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  1. #1

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    Default Subwoofer volume after audyssey set up

    So I just did the auto set up on my receiver and the subs seems a little quiet. Is it ok to turn the volume knob up on the sub to get some more bass or does that interfere with the readings audyssey gave me? I have the LFE crossover set to 120hz, my main and center channels are 80hz and surrounds 120hz. Any help is very much appreciated

  2. #2

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    The auto setup is just a baseline. Adjust to your liking, there are no calibration police that will come and bust you...

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    Reference vs. preference. Most people are used to hearing bloated bass. My first question, however, is did you observe proper Audyssey setup rules? For instance, did you use a tripod for the mic? Did you make sure to raise the mic just above the back of your seating so it didn't interfere? Did you keep the mic away from room boundaries? Did you do all the available positions during Audyssey's setup?

    Ultimately, some people just like more bass... but it's important to make sure you're following some very basic rules when you run Audyssey so you aren't giving it bad data.
    Equipment list:
    Onkyo TX-NR3010 9.2 AVR
    Emotiva XPA-3 amp
    Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, RTi38 surrounds, RTi28 rears and heights
    SVS 20-39CS+ subwoofer powered by Crown XLS1500
    Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray player
    DarbeeVision DVP5000 video processor
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    Yup I used a tripod and used all 8 positions for the set up and I also made sure to raise the tripod up when I put it behind the couch.

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    How close to the wall were you when you went behind the couch?

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    It's about 6 feet away from the wall

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    Have you checked the levels that Audyssey set using a SPL meter?
    Equipment list:
    Onkyo TX-NR3010 9.2 AVR
    Emotiva XPA-3 amp
    Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, RTi38 surrounds, RTi28 rears and heights
    SVS 20-39CS+ subwoofer powered by Crown XLS1500
    Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray player
    DarbeeVision DVP5000 video processor
    Epson 8500UB 1080p projector
    Elite Screens Sable 120" CineWhite screen

  8. #8

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    Check to see if your receiver has an option to increase the Subwoofer gain. You can increase the gain in the receiver vs. the knob on the subwoofer.
    Front Speakers: Polk Audio LSi15 x 2
    Center Speaker: Polk Audio LSiC
    Rear Speakers: Polk Audio LSiF/X x 2
    Subwoofers: Polk Audio PSW505 x 2
    AVR: Denon AVR-3313CI
    Amp: Emotiva XPA-5

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by amgala View Post
    Check to see if your receiver has an option to increase the Subwoofer gain. You can increase the gain in the receiver vs. the knob on the subwoofer.
    Good advice here, it's always a good idea to tweek the settings in the receiver after calibration. They don't always get it right. Under speaker levels in your receivers menu there should be an item for subwoofer level. See what thats set at, usually anywhere from -1 to +3 is normal. Setting it too high will overdrive some subs so don't go crazy.

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    so the level setting that audyssey chooses, say +4.5, is based on the 50% volume on the sub during calibration? Its confusing to me also, what if you turn the knob to 80%, or what if you switch it to +6.0 on the avr, or both?
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

  11. #11

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    Scotty,
    There is no right or wrong answer here. You can do both, but the key here is to listen. You don't want to overdrive the sub on those big explosions, or bottom out the driver. For the psw300, I want to say +6 and 80% volume would most likely tippy toe on overdriving that unit. Everything has limitations, Clint Eastwood says so.

    Let me add Scotty, this is what we mean when you hear some of us say "dialed in". Blending that right balance between subwoofer gain and volume/crossover settings so as not to overdrive it or produce distortion. Placement of your sub also enters into the "dialed in" phrase. When it all comes together so that it's pleasing to your ears, be it movies/music, or both, then we proclaim it's "dialed in".
    Last edited by tonyb; 03-21-2013 at 02:16 PM.

  12. #12

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    Typically I would say turn up the gain in the receiver instead of the sub amp. As in my case after calibration my subs were set at -12 at 50% gain and the subs wouldn't receive enough voltage to even turn on until the volume was way loud. So I set the level to -4db and turned the subs down to 3/8 gain. But in your case already at +4.5 I would turn up the amps gain a little at a time until it sounds ideal to you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyDugs View Post
    so the level setting that audyssey chooses, say +4.5, is based on the 50% volume on the sub during calibration?
    The level setting that Audyssey chooses is based upon the volume that the mic is "hearing" during the calibration. It is sending the test signal through the sub, and setting the volume level so that the test signal received through the mic is at a reference volume. If you increase the volume on the back of the sub before calibration, Audyssey will decrease the sub volume on the receiver to match that reference volume during calibration, and vice-versa. You can alter the volume at the sub or the receiver after calibration with virtually the same result.

    Ideally, you would want to set the volume control on the sub so that the volume on the receiver is close to 0dB after calibration. Then, since it is available via remote control, use the sub volume on the receiver to "tweak" your preference after calibration.
    Last edited by Tbone289; 03-21-2013 at 02:48 PM.
    2.1: Peachtree DAC●iT>Yaqin MC-10L w/6CA7-EH, Voskhod 6N1P-EV>polkaudio RT25i, PSW202

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  14. #14

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    Im at 60% and +6.0....the 80% was just an example, It doesnt sound like im overdriving it, I just wanted to get a better understanding between the knob and avr setting....Thanks guys
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

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    In my room Audessey sets the Micropro's on 5.1 channel to -12 and the PSW1000 on 5.2 channel to -14. For movies I typically run them at -8, and -9. All the gains are at 50%. Going into the positive scale is just for making waves in peoples drinks.
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  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by chris23120 View Post
    Going into the positive scale is just for making waves in peoples drinks.

    ......and whats wrong with that ? Nuthin' like watching Jarrasic Park when the dino's stomp and the water has waves in it only to find it really is happening in your room.

  17. #17

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    Yea i like it to rattle things...feels like you are there or at least in a theater
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyDugs View Post
    Im at 60% and +6.0....the 80% was just an example, It doesnt sound like im overdriving it
    If your receiver is setting output at +6.0 dB, and you have the sub at 60%, you could get into overdriving it if you increase much from there. I would suggest that, if you do increase the volume, that you do it from the sub volume control rather than at the receiver (since the receiver is already at +6.0 dB).

    It's not at all comparing apples-to-apples, but I'm using a PSW505 in a large room and, after Audyssey calibration, my settings are somewhere around 30-40% at the sub and -2.0dB at the receiver.
    2.1: Peachtree DAC●iT>Yaqin MC-10L w/6CA7-EH, Voskhod 6N1P-EV>polkaudio RT25i, PSW202

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  19. #19

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    when i calibrated at 50%on the sub, audyssey set the avr at +4.5 so i will just put it back.
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

  20. #20

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    You need to flatten you sub frequency in room response as much as possible then run Aud.

    Raise the dips by moving your sub around and tame the peaks with filters.

    You have huge peaks and dips in an un-EQed sub. Aud is seeing your peaks and level matching to your mains which makes the volume lower than desired for the sub.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
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  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by thsmith View Post
    Aud is seeing your peaks and level matching to your mains which makes the volume lower than desired for the sub.
    Yes, but... for Audyssey to not be able to correct a peak, it would have to be greater than 9dB from the baseline (which I believe is the limit for peak correction with MultEQ XT and XT32). To my understanding, the level matching of Audyssey is based on the POST-EQUALIZATION calculated average, not the initial frequency sweeps.

    I agree that you should position the sub for best response to get the best result from Audyssey (because garbage in = garbage out), but if you're saying to also add equalization before Audyssey, doesn't that introduce phase alteration into the mix? Parametric equalization always changes the phase relationship somewhat. Not that it would be a huge issue, I imagine, but then I would think that Audyssey would have to work to re-align the phase of the frequencies that you've corrected with external equalization.
    Equipment list:
    Onkyo TX-NR3010 9.2 AVR
    Emotiva XPA-3 amp
    Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, RTi38 surrounds, RTi28 rears and heights
    SVS 20-39CS+ subwoofer powered by Crown XLS1500
    Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray player
    DarbeeVision DVP5000 video processor
    Epson 8500UB 1080p projector
    Elite Screens Sable 120" CineWhite screen

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    I cant answer you questions, I just know from experience you get a better result using Aud with a subwoofer if you sub is a flat as possble before you start. I dont believe an AVR AUD will ever be able to properly calibrate a sub, YMMV.

    I prefer to use REW and my SVS PB13 has one filter built in and in my case that is all I need to take a 35hz peak.

    The graph is an old one but illistrates that even a faily well calibrated sub has plenty of peaks and dips. In this example you see at 35hz there is a 16db delta between top and bottom.
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    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

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  23. #23

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    haha wow, this is some other level stuff
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


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    Quote Originally Posted by thsmith View Post
    The graph is an old one but illistrates that even a faily well calibrated sub has plenty of peaks and dips. In this example you see at 35hz there is a 16db delta between top and bottom.
    Yes, but as with any equalization, you can't fix dips caused by nulls in your room (and neither can Audyssey). The more you boost them, the more headroom you lose from the amp (and the muddier you can make the subwoofer sound, in extreme cases). That's why Audyssey has a limitation on how much it will try to correct nulls.

    But yes, you want it as flat as possible before you start... which is why sub positioning and (if necessary) room treatments take priority over equalization. As I said, garbage in = garbage out.
    Equipment list:
    Onkyo TX-NR3010 9.2 AVR
    Emotiva XPA-3 amp
    Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, RTi38 surrounds, RTi28 rears and heights
    SVS 20-39CS+ subwoofer powered by Crown XLS1500
    Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray player
    DarbeeVision DVP5000 video processor
    Epson 8500UB 1080p projector
    Elite Screens Sable 120" CineWhite screen

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyDugs View Post
    when i calibrated at 50%on the sub, audyssey set the avr at +4.5 so i will just put it back.
    That doesn't make any sense. If Audyssey set the AVR level lower when the sub was set lower, then you're not getting consistent calibration results. What should happen is the AVR volume will be set lower when the sub is higher, and vice-versa, to achieve the same reference volume.
    2.1: Peachtree DAC●iT>Yaqin MC-10L w/6CA7-EH, Voskhod 6N1P-EV>polkaudio RT25i, PSW202

    5.1: ATI HD5850 HDMI Bitstreaming>Denon AVR-1910>polkaudio RT7, CS350-LS, RT3, PSW505, Sony Bravia KDL-52W3000

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    Use bass heavy music such as "Hard Day" George Michael, "Piano Smasher" Blue Man Group, etc; and set your level so bass lines are deep, but CLEAN. Bass is like sugar, and easy to over-do, always err on the side of clean bass. Your sub should never stand out, it should simply, steathly, fill-in.

    All of the above advice is assuming you want quality rather than quantity of bass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrmoeone View Post
    So I just did the auto set up on my receiver and the subs seems a little quiet. Is it ok to turn the volume knob up on the sub to get some more bass or does that interfere with the readings audyssey gave me? I have the LFE crossover set to 120hz, my main and center channels are 80hz and surrounds 120hz. Any help is very much appreciated
    If Audyssey set your speakers to Large that could be why your subs seem quiet. Try manually setting the speakers to Small and see what you get.
    Polkaudio Fronts: RTi A7's Vr3 Fortress Edition / Wyred 4 Sound mAMP's
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  28. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tbone289 View Post
    That doesn't make any sense. If Audyssey set the AVR level lower when the sub was set lower, then you're not getting consistent calibration results. What should happen is the AVR volume will be set lower when the sub is higher, and vice-versa, to achieve the same reference volume.
    I think you are just misunderstanding...I didn't re-calibrate. I just meant originally when i first calibrated my result was +4.5 and the sub at 50%
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyDugs View Post
    I think you are just misunderstanding...I didn't re-calibrate. I just meant originally when i first calibrated my result was +4.5 and the sub at 50%
    Yes, that makes sense.
    2.1: Peachtree DAC●iT>Yaqin MC-10L w/6CA7-EH, Voskhod 6N1P-EV>polkaudio RT25i, PSW202

    5.1: ATI HD5850 HDMI Bitstreaming>Denon AVR-1910>polkaudio RT7, CS350-LS, RT3, PSW505, Sony Bravia KDL-52W3000

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tbone289 View Post
    Yes, that makes sense.
    While you are here...what is Virtual mode on avr?
    My SETUP

    AVR: Denon 1913
    Main L/R: Polk LS90's
    Center: Polk CS350LS
    Side Surrounds: Polk LS/FX's
    Rear Surrounds: Polk RT/FX's
    Subwoofer: Polk PSW300


    100% Cinematic Adventures, 0% Music

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