for the Touch which retails at $299.

    Shoot me a PM when you get a chance...........it might be just what you're looking for at the right price.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  28. #28

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    I sent you a PM
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    Polk Blackstone TL3, Polk PSWi225 Wireless Sub, HK 3490 Integrated, Oppo BDP-103, Sharp Aquos 32" TV, Apple TV

    Office Rig
    27" iMac w/Amarra, AudioQuest Dragonfly 1.2, Focal XS Book, Schiit Valhalla, Cypher Labs Theorem 720, Philips Fidelio X1, Sennheiser HD600, HiFiMan HE-500, B&W P7, LG 47LM7600, Sony PS3, Apple TV

  29. #29

    Member Sales Rating: (10)

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Magnolia, NJ
    Posts
    4,083

    Default

    Loving my SONOS system!!! Highly recommended. ZP90 for my system, ZP120 for the deck speakers, S5 speaker for the dining room, CR200 (two) one controller for downstairs & one for upstairs. You know you hit a home run when your wife compliments it.
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "
    Panny 65" 3D Plasma
    Yamaha AVENTAGE RX-A3010 AVR
    D>SONIC M2-600M mono's / mains
    Rotel RMB-1095 / 5 channel amp
    Rotel RMB-1075 / 5 channel amp
    TEAC UD - 501 DAC
    Oppo BDP-93
    SONOS System
    KEF Q900 / mains
    KEF Q600 / center
    KEF Q800 / surrounds
    KEF Q100 / rear surr.
    Def Tech ProMonitor 1000 / front & rear presence
    Velodyne SPL-1200R subs / dual pair
    DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033 sub EQ
    Equitech Balanced Power Son of Q 1.5R
    Extensive room treatments

  30. #30

    Member Sales Rating: (0)

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Brownsburg, Indiana
    Posts
    9,683

    Default

    Personally I just decided to build a HTPC so I can use it to stream my FLAC and also play my DVD's and blu-rays that will be stored on my computer.

    Unfortunately that setup costs more than most of the suggested products here, but in my case offers more flexibility.

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