Pioneer customer service is a HUGE dissapointment

[Ronster267]

It is with great sadness that I have to relay my bad experience with Pioneer's customer service. I have had a VSX-1121-k since Dec. 2011. It has worked perfectly and sounded great. Today upon powering up it has no sound or video. I called customer service and after a lengthy hold talked to a guy with an attitude problem. He walked through the entire setup (talking to me like I was in grade school) and he tried to blame it on HDMI cables, but changing to brand new ones ( I had several ) didn't help. My call was then cut off. I called back and talked to a different rep, much nicer, and within minutes he determined that the HDMI board must be bad. I was then transferred to the warranty dept. who then told me I was out of luck, they couldn't help. Pioneer must be selling so many a/v receivers that they just don't care if they lose a loyal customer of 25 years.

[BlueFox]

Maybe they merged with the Sony repair center in Waco. Sounds similar to a Sony experience I had.

[gdb]

Is your Pioneer out of warranty ? Did Pio CS say that it couldn't be repaired, or, that they wouldn't fix it for free by waiving the warr. time limit ?

[jon s]

If the warranty expired, then Pioneer has no obligation to fix it for free. Unfortunately, that's just the way things works. If they make an exception and fix it for free, then you would expect them to fix it if other defects appear. Then you also create the issue of having person B said you got your fixed for free so why can't their unit be done gratis?

On a side note: I have owned Onkyo, Denon, Sony and Marantz products as well as Pioneer. I find that Denon , Onkyo and Marantz to have notably worse customer service than others. When you report a "common" problem thats posted all over the internet, they will always say that it's not a known issue to them.

[Tornado Red]

Should be a 2 year warranty, no? I do know that Pioneer is VERY picky about who you can buy from that will keep their warranty valid. You have to be an "authorized" dealer. I think they even pulled the rug out from under Amazon, did they not? I have them listed as "weasley".

[Ronster267]

They were more than willing to put me in touch with an authorized service center with any work done to be paid for by me. I wasn't expecting them to give me a refund, hell I would have been happy with a refurb. I guess I just expected them to try do SOMETHING to make me feel like they even cared. THEY DO NOT!!! I guess it's obvious why it only has a 1 year warranty.

[ken brydson]

Should be a 2 year warranty, no? I do know that Pioneer is VERY picky about who you can buy from that will keep their warranty valid. You have to be an "authorized" dealer. I think they even pulled the rug out from under Amazon, did they not? I have them listed as "weasley".

1 year on non Elite IIRC...

[Ronster267]

I'm not a moron, I guess I was hoping to be treated better. The gal in the warranty department was VERY unconcerned about losing a longtime customer. I was going to pull the trigger on an SC68 next week, now there is no way. Guess I'm going to switch to Yammy.

[F1nut]

What part of out of warranty don't you understand? If you think Yammy is going to be any different, you're kidding yourself.

As for Pioneer, I had an issue repaired by them, under warranty. Excellent experience all around.

[Ronster267]

F1nut, congratulations on being lucky enough to have your Pioneer fail within the warranty limit. Glad you had an "Excellent" experience. Are you telling me you were thrilled when you had to have it fixed? I have a 20yr old Pioneer receiver in my garage still going strong, and a 1016-k still working great after 5yrs. I love the Pioneer sound and have been a big proponent of them for years until now.

[ROHfan]

Emotiva offers a 5-year warranty on everything they sell and their customer service is second to none. Just sayin'.

[WilliamM2]

What part of out of warranty don't you understand? If you think Yammy is going to be any different, you're kidding yourself.

As for Pioneer, I had an issue repaired by them, under warranty. Excellent experience all around.

I've had Yamaha repair an item that was two years past warranty. No charge. Don't know if it's normal, but it does happen.

[gdb]

When I feel I need more than the standard warranty period, I'll spring for an extended one offered by third parties. Doing so has usually guaranteed that no problems will arise. (during the coverage period anyway)


http://www.squaretrade.com/

[Jhayman]

At least Yamaha gives you a 5 Year warranty on their Aventage line and 3 Year on others..
That shows at least to me they stand behind their product..
I had an issue with Sony years ago, it was a TV but still the tuner went in it exactly 1 month off warranty and they would not do anything either, needless to say I have never bought anything Sony again.

What part of out of warranty don't you understand? If you think Yammy is going to be any different, you're kidding yourself.

As for Pioneer, I had an issue repaired by them, under warranty. Excellent experience all around.

[Tornado Red]

1 year on non Elite IIRC...

ken is right, I stand corrected. Just got an SC-61 and it's 2 years, 1 year for non elite. Guess they'd be doing it out of 'good will' if they fixed it for you at this point. Be interesting to hear anyone else who had a similar experience to William's, problem being fixed outside of normal warranty...

[heartystatue]

I agree with gdb. I purchase the extended warranties on my big ticket items just for the worry factor after 1 year. I have only had to use it on a Mit big screen but was fixed for free and got 2 free bulbs. Just the bulbs paid for the warranty. It's a crapshoot these days anyway as after a year seems like something comes out bigger, badder and cheaper.

[F1nut]

You know, there will always be exceptions, but to expect it is not living in reality.

Are you telling me you were thrilled when you had to have it fixed?

Let's say one has to accept that it comes with the territory and the higher one climbs up the audio ladder, the more it happens. Murphy's Law.

[tonyb]

Well, not much you can do or blame Pioneer if it's out of warranty. Thats why there's a cut off date. You start making exceptions for 3 months out of warranty, then it gets to be why not 4...6 months, and never ends. Ever try getting your car worked on out of warranty ? Is it the dealers/ manufacturers fault ?

Sorry that happened to ya, bummer for sure, but maybe it's an easy fix. If not, look at the bright side you get to go shopping.

[mrbigbluelight]

Ronster, you mentioned " I called back and talked to a different rep, much nicer, and within minutes he determined that the HDMI board must be bad".

The second rep definitely treated you in a professional manner, as he/she should. That doesn't mean, however, that his/her diagnosis is correct.
Is it likely to be an HDMI-related problem ? Yes, IMO.
It could the problem is how the firmware deals with HDMI operation. It could be located in the physical firmware hardware (EEPROM ?) or firmware software (instructions).
Your description of how it was working perfectly than not working points to a "brain freeze", ie, firmware.
Firmware has "locked out" your HDMI ports (audio and video) and needs to tell them to "wake up".

You might care to try to reflash/reload your firmware. I'm not familiar with Pioneer's method to do this, all manufacturers are a little different. I'm sure they have instructions on how to perform this on their website. Not hard to do, d/l the latest firmware from the Pioneer website onto a flash drive, then follow their instructions.
Worse case ? Doesn't do anything.
Best case ? It does do something.

Pioneer isn't the only AVR manufacturer that is turning off consumers with their customer service, btw. Yamaha, Onkyo, all of them.
After reading boatloads of AVR forums while deciding on a cheap-o AVR for the hooligans downstairs, the major problem with AVRs seem to be HDMI-related. And the HDMI-related problem(s) are rooted in firmware. To be more correct, in written firmware instructions/codes. Now, Pioneer, Yamaha, Onkyo have (had ?) good reputations and they don't employ stupid people. The HDMI standards are pretty ... well, standardized. So what's gone wrong ? IMO, the firmware writers are chasing a rapidly moving target and are having a hard time keeping up. Everybody wants to be able to hook up anything and everything to their home entertainment centers: Ipod, Ipad, Iphone, Imax, Ican-opener, Iremote-car-starter.

Ronster, as you noted, your 20 year old Pioneer garage system is still plugging and chugging. The difference between then and now ? Your older Pio didn't have to deal with 15 (?) gig/sec HDMI bandwidth/handshake issues.

So try that reload firmware thing. It'll either work or won't.
If, in the process, your house burns down .... I was never here.

BTW: "Out of Warranty" does mean "Out of Warranty". Even for Emotiva products.

[mrbigbluelight]

Kuntasensei mentioned in another thread the HDMI organization.
He may have posted this link already (I'm too lazy to check ) but here's a little HDMI primer.

http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/H...r_tng_1112.htm

In their blurb, they request that consumers having HDMI related troubles report those troubles to them. Apparently they'll pull certification for that unit (or something) if the manufacturer doesn't respond to their inquiries.
Don't know if that's true or not. If it is, I don't see how Onkyo has any AVR's on the market if one goes by the number of online forum posts related to Onkyo HDMI problems. And that isn't brand bashing. What brand cheapo AVR came to the Instutute here via FedEx Monday ?
Onkyo.
Hey, for $129, here's your Onkyo HTR-590 (not the R509) 7.1 80 watt/channel AVR you refrigerator-raiding sons of .... guns. Master Chief better look/sound good enough, 'cause WYSIWYG !

[Ronster267]

Update... After assuming I had a 32 lb paperweight, I tore the cover off and sprayed the inside out with Misty circuit board cleaner including all the hdmi ports. By the way, there is an hdmi cable several inches long inside that looks to cost all of about several cents. Hooked up all cables and plugged it back in and it now works! Thank you for your insights Mrbigbluelight, I did update the firmware about a week ago. Don't know if that had anything to do with it but it may have. Still disappointed that Pioneer didn't even inquire about what firmware I'm running. Also not happy with their "Sorry you're having trouble, but we really don't care." attitude. Thanks again for all replies, even you F1nut.

[Toolfan66]

I love my Pioneer receivers.. Out of warranty? I will pay to have it fixed or have an excuse to upgrade.. I'm fine with both!!!



Just saying!!


Glad your up and running!!!

[Sherardp]

I had an issue with my Pio SC07 skipping with certain formats. Long story short, I contacted Pio back in the USA, they contacted personnel in Japan and had a rep come out to my house. The rep sat in my HT, uploaded all firmware, tested, had a Coke with me and went on his way. He did say my HT was kick ass and loved the Polk Speaker setup.

I guess it all depends on your local rep, try a different one if you can.

[Gatecrasher]

I'm not a moron, I guess I was hoping to be treated better. The gal in the warranty department was VERY unconcerned about losing a longtime customer. I was going to pull the trigger on an SC68 next week, now there is no way. Guess I'm going to switch to Yammy.

What did you expect her to do since the warranty had expired? Pay for the repair out of her own pocket?

I've only had to deal with Pioneer warranty repair once and that was for my BDP-09FD. I bought it from Definitive Audio in Seattle. It was a display model so it was about half price but it was nice and had the original box and full warranty too.

Well after about a week, the blue power indicator light quit working. It didn't affect the functionality of it but I wanted everything to work. So I shipped it to the service center for repair and while it was there told them to go ahead and update the firmware too. Well when it came back the firmware was updated but the power indicator light still didn't work. So I called them up and had to ship it back again (they paid for it) and this time I took a picture of the front of it and drew a big arrow pointing to the button and said "Fix It!".

It came back fixed and I haven't had any problems since. Hopefully I won't ever.

[Ronster267]

Gatecrasher, seriously... Of course I didn't expect her to pay for it out of her own pocket. What upset me was the complete lack of concern that I had a problem with one of her companies products. I will obviously buy a third party warranty from now on. The only reason I didn't was the past reliability of the Pioneer product's I have owned. My receiver seems to be fine now, but I still have a bitter taste in my mouth from the treatment I received. Unfortunately it seems that build quality and support for discontinued products has taken a hack seat to moving new models. They never updated the android app to be optimized for tablets. Probably not very hard, but apparently not worth their time. It will eventually become more difficult for them to find new customers when they don't try very hard to keep the customers they already have happy.

[lanchile]

I'm not a moron, I guess I was hoping to be treated better. The gal in the warranty department was VERY unconcerned about losing a longtime customer. I was going to pull the trigger on an SC68 next week, now there is no way. Guess I'm going to switch to Yammy.

Try Bryston, They will give you a 20 years warranty.They will fix it even if it was your fault! Spilled water inside your Bryston? Not a problem, Short out speakers wires? not a problem!. Bryston are made to last a lifetime!

[gdb]

Gatecrasher, seriously... Of course I didn't expect her to pay for it out of her own pocket. What upset me was the complete lack of concern that I had a problem with one of her companies products.

So, you're gonna' rest your entire opinion of a huge corporation on the actions of one (possibly periodic), low level, dim bulb employee ? If you chew a$$es all the way up to the desk where the buck ultimately stops, and you still don't get your desired result or a valid explanation ? Then, it might be time to condemn.