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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystery View Post
    No problem... 2B's only have 1 stereo and 1 dimensional driver in each cabinet.

    Attachment 82932
    they are capable of very high volume levels with clarity...i've reached the slightest hint of distortion only twice in 10 years of ownership..i doubt most people would have heard it...i don't go that crazy anymore...but still, pushing that throttle and feeling th speakers open up, is a thrill...they have no business digging that deep with only 1 full time bass-driver..clean up your testing area and give them another shot;)

    mike

  2. #32

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    Mystery..I just saw your other post about 10A's...I just don't get what your doing. I mean..if your just buying and selling speakers to make a buck..thats fine. I mean you already sold a set of what ,SRS 3.1's which would have never worked in that mess of speakers you have in that small space. To really " compare" speakers you can't just keep putting speakers in front of other speakers..with speakers on the side..LMAO it sounds like a Chinese menu. If your really trying to find the right speaker for you...NOT the way to do this.

    If your just buying and selling to make a buck..rock on..but as far as any comparison. This is a complete waste of time and your conclusions are all wrong.

    At least that just MY opinion on this mess.....

  3. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by sda2mike View Post
    they are capable of very high volume levels with clarity...i've reached the slightest hint of distortion only twice in 10 years of ownership..i doubt most people would have heard it...i don't go that crazy anymore...but still, pushing that throttle and feeling th speakers open up, is a thrill...they have no business digging that deep with only 1 full time bass-driver..clean up your testing area and give them another shot;)

    mike
    Mike, the woofers operate together below 150 Hz, that's the reason we get such great bass extension on the smaller SDAs. If you upgrade the inductor on the dimensional woofer, you'll get even stronger bass output.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
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  4. #34

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    most interesting! i had no idea...as far as the inductor upgrade, i've consulted with dr. trey and should have it done and did soon:)

    mike

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by naturallight View Post
    Mystery..I just saw your other post about 10A's...I just don't get what your doing. I mean..if your just buying and selling speakers to make a buck..thats fine. I mean you already sold a set of what ,SRS 3.1's which would have never worked in that mess of speakers you have in that small space. To really " compare" speakers you can't just keep putting speakers in front of other speakers..with speakers on the side..LMAO it sounds like a Chinese menu. If your really trying to find the right speaker for you...NOT the way to do this.

    If your just buying and selling to make a buck..rock on..but as far as any comparison. This is a complete waste of time and your conclusions are all wrong.

    At least that just MY opinion on this mess.....
    +1! Exactly what I was thinking.

    Why not decide on which ONE or TWO pairs of speakers might fit your needs the best, long-term, and get rid of the rest? Then, make the necessary upgrades/mods to make one (at a time!) of those pairs the best they can be, use them and enjoy the crap out of them! While doing this, keep the second pair stored in another room to reduce the effects they'd have on the sound of the pair that's in use, as mentioned above.

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by sda2mike View Post
    most interesting! i had no idea...as far as the inductor upgrade, i've consulted with dr. trey and should have it done and did soon:)

    mike
    Mike, which inductor are you going with?
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by sda2mike View Post
    most interesting! i had no idea...as far as the inductor upgrade, i've consulted with dr. trey and should have it done and did soon:)

    mike
    You have or haven't had the inductor upgraded? It's the big 16mh inductor that goes between the dimensional woofer's negative terminal, and the speakers negative terminal
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
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  8. #38

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    Lightbulb

    Hmmm....
    Quote Originally Posted by DarqueKnight View Post
    I think the CRS+'s may sound louder because they are exciting more resonances with their forward firing drivers and rear firing passive radiator.
    Well of course those little CRS+'s were outgunned by the much large 2B's. If a smaller speaker that moves less air sounds louder than a bigger speaker moving more air, then something is wrong with the speakers or the
    room.
    That could be the reason. Also, I think more power goes to bass section in 2B's than CRS+ so 2B's sound slightly less volume since lows don't sound louder.
    My place doesn't need too much volume so I can't really give them too much power.
    I'm sure 2B's will work better on larger room at higher volume levels.

    Quote Originally Posted by sda2mike View Post
    ...clean up your testing area and give them another shot;)
    mike
    Thanks Mike but my around 11x13 area is not helping plus it's already too loud at around 2 watts so no way I can test what they can do with more power.

    Quote Originally Posted by naturallight View Post
    Mystery..I just saw your other post about 10A's...I just don't get what your doing. I mean..if your just buying and selling speakers to make a buck..thats fine. I mean you already sold a set of what ,SRS 3.1's which would have never worked in that mess of speakers you have in that small space. To really " compare" speakers you can't just keep putting speakers in front of other speakers..with speakers on the side..LMAO it sounds like a Chinese menu. If your really trying to find the right speaker for you...NOT the way to do this.
    If your just buying and selling to make a buck..rock on..but as far as any comparison. This is a complete waste of time and your conclusions are all wrong.
    At least that just MY opinion on this mess.....
    I'm culling the herd at this point.
    No making bucks. I already sold few pairs at my cost + gas.
    Don't take this test as rule of thumb. I've given my room setup picture so this is not to follow as a standard.
    I just need a speaker that works in my small space and sounds good at lower than average volume.
    I don't want something that works amazing at higher volume but doesn't work good at lower volume.

    Quote Originally Posted by teekay0007 View Post
    +1! Exactly what I was thinking.
    Why not decide on which ONE or TWO pairs of speakers might fit your needs the best, long-term, and get rid of the rest?
    You seem to understand me.
    That's exactly what I'm doing.
    Quick and dirty test and getting rid of what I don't prefer rather than upgrading and making every pair perfect and then deciding.

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  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by DarqueKnight View Post
    I think the CRS+'s may sound louder because they are exciting more resonances with their forward firing drivers and rear firing passive radiator.



    Well of course those little CRS+'s were outgunned by the much large 2B's. If a smaller speaker that moves less air sounds louder than a bigger speaker moving more air, then something is wrong with the speakers or the room.
    I agree.

    Also, you CAN NOT generate a proper SDA effect with SDA 2Bs unless you have a MINIMUM of 14' of uninterrupted closed wall space with the speakers a minimum distance of 4' from each other (more is better) you then need 3' from each wall L/R and the speaker width itself. Given your space, your SDA field is all f-d up. That's your "hollowness" right there (sound is bouncing all over the place). You also have to be VERY close to the back wall (6" or a little more) and NOTHING, I mean NOTHING can protrude BEYOND the PLANE of the front of the SDA speakers, nothing!

    cnh
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  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by nspindel View Post
    Mike, which inductor are you going with?
    jantzen

  11. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    You have or haven't had the inductor upgraded? It's the big 16mh inductor that goes between the dimensional woofer's negative terminal, and the speakers negative terminal
    no..i haven't done it yet..when i do, it will be all 3 of them

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    Oh so you're talking about the smaller inductors that are mounted on the board. Are you going to do the big inductor as well? From my experience, the big 16mH inductor is a higher priority, that really brought the bass to a whole different level.
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.

  13. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by nspindel View Post
    Oh so you're talking about the smaller inductors that are mounted on the board. Are you going to do the big inductor as well? From my experience, the big 16mH inductor is a higher priority, that really brought the bass to a whole different level.
    That's what I was referring to as well
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  14. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by nspindel View Post
    Oh so you're talking about the smaller inductors that are mounted on the board. Are you going to do the big inductor as well? From my experience, the big 16mH inductor is a higher priority, that really brought the bass to a whole different level.
    trey recommends doing all three..the diff in price barely noticeable...that includes the big one too..i think it's 3 total with the smallies

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    Not everyone can have nothing between the speakers. I also disagree with the statement as I have my rig between my SDA's and have no problem with the effect (if that's what you want to call it). Will it sound better without? I don't know but wish I could find out.

    Also putting the rig outside the box will cost me a fortune in MIT Shotgun speaker cables..



    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    I agree.

    Also, you CAN NOT generate a proper SDA effect with SDA 2Bs unless you have a MINIMUM of 14' of uninterrupted closed wall space with the speakers a minimum distance of 4' from each other (more is better) you then need 3' from each wall L/R and the speaker width itself. Given your space, your SDA field is all f-d up. That's your "hollowness" right there (sound is bouncing all over the place). You also have to be VERY close to the back wall (6" or a little more) and NOTHING, I mean NOTHING can protrude BEYOND the PLANE of the front of the SDA speakers, nothing!

    cnh
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  16. #46

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    And yes the inductors make a huge difference..
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  17. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by sda2mike View Post
    trey recommends doing all three..the diff in price barely noticeable...that includes the big one too..i think it's 3 total with the smallies
    There's a total of four inductors, three small, one large.
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  18. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    There's a total of four inductors, three small, one large.
    cool...thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toolfan66 View Post
    Not everyone can have nothing between the speakers. I also disagree with the statement as I have my rig between my SDA's and have no problem with the effect (if that's what you want to call it). Will it sound better without? I don't know but wish I could find out.

    Also putting the rig outside the box will cost me a fortune in MIT Shotgun speaker cables..
    I'm not saying that's not possible, Larry, just siting the rules for setting up a pristine SDA sound field as written by Polk. No one said you cannot have "anything" between the speakers, but that you should take care not to have whatever that is jut out beyond the front plane of the SDA speakers. Of course that is in a "perfect" world, which most of us don't often see.

    I'm sure if there is enough space between whatever you have in between the speakers and the speakers that might be just fine as long as the speakers have some breathing room.

    How did we fly into a discourse on inductors?

    cnh
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  20. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toolfan66 View Post
    Not everyone can have nothing between the speakers. I also disagree with the statement as I have my rig between my SDA's and have no problem with the effect (if that's what you want to call it). Will it sound better without? I don't know but wish I could find out.

    Also putting the rig outside the box will cost me a fortune in MIT Shotgun speaker cables..
    I'm not saying that's not possible, Larry, just citing the rules for setting up a pristine SDA sound field as written by Polk. No one said you cannot have "anything" between the speakers, but that you should take care not to have whatever that is jut out beyond the front plane of the SDA speakers. Of course that is in a "perfect" world, which most of us don't often see.

    I'm sure if there is enough space between whatever you have in between the speakers and the speakers, themselves, that might be just fine as long as the speakers have some breathing room.

    How did we sail into a discourse on inductors?

    cnh
    Last edited by cnh; 03-18-2013 at 05:19 PM.
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  21. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post

    How did we sail into a discourse on inductors?

    cnh
    sda2mike made a comment on the bass output of the 2Bs which was in error. I explained why they have the bass output they do, and it went on from there
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  22. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    I'm not saying that's not possible, Larry, just citing the rules for setting up a pristine SDA sound field as written by Polk. No one said you cannot have "anything" between the speakers, but that you should take care not to have whatever that is jut out beyond the front plane of the SDA speakers. Of course that is in a "perfect" world, which most of us don't often see.

    I'm sure if there is enough space between whatever you have in between the speakers and the speakers, themselves, that might be just fine as long as the speakers have some breathing room.

    How did we sail into a discourse on inductors?
    cnh
    It's easier for those with a house for at least a decent setup.
    Apt or townhouse is so small that one big pair of speakers feel like they are big pieces of furniture.

    Not sure about inductors. Here I am not even considering capacitors.

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  23. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystery View Post
    Not sure about inductors. Here I am not even considering capacitors.
    Mystery, wasn't trying to hijack your thread.
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    If thats what your doing...I would keep the CRSs..sell off everything..IF what your looking for is the SDA "effect" Clean out that whole back area..put the CRS's on the right height stands..in the right position. They will probably work more then fine for you..dependent on what amp your pushing these with. If your not looking for "loud"..these should work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by naturallight View Post
    If thats what your doing...I would keep the CRSs..sell off everything..IF what your looking for is the SDA "effect" Clean out that whole back area..put the CRS's on the right height stands..in the right position. They will probably work more then fine for you..dependent on what amp your pushing these with. If your not looking for "loud"..these should work.
    That about sums it up. You have limited space, you've already demonstrated to yourself that you like the speaker even under conditions that are not ideal. Sounds to me like this is a no-brainer decision. Keep the CRS+'s, mod them to the hilt, and you won't look back. Here's my how-to thread for you:

    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...s-are-complete!
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toolfan66 View Post
    Not everyone can have nothing between the speakers. I also disagree with the statement as I have my rig between my SDA's and have no problem with the effect (if that's what you want to call it). Will it sound better without? I don't know but wish I could find out.
    I'm here to tell you I had the same opinion/situation as you at one time, and YES it will sound better with nothing in between. I completely understand having to make compromises to make things fit/work out. But the performance of the speaker will improve with open space between the speakers.

    H0
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

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    I have found in testing that the SDA effect is much better when there is an open plane from speaker to speaker with no obnstructions between them at all. If you can pull a string from one cab to the other without touching anything, that's best. I also understand that most of us have limited situations to actually set up all of our gear/ furniture in that manner. Placeing gear on low stands at the Passive radiator level has little to no effect on the sound. It's when you get something up around the drivers it starts effecting things. Due to limitations in my sopace I have some things between my speakers as well but I know that it would be better if I didn't. Unfortunately I currently don't have the ability to do otherwise.

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    The only thing I wish weren't in between my 1C's is my Panasonic flat screen. Reflections off the screen can't be a good thing. Atleast it doesn't stick out into the sound plane between the speakers. But I have no other choice until I build a strict 2 channel listening space. It's a compromise I can live with, but one day I'll do a proper 2 channel listening space.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

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    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    The only thing I wish weren't in between my 1C's is my Panasonic flat screen. Reflections off the screen can't be a good thing. Atleast it doesn't stick out into the sound plane between the speakers. But I have no other choice until I build a strict 2 channel listening space. It's a compromise I can live with, but one day I'll do a proper 2 channel listening space.

    H9
    In the same boat, but even worse, as I have a 52" DLP between my 2As. The DLP is about 24" deep, and the 2As are 1.5" forward of the screen, and that puts them 10" off the back wall. Not Ideal, but no choice in the matter at the moment.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350
    Other:
    SDA-CRS+
    Bose 901 Series II Continentals, Custom Rebuilt Equalizer
    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  30. #60

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    Altho having "nothing" in between the SDA's may be the 100% ultimate way to have them set up. It borders on the impractical. I've had these speakers in a number of houses. Now i can usually claim 1 wall for the stereo. I just tell the wife, it's my stereo space, don't put tables or whatever in that space.



    But the rack always ends up between the speakers. To move the rack someplace else in the room, so the speakers are just sitting there by themselves, is almost impossible. So i have never heard SDA's just sitting by themselves. But i do tend to agree with Mr Bubbles, that as long as the rack is NOT sticking out in front of the SDA's...I'm not sure you really have much of a problem. I'm not sure the cost in just new speaker wire alone would justify what if any improvement you get out of the speakers. In my room, i still have the rack in the middle of the speakers. But the rack is NOT sticking out way in front of them. They are also are a good 30 " away from the sides of the rack, and sit 1 foot off the back wall. The 1C's have never, ever sounded better...which is saying alot for 30 year old speakers...LOL

    If i was to move the rack to say half way down a sidewall. I would be going from about a 4 foot speaker cable to over a 20 foot speaker cable, as i would have to follow the wall, plus i'd have an extra good 6-7 feet of cable sitting around the closest speaker. To me, just doesn't seem to be a good trade off, and of course money wise, seems rather foolish.

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