My used separates nightmare (or how I went Emo)

[heiney9]

Dynamic bias is not new. It's been around since the 70's.

[heiney9]

In fact by definition all class A/B amps are biased into A operation. Nothing remotely new or advanced here. Same old same old.

[kuntasensei]

No one's arguing that, heiney9, and I don't think Emotiva is claiming that either... But being able to manually change the bias of the amp with a switch is something I haven't seen before.

Then again, with a well-done design, would you even hear a difference between the differing bias points? That's my question. What is ultimately the advantage of changing the point at which the amp changes over? Is it just the notion that pure class A sounds better?

[heiney9]

@kuntasensei...Thanks,I knew that class "A" puts out more heat then class A/B too a point.I agree with you I have never seen a amp with the class"A" where you could "select".I also know that's why Parasound amps and some others tend too put out more heat because of that.35 watts to play with is nice we shall see.

Yamaha did this back in the late 70s and 80s. It was nothing more than a gimmick. Pure class A puts out a LOT more heat, not just to a point. My 30 watt pure class A amp has huge heat sinks and it can raise the room ambient temp by 3-4 degrees.

Granted the Emo is not the same design, but for it to do 35 wpc in class A, they need very beefy parts and heat sinks. Cosr should be very high comparatively and maybe not fit into the emotiva paradigm. I'm guessing it's some sort of quasi class A circuity.

[Tankman]

@kuntasensei...Lolo..Nice try, I do have my "Hipboots" on but if you look at my post "Vincent" is in my short list for an upgrade for two channel a Big No on the XPA-1L.@heiney9,yep I know pure class A puts out a lot of heat even just sitting still.I agree with you on the class "A" switch thing on the EMO amp.I mean why put a switch when "EMO" says it will switch over too A/B anyways?.I don't get it?BTW..kuntasensei I know your jackin around with me..I am one of the few EMO amp owners that knows and I have owned other amps than EMO that even an old Carver amp sounds better for two channel music then my EMO monoblocks.But for the money they are a good value.

[ZLTFUL]

Class A in action...not only does it sound great, it can cook you breakfast while it is at it!

[cstmar01]

No one's arguing that, heiney9, and I don't think Emotiva is claiming that either... But being able to manually change the bias of the amp with a switch is something I haven't seen before.
Then again, with a well-done design, would you even hear a difference between the differing bias points? That's my question. What is ultimately the advantage of changing the point at which the amp changes over? Is it just the notion that pure class A sounds better?

Plinius USED to offer a switch on some of their amps from what I remember. Tried looking but didn't see any of the current line up doing this. However a lot larger and run very hot in full class A operation.

[Tankman]

@ZLTFUL..Lolo..Nice stop the madness!..

[heiney9]

Class A is probably the single most misused term in audio, with the word digital a close second. Class A as it has been defined since the advent of the transistor can mean many different things. Most are only half truths and marketing speak.

[heiney9]

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/manufacture/0808/

For those seriously wanting to read a good article about class A, the above link is excellent. But remember there is more to amplifier design that just high bias.

[kuntasensei]

Either way, we can all agree that none of us are gonna try this thing, right?

[ZLTFUL]

If they want to send me a pair to review, I am game for at least trying it. Worst case scenario, I make eggs.

[heiney9]

Either way, we can all agree that none of us are gonna try this thing, right?

I'm not clamoring to get my ears on it. According to the marketing dept it can run im class A to 35 watts, yet a $7000 Pass X350.5 can only run 30 watts class A. Something is amiss , but then thats why the marketing dept gets the big bucks!

[heiney9]

If they want to send me a pair to review, I am game for at least trying it. Worst case scenario,, I make eggs.

Trust me the Emo won't have the hardware to support the kind of heat dissipation to fry eggs.

[kuntasensei]

I'm not clamoring to get my ears on it. According to the marketing dept it can run im class A to 35 watts, yet a $7000 Pass X350.5 can only run 30 watts class A. Something is amiss , but then thats why the marketing dept gets the big bucks!

The specs for the X350.5 say it leaves Class A at 40w. But DAMN, that thing is huge! Doesn't look like most of it is heatsink either - the internals have some big-ass caps in there.

[Polkie2009]

Haven't some members here used their Onkyo or Integra amps as space heaters? Great pic ZLTFUL!

[Tankman]

Class A is probably the single most misused term in audio, with the word digital a close second. Class A as it has been defined since the advent of the transistor can mean many different things. Most are only half truths and marketing speak.

Thanks heiney9..Much Respect at ya!..I about spit on my desktop with this"I can't sleep at night I keep worrying about where my amplifer stops being Class A"still LMAO.Again thanks h9.

[pearsall001]

I'm not clamoring to get my ears on it. According to the marketing dept it can run im class A to 35 watts, yet a $7000 Pass X350.5 can only run 30 watts class A. Something is amiss , but then thats why the marketing dept gets the big bucks!

Looks to me like Nelson's getting an ass whipping on design smarts from Emo engineers. And for sure a $7,000.00 amp is marketing hype at it's finest.

[Jhayman]

For the Emotiva Fans
Here's Mr. Legacy Bill Dudleston using Emo Gear at Axpona 2012..
And a video from Youtube..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NP0rpnudeyU

[tonyb]

Cryin' shame too, they deserve better.

[thsmith]

I agree in principle but it might be a smart move by Legacy. A lot of the youg guys I work with buy EMO because of price and new.

Which is fine because at least they are getting into good audio and will step up as time goes on. I have already converted one.

My point being that people who already own EMO and heard the Legacys might just buy them and on the other hand people with better amps than EMO and liked how the Legacys sound would think, dang if they sound that good on EMO imagine how they would sound on my " ".

[tonyb]

I dunno man, people buy Emo because they want new and cheap. Legacy speakers don't fall into that cheap catagory. To spend 7 grand on speakers and power them with the cheapest amp available just doesn't make sense to me anyway. I think Bill maybe dillusional thinking he can shake thousands of dollars loose from the pockets of Emo buyers.

[heiney9]

I dunno man, people buy Emo because they want new and cheap. Legacy speakers don't fall into that cheap catagory. To spend 7 grand on speakers and power them with the cheapest amp available just doesn't make sense to me anyway. I think Bill maybe dillusional thinking he can shake thousands of dollars loose from the pockets of Emo buyers.

Yep, talk about a marketing mismatch of epic proportions.

H9

[leroyjr1]

I dunno man, people buy Emo because they want new and cheap. Legacy speakers don't fall into that cheap catagory. To spend 7 grand on speakers and power them with the cheapest amp available just doesn't make sense to me anyway. I think Bill maybe dillusional thinking he can shake thousands of dollars loose from the pockets of Emo buyers.

I have to strongly disagree. I've seen many established members on other sites running Emotiva gear on $40K systems. It's not just newer members wanting the cheapest.

[kuntasensei]

Maybe the sound the Emo has just works with their particular system, price be damned. Let's not discount the possibility of that.

[rdb2001]

I have to strongly disagree. I've seen many established members on other sites running Emotiva gear on $40K systems. It's not just newer members wanting the cheapest.

Totally agree. Talked to a member of another forum who is running Focal Stella utopias with xpa1's. A good friend of mines on another forums is running the xpr1's and some 25k dynaudio towers. That same guy has owned pass, octave, etc. I myself have owned bryston, b&k, adcom, classe, parasound. Its not about money, but about system synergy.

I also hope H9 dont think that dealer price of that pass is anywhere near 7k. I would say it is at least 50% off for dealer price. so thats 3.5k. Thats about what pass sold it to the dealer, and I hope you really dont think it cost that much to make it.

[tonyb]

I dunno guys, I have to disagree too. Anyone with a 40g system and then cheaps out on amps ? Come on now, synergy or not, I find it hard to believe they couldn't find synergy with more capable amps let alone better sound. Maybe they just spent their wad on speakers and had little left over.

Not ment to Emo bash, as they serve their purpose well but if thats the start and end of your amplification search, then you best get a new hearing aid....for both ears.

[heiney9]

Totally agree. Talked to a member of another forum who is running Focal Stella utopias with xpa1's. A good friend of mines on another forums is running the xpr1's and some 25k dynaudio towers. That same guy has owned pass, octave, etc. I myself have owned bryston, b&k, adcom, classe, parasound. Its not about money, but about system synergy.

I also hope H9 dont think that dealer price of that pass is anywhere near 7k. I would say it is at least 50% off for dealer price. so thats 3.5k. Thats about what pass sold it to the dealer, and I hope you really dont think it cost that much to make it.

Who cares about dealer price, I'm not a dealer so I can't get dealer pricing. In fact retail on the X350.5 is closer to $10K. I was using it for illustration purposes. Knock 10-15% off is about where a dealer will start the negotiation. If you get 30% off you got a good deal.

Way to nit pick

[rdb2001]

Who cares about dealer price, I'm not a dealer so I can't get dealer pricing. In fact retail on the X350.5 is closer to $10K. I was using it for illustration purposes. Knock 10-15% off is about where a dealer will start the negotiation. If you get 30% off you got a good deal.

Way to nit pick

Nitpick? Are you serious. The way you bash everything emo on here and you say I nitpick when I give you facts about how much markup is on audio equipment. Please spare me. Your beloved pass, which I think are awesome amps, dont cost nearwhere near what they retail for. It just seems funny to me when you can bash one budget brand but praise the piece of crap called the sl2000. Here is an illustration for you, audio equipment has some of the biggest markups of anything. Price should not be a determining factori in this hobby because all business models are different. It is the reason why svs can sell their ultra for 2 grand and jl, paradigm, velodyne can sell their top of the line subs at a premium. 2 different business models. It is why salk, rogue, philharmonic, odyssey and other internet direct brands can compete in price class much higher than theirs. Different business models. Thats business 101.

[tonyb]

Brock has a boyfriend.......Brock has a boyfriend......nahnahnahnah nah nah !