My used separates nightmare (or how I went Emo)

[Jhayman]

Source just read,,just look at all the other so called High End amps getting replaced by...
http://www.audioreview.com/cat/ampli...x.aspx#reviews
When I decided to buy a new set of Polk LSI9's I realized my current Denon AV-3808CI was not going to be able to power the 4 Ohm load. After a lot of reading on different audio forums I kept seeing posts raving about Emotiva amps, a brand I've never heard of. When I saw what the amps were selling for I was mighty suspicious. I kept digging, sure I'd find something that would put me off. I didn't. I called several times and talked with Vincent and learned my best bet would be to use the 2-channel amp for the front Polks and let the Denon do the other 3. Later I could get a 3-Channel Emotiva to take the load off the Denon. My last setup was a Pass Labs Aleph, Audible Illusions L1 and Von Schweikert VR4. I was never very happy with that setup. For all the money I spent it just never met my expectations. To be honest, I was expecting to be dissppointed with the Emotiva. I just wasn't ready for what the amp delivered. The Emotiva blew me away with sound that is detailed, clean and dynamic. After listening to a few dozen CD's I'm still blown away by the quality of this amp. How can this much less expensive setup put a grin on my face every time I listen. One word of advice after this experience, READ THE FORUMS. I've never before had a piece of Audio equipment so thoroughly exceed my expectations!

Expand full review >>

I've said it before, I'll state it again. Emo is really good entry level HT gear. Beyond that, one can do better (If they choose to) without trying too hard for 2 channel rig. I am just as entitled to my opinion as those who have their Emo shrines.

H9

[pitdogg2]

I was lucky enough to learn to bend a little and how to take the cotton out of my ears and put it in my mouth and listen. A little humility has helped me a great deal here.

a little of this goes a long way some should try it.

Some here do not like my Carvers TFM25/45, but I think they are wonderful. I personally have not heard an Adcom I like but I tell folks they should give them a listen if they are in their price range. I REALLY liked the Ayre amp I heard on my own gear but I really do not have the upper 4 figures they go for. I have not heard any Emotive Amps could they hold their own with the Arye probably not but their marketing will not allow me to go hear them side by side maybe I'd be really surprised. I did read the article on the owner in Stereophile and it was well wrote. It made me realize that he has been around the audio side for sometime. One last note until I read that article I never knew that the company that owns Emotive also owns Sherbourn and
I have heard Sherbourn and do like them.
I'm really glad the OP has found something that works and should not have any trouble with for years to come.

[pdxfj]

With all the EMO bashing I'm tempted to buy a XPA-3 and see how it stacks up next to my Parasound and Sony ES amp.

The way these threads go postal on Emotiva's products much reminds me of how people are in the city where I live. If you don't agree with their point of view they instantly go on the offensive and start yelling insults at you.

Glad the OP is happy with his purchase.

[leroyjr1]

See, it's stuff like "Emo shrines" that I'm talking about. I'm not placing the brand on a pedestal. Neither was anyone else in this thread. Nor am I saying that you can't do better for a 2-channel rig... 'cause hell, I'm using RTi70s - not exactly well-liked, even in Polk's lineage of speakers, so it isn't like I'm rockin' a high-end system. I'm also not being defensive, as if I take personal offense to people downing Emotiva. I just don't understand the disrespect people exhibit for this one particular brand, or the outright smack-talk that results every single time they're mentioned here. Maybe it's just me, but if you don't like a brand and people are having a discussion about it, why do people feel it necessary to thread-crap every time, as if it threatens them somehow? It's just odd to me. After my experience, I don't really care for Adcom amps... but I'm not going to tell people who use them that they're "drinking the Kool-Aid" or go into Adcom threads and be a smartass to anyone. That's childish.

Not that any of this matters, ultimately... 'cause I'm pretty happy with the sound of the XPA-3 with my speakers. More so than I have been with the GFA-5503 or the HCA-2003 in my particular setup. That's what matters to me - not the name on the front of it or the bizarre hatred for the brand as if they're some kind of cult. I'd just like people to be a little more respectful and keep the back-handed elitism out of the discussion. We're all here because we love audio... There is no sense in all this derision.

I agree 100%. I haven't read this whole thread but it seems to be the same people every time. (Trollers)

[Loud & Clear]

I've said it before, I'll state it again. Emo is really good entry level HT gear. Beyond that, one can do better (If they choose to) without trying too hard for 2 channel rig. I am just as entitled to my opinion as those who have their Emo shrines.

H9

People can do better than your SDAs, too. Would you like to be reminded of that as often as you log on to the site? Of course that's just a subjective opinion that I've expressed, although I've owned three pairs of SDAs. My most recent subjective opinion suggests that you have no idea how good a pair of Lsi7s, powered by an Emotiva UPA-200, sounds in my particular room. My guess is that won't stop you from trying, however.

And tubes DON'T rule. Not in my house. They sounded like a eunuch with real speakers like mine. ;>}

[heiney9]

People can do better than your SDAs, too. Would you like to be reminded of that as often as you log on to the site? Of course that's just a subjective opinion that I've expressed, although I've owned three pairs of SDAs. My most recent subjective opinion suggests that you have no idea how good a pair of Lsi7s, powered by an Emotiva UPA-200, sounds in my particular room. My guess is that won't stop you from trying, however.

And tubes DON'T rule. Not in my house. They sounded like a eunuch with real speakers like mine. ;>}

Great, you know what you like and don't like as do I. So what was your point again?

H9

[F1nut]

So what was your point again?

That you are a big meanie.....me too.

Maybe we should change the name of this forum to the Emotiva Lounge II.

TUBES RULE!!!

[Jhayman]

Damn not again..
No responses for almost 12hrs, lol
Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

[headrott]

Damn not again..
No responses for almost 12hrs, lol
Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

There will always be people to take up the torch of high fidelity. Never doubt that. Unortunately, NOS tubes have a finite span because they are no longer made with the same materials and same equipment. The NOS tubes, when they are gone are gone forever, but the want for high quality audio from people will never dissapear.

Why would people, "old timers" as you call them feel threatened by something that doesn't produce as high a quality of sound as what they are using threaten them? There is no logical reason for that, is there? At least not that I can think of. I do not believe people with high fidelty gear feel threatened by anything that does not sound as good as the gear they are using.

Note: I am not necessarily specifically referring to EMO gear, but anything that sounds inferior to the gear someone is using currently.

[BlueFox]

Damn not again..
No responses for almost 12hrs, lol
Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

LOL. The original Jhayman is back.

[Jhayman]

Hey old timer, how are those Two Thousand $ PC's treating you, lol

LOL. The original Jhayman is back.

[DSkip]

Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

Really? While I do have grey hair, I was born during the Reagan administration. Unless something comes that blows the liquidity and soul of tubes out of the water, I dare say I'm a tuber for life.

[cstmar01]

Really? While I do have grey hair, I was born during the Reagan administration. Unless something comes that blows the liquidity and soul of tubes out of the water, I dare say I'm a tuber for life.

I like the assumption made that you have to be old to enjoy tubes. Once again running his mouth off about something he knows nothing about. Go figure.

[kuntasensei]

Note: I am not necessarily specifically referring to EMO gear, but anything that sounds inferior to the gear someone is using currently.

That's a given... but it's like if you're driving a nicer car than me that was WAY more expensive. We both still get to our destinations and can both be perfectly happy with our purchases... until the douche-nozzle in the Lamborghini pulls up next to me and screams, "Hey, nice Chevy Impala, loser!" Just let me drive my damn Impala to work in peace! The used Mustang and two Ferarris that I had didn't work out!

Okay, now I'm lost... What the hell were we talking about again?

[leroyjr1]

I like the assumption made that you have to be old to enjoy tubes. Once again running his mouth off about something he knows nothing about. Go figure.

Aren't you like 79?

[tonyb]

Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

Has to be one of the most assinine things I've heard in a long time.

In case you haven't noticed, audio in general is a game played on many levels. It neither negates the entry level players or the more experienced higher level players. If your happy at your level of enjoyment, cool, rock on. Others tend to want more from audio and a greater sense of enjoyment.

Some folks can be happy for life driving a Ford Escort, others aspire for the Beemer, Mercedes, etc. Neither makes a spit of difference in the end, just enjoy what you can afford and life in general. It needs not get anymore complicated than that.

[CoolJazz]

Tubes may rule but once all the old timers relinquish their audio torches Tubes will be Gone Forever.
Me thinks the old timers feel threatened by Emo, which fuels all their hatred..
I say Grey hair go in Peace and leave Emo alone..

Last year several of us guys met up and went to the Altanta Axpona. In a group like that you kind of hang together so you don't get too far apart but sometimes one guy may stay in a room longer than others if something catches their ear. If so, in the next room or two you hang longer and let the others catch up. So everybody gets their time with favorites.

Emotiva had a room with a full setup. When I saw their name on the door I thought, good...a chance to hear a newer brand. Well, it was a gritty and un-hifi sound. It didn't take 20 seconds to vacate. One of those rare times when within just a few notes you can comfortably spin on your heel and head for the door. And you know, everyone else did the same. Independant conclusion the same by everyone. Not even close to the general level of really being at a show with decent equipment! Much more in line with expectations from a Best Buy or something.

Most higher end equipment in general is tube. Certainly plenty that isn't too. When the persuit is for better, you just really don't care which it is. But more often than not, it is tube that allows the easy open communicate with the musician kind of feeling. You really should take the time and go to the expense of getting to an event like this. It'd tend to open your eyes and show the level of knowledge you're working from and have been so happy to vocalize here.

But don't fear it....the level of enjoyment can go so much higher. The thrill of hearing more from the same material you thought you were familiar with is addicting. You'll eventually find pleasure in coming back and saying to others how foolish you were. The enjoy factor goes so much higher that it's fun to admit how wrong you were! You'll find yourself so immersed in music you listen to the whole song to last dieing note instead of the first minute and then skipping on.

Right here on this forum, over time, you can see this play out time after time. Join the club. Get out and experience that there actually is a whole level way above and beyond the big box store level!

CJ

[tonyb]

Right here on this forum, over time, you can see this play out time after time. Join the club. Get out and experience that there actually is a whole level way above and beyond the big box store level!

CJ

Great post my good man. You are correct, this scenario gets played out over and over again on this forum. Most times too, people have a hard time wiping that grin off their face and a big "ah ha" moment falls on them.

[sucks2beme]

There is a lot of tube gear I don't like. But the stuff I currently own sounds good.
No bloated tubby bass here. And marginal recordings don't pierce my ears any more.

[sucks2beme]

The real problem any more is all the good used amps are getting long in the tooth.
And repair techs are as well. Add on to it many of the sources for SS parts
have dried up. You blow up a match pair of transistors, you might have a very hard
time finding new ones. Or almost as worse, end up with Chinese fakes.
Those classic NAD, Rotel, B&K and Carver pieces are all past their prime. Add shipping
to and from a really good repair place, and suddenly you have a lot of $$$
tied up. Emo has the right product at the right price for a lot of people out there.
As far as tubes dying off, dream on. A quick visit to a head-fi meet shows a whole lot of
tube and tube hybrid gear. Those guys are a trendy bunch, and if tube gear wasn't
cutting it in the sound department, it wouldn't be there in the numbers it is.
And many spend as much on headphones, amps, and DACs as many here spend on their
speaker set ups. I'd really like to try a Emo to see what it's about, but not really
in the cards as of right now.

[Jhayman]

Like was said here many times already no one is putting EMO on a pedestal, just stop all the bashing is all.
FYI I have been in many many mom and pop audio stores in my yrs and have heard many things that made me grin ear to ear.
Right now at this time in my life every time I play a movie or listen to my TT with the gear I own right now I get that Grin.
I basically spent all day yesterday listening to music in 2 channel mostly my TT but I also listened very intently to some Miles Davis Flac I have and I must say I actually liked it quite a lot.
I was trying to listen very objectively to really hear everything the music had to offer, and I'm quite satisfied with my results which I will be PM,ing Ztful with as I need to ask a few questions first.
Since I generally do not listen to this type of music I need to know what he means by I think he said finger valving the flute and sax, trumpet..

Great post my good man. You are correct, this scenario gets played out over and over again on this forum. Most times too, people have a hard time wiping that grin off their face and a big "ah ha" moment falls on them.

[cstmar01]

Aren't you like 79?

Change the 7 and 9 around and I feel like that on most days. Last time I went into a bar they called me Sir and Mister...I feel old.

[heiney9]

So because I don't like the Emo sound and know there is better out there, I'm not allowed to converse and have an opinion because it's called "bashing", grow some and stop taking it so personally.

H9

[Jhayman]

Is there a thread on here about Adcom with bashing going on?
Or your Dared with bashing?
Show me any other thread with bashing like this one..
Can't find any? Why?

[PSOVLSK]

Okay, now I'm lost... What the hell were we talking about again?

I think you were sharing your horror story of attempts to buy a good used amp. None of them worked (literally), so you bought an Emotiva, which you enjoy. From that point, it's pretty much gone downhill. Enjoy your gear!!!

[Jhayman]

Of course I'm only generalizing about having grey hair, I will however say that a general tube listener will be an older gentlemen and not the younger generation..
You know kind of like the mp3 quality it's a younger persons format..

Really? While I do have grey hair, I was born during the Reagan administration. Unless something comes that blows the liquidity and soul of tubes out of the water, I dare say I'm a tuber for life.

[leroyjr1]

On another note here's a great deal on a Emotiva XPA-5 for $625 on the AVS forum.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1462441/em...rack-mount-kit

[DSkip]

Of course I'm only generalizing about having grey hair, I will however say that a general tube listener will be an older gentlemen and not the younger generation..
You know kind of like the mp3 quality it's a younger persons format..

Sigh.

[Jhayman]

Really, you would say otherwise?

Sigh.

[F1nut]

Last year several of us guys met up and went to the Altanta Axpona. In a group like that you kind of hang together so you don't get too far apart but sometimes one guy may stay in a room longer than others if something catches their ear. If so, in the next room or two you hang longer and let the others catch up. So everybody gets their time with favorites.

Emotiva had a room with a full setup. When I saw their name on the door I thought, good...a chance to hear a newer brand. Well, it was a gritty and un-hifi sound. It didn't take 20 seconds to vacate. One of those rare times when within just a few notes you can comfortably spin on your heel and head for the door. And you know, everyone else did the same. Independant conclusion the same by everyone. Not even close to the general level of really being at a show with decent equipment! Much more in line with expectations from a Best Buy or something.

Most higher end equipment in general is tube. Certainly plenty that isn't too. When the persuit is for better, you just really don't care which it is. But more often than not, it is tube that allows the easy open communicate with the musician kind of feeling. You really should take the time and go to the expense of getting to an event like this. It'd tend to open your eyes and show the level of knowledge you're working from and have been so happy to vocalize here.

But don't fear it....the level of enjoyment can go so much higher. The thrill of hearing more from the same material you thought you were familiar with is addicting. You'll eventually find pleasure in coming back and saying to others how foolish you were. The enjoy factor goes so much higher that it's fun to admit how wrong you were! You'll find yourself so immersed in music you listen to the whole song to last dieing note instead of the first minute and then skipping on.

Right here on this forum, over time, you can see this play out time after time. Join the club. Get out and experience that there actually is a whole level way above and beyond the big box store level!

CJ

Great post, you absolutely nailed it.