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  1. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by falconcry72 View Post
    The same could be said about some of the amps in question here. The similarity of the used price of one vs. the new price of the other is what puts them in the same "class" of consideration.

    I got my 5 channel Rotel RMB-1095 for 750 bucks. Same "price class" as a new XPA-5. The Emotiva has a warranty; the Rotel does not. The Rotel sounds better. Easy decision for me.
    It is not a comparison. Reliability of a car is not subjective like this hobby. I dont care how you spin it, it is not the same. Hyndai and Kia have for the most part been at the bottom when it comes to reliability and Acura is always at the top. Acura is an all around better product and has proved it for many years. That is a no brainer. Comparing what is a better car to which amp subjective sounds better is not a comparison.

    The rotel sounds better to you. subjective. My experience with emotiva is alot different than most here. I didnt have the xpa5 but I owned the xpr5 and xpr2 and I demoed the xpa1s in my home. In my opinion, which once again is subjective, they stood toe to toe with all the amps in my house. But I am not going to get into a Emo conversation.

    To the op, demo all that you can. You have nothing to lose but return shipping. find what sounds best to your ears and go with that. You can get opinions all day because everyone has one but the only one matters is yours. In this hobby it is best to try things out for yourself in your system. What someone else might like might sound like garbadge to you and vice versa.

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by falconcry72 View Post
    That's why you buy used... try something out for a while, then sell it and MAKE money.
    I've got two Parasounds (HCA-2003 and 1206) and an Adcom (GFA-5503) in the closet that say otherwise. $1,300+ worth of no freakin' warranty right there, taking up space, not to mention what I spent trying to have them fixed. Just sayin'!
    Equipment list:
    Onkyo TX-NR3010 9.2 AVR
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    Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, RTi38 surrounds, RTi28 rears and heights
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    Oppo BDP-93 Blu-ray player
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  3. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuntasensei View Post
    I've got two Parasounds (HCA-2003 and 1206) and an Adcom (GFA-5503) in the closet that say otherwise. $1,300+ worth of no freakin' warranty right there, taking up space, not to mention what I spent trying to have them fixed. Just sayin'!
    That's an easy fix... you need better karma! joke. Your situation is rare, but a reality nonetheless and worth consideration for the the OP.
    2-Channel:

    Source 1: PC
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  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by rdb2001 View Post
    I am curious how Hyundai or Kia were even on your radar if you were looking at Acura. Would think you would be looking at lexus, infiniti, audi, bmw etc. Those cars are not even in the same class as the Acura.
    I had $25k to spend. Wanted to pay cash and not have to worry about a payment. $25k cash won't buy you a new Lexus, Infiniti, etc etc. But it will buy you a new Sonata.
    Or it will buy you a certified pre owned Acura with extended warranty.
    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
    I may have an addiction... RTA-15TL, SDA 2, LSi25, LSi15, LSi9, LSi7, LSiCx2, LSiFX, LS/FX, RT/FX, DSW MP2000...and that's just the Polks...

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by rdb2001 View Post
    Reliability of a car is not subjective like this hobby. I dont care how you spin it, it is not the same. Hyndai and Kia have for the most part been at the bottom when it comes to reliability and Acura is always at the top.
    May want to ask JD Power about that.
    Budget and entry brands like Hyundai, Kia and Scion have been stepping up their game greatly the last few years...so much so that they have surpassed a lot of those "premium" brands in reliability ratings.
    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
    I may have an addiction... RTA-15TL, SDA 2, LSi25, LSi15, LSi9, LSi7, LSiCx2, LSiFX, LS/FX, RT/FX, DSW MP2000...and that's just the Polks...

  6. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
    May want to ask JD Power about that.
    Budget and entry brands like Hyundai, Kia and Scion have been stepping up their game greatly the last few years...so much so that they have surpassed a lot of those "premium" brands in reliability ratings.
    ^This^ CR says the same thing...

  7. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
    I had $25k to spend. Wanted to pay cash and not have to worry about a payment. $25k cash won't buy you a new Lexus, Infiniti, etc etc. But it will buy you a new Sonata.
    Or it will buy you a certified pre owned Acura with extended warranty.
    25k cash will not buy you a new acura either. But it will buy you a used car from any of those premium brands. I guess you were looking at new vs used options.

  8. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZLTFUL View Post
    May want to ask JD Power about that.
    Budget and entry brands like Hyundai, Kia and Scion have been stepping up their game greatly the last few years...so much so that they have surpassed a lot of those "premium" brands in reliability ratings.
    http://www.jdpower.com/consumer-rati...tive/index.htm

  9. #69

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    It's amazing how quickly this thread got sidetracked and became about cars.

  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by txcoastal1 View Post
    Sunfire 7201
    I'm late to the party but consider this a +1 right here.
    Do you hear that buzzing noise?

  11. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by sarvic View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sarvic View Post
    I probably won't be getting a receiver yet for my theater room til next year sometime. If I had to get one now, it would be probably the Denon AVR-4520 although I did look at that Pioneer SC-68. The Marantz AV8801 looked nice but i'd need an amp for that one.Just looking into my options is all. :)
    Looking at those choices, do you plan to go 9.2 or 11.2 at some point? If not you could go with the Marantz AV7701 pre (refurb $1199 @ Acc4Less) + MM8077 7-ch (used $1500 @ ebay) both for $2699 total shipped.
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  12. #72

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    The MM8077 isn't rated for 4ohm operation.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

  13. #73

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    The LSiM speakers are rated at 8 Ohms (center measured 3.5 Ohm min), w/ 88 dB efficiency. The MM8077 should be fine given that the speakers will be crossed over at 80Hz I would guess., it did fine at 4 Ohm test: http://www.hometheater.com/content/m...8077-amplifier


    If the OP plans to run full tilt, that B-Stock Outlaw 7700 for $1799 might be the ticket for a few hundred more.



    as far as cars.....a new Hyundai Equus vs. used top of the line Lexus, Benz, Acura, BMW, Infiniti, Audi would seem like an easy choice for many...go with the proven used lux brands. However, with the improved quality of the Korean brand and the value over competing new models some might take a test drive.
    Last edited by WLDock; 04-26-2013 at 04:39 AM.
    FAMILY ROOM
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    2 Ch Dreaming...hoping to purchase, build someday???
    OPPO 105 | Cary or Rogue Audio tube Preamp | Parasound HALO A21 amp | DIY Mini Statements towers

  14. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by WLDock View Post
    The LSiM speakers are rated at 8 Ohms (center measured 3.5 Ohm min), w/ 88 dB efficiency. The MM8077 should be fine given that the speakers will be crossed over at 80Hz I would guess., it did fine at 4 Ohm test: http://www.hometheater.com/content/m...8077-amplifier


    If the OP plans to run full tilt, that B-Stock Outlaw 7700 for $1799 might be the ticket for a few hundred more.
    I would NOT be risking my expensive speakers on "should be." I would rather spend the extra money and get more power to cover everything. It's better to have the power and not need it rather than need it (after damage is done) and not have it.
    Sunfire TGP III PrePro, Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature 405wpc 5 ch. Amp, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Onkyo TA2600 Tape Deck, Pioneer Elite 47-A DVD, Sony 32" XBR TV, Polk RTA-8T Main Speakers, Boston VR-920 Center Channel, Boston PV-600 Subwoofer, Polk DSW 400 Subwoofer, Polk FXi-3 Surround Speakers

  15. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrizz View Post
    I would NOT be risking my expensive speakers on "should be." I would rather spend the extra money and get more power to cover everything. It's better to have the power and not need it rather than need it (after damage is done) and not have it.
    Wait a minute.....We are talking about critical audio components for a critical audio listener correct? There is nothing in the specs of the LSiM line or the MM8077 that would state that they won't work together. Especially given the fact that a person with a critical ear will have the control of the volume. The same hold true for a more rubust amp.....


    Nevertheless, by looking at third party test one an see that the Polks dop down some in impedance and the Marantz was tested at 4 Ohms.....all values that the manufactures don't really list.
    FAMILY ROOM
    TV - Mitsubishi WD-73734 73" DLP 1080P | AVR - Onkyo TX-NR3008 | Source - Sony PS3 Slim 320GB | Front - PolkAudio RT3000p | Center -PolkAudio CS400i | Surround - PolkAudio F/X1000 | Sub - DIY Stereo Integrity HT 15 | Sub Amp - Behringer EUROPOWER EP2500

    2 Ch Dreaming...hoping to purchase, build someday???
    OPPO 105 | Cary or Rogue Audio tube Preamp | Parasound HALO A21 amp | DIY Mini Statements towers

  16. #76

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    Testing an amp for a 4 ohm load is a short process. The manufacturer may not list it as 4 ohm capable because in practical use it's a much longer time span the amp has to run at 4 ohm loads which it may not be able to handle. A sign of a not very robust power supply if you ask me.

  17. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by tonyb View Post
    Testing an amp for a 4 ohm load is a short process. The manufacturer may not list it as 4 ohm capable because in practical use it's a much longer time span the amp has to run at 4 ohm loads which it may not be able to handle. A sign of a not very robust power supply if you ask me.
    It depends on which testing you are talking about. The testing run by reviewers maybe short, but the test required for FTC is not. Amplifiers that would be capable of driving into 4 ohms in real world conditions without a problem may fail during the preconditioning required for the FTC testing. Since 4 ohm claims for continuous power in the US would be based on FTC claims, it would not be listed then.

    I have not seen the full impedance and phase angle by frequency plot for any of the LSiM series, so it is hard to know for sure how hard they are to drive. I would tend to take Polk at their word that these speakers are not too hard to drive. (At PolkFest they drove a full set of seven off a Marantz receiver at volumes as loud as I would ever need.) Having one dip to 3.5 ohms is not inconsistent with any normal nominal 8 ohm speaker as long as the phase angle is reasonable in that range. Unless you plan to listen to test tones in that range at loud volumes, it is unlikely to cause any problems.

  18. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by Face View Post
    Unlike yours, my recommendations are based on experience. Besides the use of better parts, the rest of the added expense are due to them being designed and made in the US.
    Please enlighten us as to what "inferior" parts Emotiva uses...

  19. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by moodyman View Post
    Please enlighten us as to what "inferior" parts Emotiva uses...
    Time to make my popcorn and settle in for a "fun" friday night debate

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  20. #80

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    wow - an amp thread is turning into an emo discussion? Who would have guessed....

    We need a sticky thread for these so they can endlessly battle it out.

  21. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by WLDock View Post
    Looking at those choices, do you plan to go 9.2 or 11.2 at some point? If not you could go with the Marantz AV7701 pre (refurb $1199 @ Acc4Less) + MM8077 7-ch (used $1500 @ ebay) both for $2699 total shipped.
    For the next 3-5 years, i'll probably just stick with a 7.2 setup in my current house. Maybe later down the road i'd entertain the idea of a 9.2 or 11.2 setup but that depends on what i'm doing then. In my theater room right now, the best I could do is 9.2 with front wides, but for now, i'm cool with just a 7.2 setup

  22. #82

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    So has anyone tested both the Outlaw 7700 and the Sunfire 7201 to compare either one?

  23. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by sarvic View Post
    So has anyone tested both the Outlaw 7700 and the Sunfire 7201 to compare either one?
    Yes my buddy has the Outlaw and I have the Sunfire in my dedicated room. Sunfire is going to be easier to handle, other than that they both perform very well. It's really a choice of which you want. I also owned the Outlaw monoblocks and performed really well for me. Both have a very good sound, produce tons of power, and should do exactly what you need. Outlaw will have good customer service, my buddy had to send his in for repair once.

    If you decide to go ICEAmps then consider D-Sonic or Wyred4Sound. I have a 1000S on my fronts and at 525wpc it produces tons of power in a small chasis. With the IceAmps you can custom configure the modules as you desire. 250/500 for the front stage, less power for rear/surrounds. Cost will be a tad more, but you certainly have the budget for it.
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  24. #84

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    What do you mean by "easier to handle"?

  25. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by sarvic View Post
    What do you mean by "easier to handle"?
    I am guessing he is referring to the weight. The Outlaw is 93lbs while the sunfire is 43lbs.

  26. #86

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    wow, that is a pretty big weight difference...lol

  27. #87

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    The Sunfire was the only 5 channel amp that I could lift at the time that I got it, which is why I got it. It has powered all of my speakers beautifully and stays nice and cool.
    Sunfire TGP III PrePro, Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature 405wpc 5 ch. Amp, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Onkyo TA2600 Tape Deck, Pioneer Elite 47-A DVD, Sony 32" XBR TV, Polk RTA-8T Main Speakers, Boston VR-920 Center Channel, Boston PV-600 Subwoofer, Polk DSW 400 Subwoofer, Polk FXi-3 Surround Speakers

  28. #88

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    Seeing that the Sunfire is about half the weight of the Outlaw as well as being able to stay pretty cool from it's Tracking Downconverter technology, maybe the 7201 might be the way to go...

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