Yamaha RX-V2400 vs. Denon 3803!

[hamzahsh]

The new Yamaha RX-V2400 seems to be a better receiver than Denon 3803 for the money. It has almost everything and even more than Denon 3803 has. I posted a question if it uses 24/192kHz Burr-Brown DACs and one of the users at HometheaterSpot.com said when he inquired Yamaha Canada they said the F/C/R channel uses Burr-Brown and the rest is Yamaha.

Also the Yamaha is upgrading there receivers for DPLIIx for free. All RX-V1400 and RX-V2400 in mid December of this year will have DPLIIx.

The YPAO feature is cool it will calibrate your 7.1 system in no time. Denon 3803 is missing this great feature. I heard it comes with a microphone and you can also use it as a SPL meter too. The power cord at the back of the unit is detachable but not in Denon. I love detachable because you can always replace it if it wears out or damage.

It also does the video upconversion through component monitor out like Denon. It also has THX Surround EX processing. The variable crossover is also great from 40-200hz. RS232 for future upgrade. Built quality is also solid. Before Yamaha always turned me down for there fixed 90hz crossover and being 6.1 only.

I'm still waiting for Denon 3804 for next year and will compare it again.

One user said he went to buy Denon 3803 and when he compared it to Yamaha RX-V1400 he had a hard time deciding but when he compared both for jazz music. He loved Yamaha. It tells me that Yamaha is great for both HT and music. Yahoo!

I'm leaned totally on RX-V2400 but still waiting for 3804. See if it can beat this RX-V2400.

I'm not putting Denon 3803 down but its not worth buying for the money when compared to Yamaha RX-V2400 its got killer specs. and the price is great too.

The RX-V2400 is a winner! Its funny that I always wrote Denon 3803 is a winner but now Yamaha finally beat it.

Will I be a YAMMY! :D

http://www.yamaha.com/yec/products/R...XV2400_lit.PDF

[fireshoes]

I definitely enjoy mine, although I need to add an amp at some point for my LSi's, but I'm just in an apartment so I don't go too awfully loud. YPAO is very cool too.

I talked to a Denon rep at work today and he said they will release the upgrade as the 3805, with it debuting at CES in January and shipping in March/April. Supposed to bump up about 15 watts per channel and they are experimenting with something similar to YPAO. It will be priced at $1199. He wasn't at liberty to say anything else.

By the way, for the Denon 2900 owners around here, he had a nifty trick. He said on all Denon dvd players, when you put a dvd in, while it is loading press stop stop play and the disc will go straight to the movie and bypass all the FBI warning crap. Neat!

[hamzahsh]

Thanks fireshoes!

Looks like I'm going to need lot of your help. I've couple of questions for you, if you don't mind.

1. Please tell me where Yamaha RX-V2400 is Made In?

2. Online PDF file doesn't state if it uses 24/192kHz Burr-Brown DACs. Please check in the manual or if you know for sure if it uses BB DACs.

3. Do you have DPLIIx?

4. How you like the sound coming out from your Polks. Do you highly recommend this receiver over Denon 3803.

5. How do you define sound of RX-V2400, Is it very detailed, clean and crisp. I love the sound of "Breaking Glass" and I want to listen every single piece of it.

6. How Jazz and Classical music sounds on this receiver?

7. How much did you pay for it?


Thanks fireshoes for your help and I really appreciate.

:)

[dave shepard]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by fireshoes
[B]
I talked to a Denon rep at work today and he said they will release the upgrade as the 3805, with it debuting at CES in January and shipping in March/April. Supposed to bump up about 15 watts per channel and they are experimenting with something similar to YPAO. It will be priced at $1199. He wasn't at liberty to say anything else.

I am assuming that this will be what replaces the 3803. What benefit will it have besides the extra power, higher detail in the sound? Does Denon do upgrades on there recievers?

[fireshoes]

Mine is made in Malaysia.

It does not have PLIIx since it was from the first shipment we got. Yamaha will upgrade it for free, but you do have to pay one way shipping I believe.

I have not heard for sure what type of DACs it uses, other than being 192/24. I do like the sound of it. Closest thing to jazz and classical I listened to on it so far has been Steely Dan's Aja on vinyl. ;)

Regarding how much I paid, it is difficult to say for sure. I work at a retailer, and I won an RXV740 in a sales contest, which I traded in for store credit to purchase my RXV2300, which I later traded in again for the 2400. I would estimate about $300 or so I guess.

Dave, the only upgrades from Denon I've heard about have been on their flagship receivers in the past, like the 5800. I'm sure the 3805 will have PLIIx and some sort of room optimizer because YPAO on Yamaha is selling a lot of customers. Both make really good receivers though, and I doubt many people would be disappointed with either choice. I saw on avsforum that people were getting upgrade deals at 6ave on the Yamaha's like you got on the 3803, so if you really have to have one of the features the deals are out there. (ie. You want the 2300 and they give you the 2400).

[pjdami]

I have owned two Yamaha receivers (and still own one .. its ten years old and still kickin). I am still loyal to them. Yamaha makes a nice receiver that is built like a tank and made to last. Excellent reliability as well.

Its nice to see Yamaha putting out some better receivers in the past couple of years. This is a turn to the better. They seem to still be a bit on the forward side for my listening preferences but not nearly as bright as a few years ago. I haven't listened to the new RX-VN4NN line but they sure do look great and many positive reviews. Also great to see that they finally give the users a variable LFE crossover (one feature that my RX-V1300 lacked).

For the money you pay, Yamaha is hard to beat. Denon makes a great product as well. Personal preference here as well as listening environment will dictate which one best works with your setup.

Paul

[hamzahsh]

Thanks fireshoes for the answers.:)

[fireshoes]

Yeah, but did you see the 500 x 2 amp they are making now?

[fireshoes]

Oh yeah, the Denon rep also said they were going to make some really high end seperates also. The stack will run about $25000 and I think will include a 7-channel amp, audio and video processors, and a dvd transport.

[mantis]

The new rxv2400 is great.Yamaha needed to step it up alot.They have been lacking for years now.Denon has b een running wild on them.

Comparing the 2,I'd still say the Denon is a better receiver.Sound quality the Denon in my opnion is easier to listen to.The Yamaha ios still very bright.

this is the first year Yamaha is using THX processing.They also dropped alot of DSP modes,which in my opnion was a wate of money in the first place.

Power wise they Yamaha is very dynamic and clean.If they could just tame down there excessive highs,they would be right there with Denon now that they have correct multiroom and 7.1 theater.THX is a big bonus but still not enough to chop the top dog down.

Denon wins here,
with Polk series speakers,Denon mates alot better then Yamaha.Polk rt series speakers over the years have been noted to be on the bright side.Bright and bright don't mix.Put this in a LIVE room and bleeding ears you will have.

Denon all day.

Mantis the Receiver specialist

[hamzahsh]

Thanks Mantis, What I've heard that both Denon and Yamaha are very bright receivers. Denon is great for HT only but for music it lacks a little bit. Yamaha is great for both but still bright too. Which is great for my use. I need a receiver which can deliver lot of detail in the sound and same time slightly warmer for the music as well. I found the bright sound as a clean sound vs. warm sound to be muddy. Yamaha RX-V2400 fills all the gaps over Denon 3803 and is a perfect choice to buy something which gets you the most bang out of your buck.

Sound wise both are best, no one can go wrong with either. Yamaha wins overall in features and beats Denon in the competition.

I heard that Harman Kardon, Outlaw Pre/Pro, NAD are best choice for Polk users. If they listen both music and watch music. 50/50. But my use HT 80%, 20% Music. Beside I love bright sound. Clean and Detailed! but same time features play big role in calibration too. THX SURROUND EX and DPLIIx is a huge plus. YPAO is killer. Yamaha looks more advanced and 1 level higher here.

Yamaha RX-V2400 is a superior receiver and lot of receiver for the money than Denon 3803. 3803 lacks lot of useful features. I reviewed Denon 3803 more than anyone and Denon always came out a winner but recently the new Yamaha came out a true winner, hands down. I finally found that the Yamaha's Digital TOP Art Technology uses Burr-Brown DACs RX-V2400 uses BB DACs. One user inquired Yamaha Canada and said F/C/R uses BB and rest uses Yamaha DACs. Well Denon uses BB too, 2 per channel great but how about other things?

The use of 24/192kHz Burr-Brown DACs, THX SURROUND EX 7.1, DPLIIx, YPAO speaker calibration. Easy Remote control, Re-Eualizer. Inlet- type detactable power cord. Front panel has S-Video and Composite connection for Digital Cameras and Camcorders. Plus everything what Denon got.

Yamaha has plethora of features and price is right too. I'm sure the new Denon 3805 will be a great one but between these 2 AVRs I choose Yamaha RX-V2400.

Man I love this Yammie, I'll buy RX-V2400 in 3-4 from now for sure.:D

[mantis]

Cool deal,
I think you might have your facts alittle mixed up unless your stating purely opnion.

Denon is in fact a warmer sounding receiver company then Yamaha.Denon also does music better,no alot better then Yamaha.

The real deal here really isn't what receiver is better and why,it's all about buying the correct reciever for your setup.

I fully believe that Denon is better suited for Polk rt series speakers.

Yamaha sounds much better when mated with Mirage speakers,any series.

If Yamaha is in your soul, then man go get it.

[hamzahsh]

You have a point mantis,

The new rti line-up from RTi70 and ahead are using silk dome tweeter. In other words bright speakers.

I have RT800i, CS400i, and F/X1000 series which are older and use Tri-laminate tweeter. In other words warm sound speakers.

Denon and Yamaha are both bright receivers. Denon and Yamaha sounds great with older RTi series because they are warm speakers. If someone has new Polk RTi speakers then both receivers are not a great choice. They they have to look into Outlaw, NAD, HK,
Marantz, Sunfire, Onkyo. (Receivers with Cirrus Logic's Crystal 24/192kHz DACs.) Burr-Brown 24/192kHz are bright DACs and Denon, Yamaha and Pioneer uses BB DACs.

BRIGHGT + BRIGHT =Doesn't mate well.

BRIGHT + WARM = Mates well.

[bigsexy1]

While I don't always agree with Dan about each and every single thing, I do have to here in this case, and that comes from actual experience. I had a Yamaha 2092 receiver matched up with a set of Polks with the older tri-lams. It was too harsh by far. At Dan's suggestion, replaced the Yammy with a Denon 3802, big, big improvement, and the harshness was tamed, so he was right.
Also, to me, the older tri-lam tweets are much brighter than the series which replaced them (which included the 70s, 150s, etc, not the newest series with the Vifas).

[pjdami]

I agree as well. The way I hear it, the tri-lams are brighter sounding than the silk domes which replaced them.

Ham, its your rig though bud and if it "tickles your fancy" then that is all that matters. Some people just prefer it that way. I know people that have Yamaha on Klipsch and love the way it sounds and that's just the way they like it.

I think you have received enough advice by now. Let your ears and musical taste be the deciding factor.

[Emlyn]

I agree with Mantis, of course, on the Denon vs. Yamaha sound quality for music. For movies, I can't tell much difference.

Receiver manufacturers target each other's receivers in the same price range, and the Yamaha 2400 is obviously targeted to compete well with last year's Denon 3803. If I had to choose right now between a Denon 3803 and Yamaha 2400, I'd probably still pick the Denon because it sounds so good to me for music with Polk's RTi speakers. I still have my Yamaha HTR-5280 and it has been rock solid, but then so has every other piece of A/V equipment I've bought in the last 20 years.

There are a few things I like about the Yamaha 2400 more than the 3803: front panel inputs, with a digital optical jack; removable power cord; and more crossover points.

There are a few things I don't like: the Yamaha has a cooling fan built in, suggestive of inadequate heat sinks; Yamaha's funky yellow display has always been a turn-off for me because it doesn't match anything else I have; component video monitor out goes to 60MHz rather than 100MHz (shouldn't be noticeable though); no PureDirect mode for two channel music that turns off video circuitry and front panel; no AL24 processing which can make a cheap CD player sound more expensive than it really is.

All in all, I think Yamaha has played catch-up pretty well in this game and has added some appealing features to compete with the other manufacturers. The YPAO type of processing has been done by Harman Kardon and Pioneer before. Reviews of their systems showed the settings to be off from those of an SPL meter by a couple of decibels. YPAO is newer though, so maybe it won't have that problem. The equalization seems to be something new I haven't seen before though. Whoever is doing Yamaha's home theater product planning now is doing a great job.

[hamzahsh]

Seems like nobody supports Yamaha in this forum except 'fireshoes'. The majority in Polk forum supports Denon.

Now I'm really confused and stuck between these two receivers. I watch 95% movies and listen 5% music. I read lot of complains about Denon 3803 where people said its very thin, bright and harsh sounding receiver, especially with Polk speakers. HK, NAD and Outlaw are very warm and best suited for Polks. I don't know which AVR is right or wrong. Totally confused!

I was happy to buy this new Yamaha RX-V2400 and now I'm sad.:(

[pjdami]

Ham,

Don't be sad dude. You can do something about this that will make you happy.

Go to your local stores that sell Yamaha and / or Denon and ask them if you can demo the receivers that you like. If they don't provide demos then make sure you can return the receiver that you don't like and get your money back. I've done it a bunch of times before. Do a head to head contest with each receiver on your speakers in your house.

You really need to listen to both and make up your mind for yourself. People here have given you good advice; this advice is now making you second guess but from rereading the thread you have not listened to either receiver yet?

Be confident, walk out that door when you are ready, buy both receivers (if you cannot demo) making sure you can return the one you don't like, and have a battle .. war .. showdown ... that's the fun part and it will make you happy because you will know for sure that you have made the right decision.

P.

[hamzahsh]

Thanks pjdami,

You're right, I haven't listened to either of the receiver. I'll buy Yamaha first and test with my speakers. I'll also make sure if its returnable. I'm planning to go with my brother tomorrow to buy Yamaha RX-V2400. See what's happen.

I'll let my ears decide.

[fireshoes]

I know everyone loves Denon here, but when I did a comparison, I simply preferred the Yamaha hands down. I actually liked the RXV3300 (then $1499) better than the Denon 5803. I wasn't expecting to, but I did. The RXZ1 was on another level entirely. In the end, the other people's opinions don't mean anything because you are the one that will be listening to it. Now if you do your comparison and decide you like Denon, that's okay too, because I'll still like my Yamaha better. ;)

This isn't saying I'm Yamaha 4 Life or anything. If something comes out that I like better, then I'll switch to it. It just happens to be Yamaha right now.

[Terrax]

I'm with you fireshoes, I have liked Yamaha products for around ten years now. And as far as Yamaha receivers sounding bright, I have have found that the ones I have used (which are, RX-V 870, RX-V 490, and now my RX-V3300) sound anything but bright. And the RX-V 870 is roughly ten years old. Listening to my Polks when powered by my Yamahas, the sound is very laid back, mellow sounding. I find myself wanting to turn up the treble as a result. It really amazes me how some are of an opinion that Yamaha products seem to sound harsh or bright sounding. And believe me, I happen to like bright, detailed sound. Also, as I do believe Denon makes awesome products, when I was shoping for my new receiver, I compared Denon to Yamaha very closely. The biggest factor I found when comparing, was the "quote, unquote" "build quality". I looked at every aspect of this, the heft, the material i.e. how easy the incasing metal was prone to bending by using pressure, faceplates, connectors, the finish, and IMO, the Yamaha RX-V 3300 won hands down against the Denon 3803. Sound wise, I sooooooo much more perferred the 3300 than the 3803. Feature wise, again, the 3300. Bearing in mind, the 3300 was last years 2nd from the top receiver, right below the RX-Z1.

Yes, there are more Denon supporters here than Yamaha, but don't let that be a factor in making your choice. Denon's are awesome, but so is Yamaha's. But no matter what choice you make, please don't make a choice based on the crowd. Go with your heart, and you won't be disappointed.

Regards,

Terry

[mantis]

The real deal...

in the end it doesn't matter what others think.It's about what you think my man.

You have to be happy with what you buy.

You can go with experience or do it alone....your call

Denon is not a bright receiver.Yamaha is.

Yamaha has done a great job but they still lack.

Denon is the most solid all around reciever on the market today,yesterday and untill someone else comes along to claim...Denon is king here...............period.

Like Yamaha???Cool dude go with it.

Dan

[hamzahsh]

I bought the Yamaha RX-V1400 today!

Hooked up everything with banana plugs. I've 5 speakers only. I'll buy another 2 polk speakers for the rear surround.

Wow I'm amazed with the sound quality. No hiss, no interference, cleanest sound. The more I turn up better and better it gets.

The sound is warm and mellow on the music and movies have no harshness at all. Lot of power man! I'm listening on everything -db. Crystal clear detail, I'm listening every single piece of glass.

This new Yamaha receiver mates perfect with Polk speakers. Maybe the old Yamahas were bright. This one is not.

Yes, I've a DPLIIx, Wow!

I paid CDN. $1200 total including taxes. I took the 4 months no interest, no payment, no admin fee plan. The sale ends tomorrow. I'm glad I made the right choice. The receiver has everything you need. Yes I listened it in the store.

Love it, killer sound with killer bass. Movies finally come alive. My Technics SA-DX940 look like a little kid now.

I'm testing it now!

:p

[Terrax]

FANTASTIC!, I'm happy for ya man. You sound excited, so it looks like you have some great listening ahead of you. Enjoy! And congratulations.

Terry

[dorokusai]

Congrat's on your new purchase, glad to hear you are immediately happy. Yamaha 1, Denon 0 :D

[hamzahsh]

Thanks everybody for the help. Now, I finally have a killer system. Just need to buy 2 pair of polks for the rear surround and the 46" Toshiba HX83.

Trust me guys, listen to this reciever on Polks, you'll love it. This receiver has killer sound, its not bright or thin or harsh, its clean and mellow, sweet sounding receiver.. Built like a tank. THX SURROUND EX rocks and DPLIIx!

Remote control is outstanding!

I'm a Yammy! Yummie;)

:D

[hamzahsh]

While testing I came through something called "DIRECT STEREO" same as "Pure Direct" in Denon. The circuitry shuts-off and front-panel display dims. It sounds dam clean and pure. PCM rocks for CDs.

Ahhhhh mellow sound and very soothing.
I tried Jazz and Pop. Wow 2 thumps-up.

;)

[polkatese]

Congrats, Hamzah! sounds like you are digging your new yammie! have plenty of fun....

[phoneisbusy]

Originally posted by hamzahsh
Thanks everybody for the help. Now, I finally have a killer system. Just need to buy 2 pair of polks for the rear surround and the 46" Toshiba HX83.

Trust me guys, listen to this reciever on Polks, you'll love it. This receiver has killer sound, its not bright or thin or harsh, its clean and mellow, sweet sounding receiver.. Built like a tank. THX SURROUND EX rocks and DPLIIx!

Remote control is outstanding!

I'm a Yammy! Yummie;)

:D

Sweet! Are you going to check out the GTA Toshiba warehouse sale on the 6th then? A friend in TO was taunting me about it. He mentioned that there were HX83's available. Don't know if they were refurbs though.

regards

Dave

[hamzahsh]

Originally posted by phoneisbusy
Sweet! Are you going to check out the GTA Toshiba warehouse sale on the 6th then? A friend in TO was taunting me about it. He mentioned that there were HX83's available. Don't know if they were refurbs though.

regards

Dave

I really have no clue about that. I work at Best Buy and we sell it so I can roughly save about $600 CDN. through my staff purchase. I've no plans to buy it now, untill I finish off my Yammie's payment.

I bought my Yamaha RX-V1400 yesterday from 2001 Audio/Video. The sale ends today. Best Buy only carries HTR-Series of Yamaha. RX series is a different world.

Normal price for RX-V1400 is $1199.99 CDN. But if you go to their store they'll give you discount. I got it for $1200 with tax!

Believe me this is one hell of a receiver!
:D