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  1. #1

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    Default New to Club Polk : SDA CRS+ questions.

    I have had some Polk Monitor 10s that I have had for a few years and love the sound of them. I had to realign the magnets on some and JB Weld all the mid/bass drivers so I thought the SDA's (being the holy grail), would be something I should pursue. I found a pair of CRS+ in good shape on CL while I was on vacation and bought them. I heard them and was not blown away but thought "they'll sound better with my setup". I got them home and I'm a bit disappointed. I have some old Small Advents and a pair of DCM TF400s that have a more pleasing balance to my ear. I'm not hearing the SDA "magic" I was hoping for. What would be the first step to bringing out that "magic". Replacing the tweeters, redoing the crossovers or what?

  2. #2

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    No need to replace tweeters for SDA effect.

    Boston A400, DefTech BP10,BP-2, Klipsch KG2.5,KG4,KSP-400,KSF-C5,RF3,RC3.
    JBL L20t,L80t3,L166, EPI 20+,T/E 280, Polk 4,4.5,7C,RTA-11T, KEF Coda III, Yamaha NS-690.
    SUB:PF15TL+, Energy e:XL-S8, Optimus SW-10P, Velodyne VA08BVX10. Pre: HK AP2500. Amps: BB175, Adcom GFA-555II, Rotel RB-990BX.

  3. #3

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    There is no shortage of SDA magic in the beat up old pair of CRS+ that I bought.

    Did your purchase include the interconnect cable that runs between the two speakers?
    Did you set them up as described in the manual, which you can find in the Support pull down at the top of this page? They are quite particular about being parallel to the back wall, 3' or more from side walls and 4' or more between.

    Jim
    5.1 System:
    Sharp Aquos 37" LCD
    Front: SDA-CRS+
    Center: CS400i
    Surround: Monitor 7A
    PSW10 subwoofer
    Onkyo PR-SC886P Pre/Pro
    NAD T955 5 channel power amplifier
    Technics SL-1710 MK2 turntable
    Audio-Technica AT14Sa cartridge
    NAD 106 pre-amp
    Panasonic DMP-BD85 Blu-Ray
    MacBook Pro 2.16 GHz

    2.0 Office System:
    Monitor 10A (Peerless)
    Outlaw 1050 receiver
    Parasound HCA-1000A power amp
    MacPro

  4. #4

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    In order to get the SDA effect, you definitely need to have the interconnect cable.
    No interconnect, no SDA.

  5. #5

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    BTW, Welcome to CP!

  6. #6

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    Welcome to CP hallga77. Have a little patience and let's figure out what's up with your speakers, because CRS+'s should blow the Monitor 10's away. As others have said, there's no SDA magic unless you have the interconnect.

    Sounds like you've got the appetite for some mods, have a look at this thread of mine:

    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...s-are-complete!
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.

  7. #7

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    An accurate description of how you have them set up and what gear you are using would be a big help.
    'Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end."

  8. #8

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    Welcome to the club, as others have stated, give us some more info
    Home Theater
    Onkyo PR-SC5508 Sharp LC-70LE847U
    Emotiva XPA-5 Emotiva XPA-2 Emotiva UPA-2
    Front RTi-A9 Wide RTi-A7 Center CSi-A6 Surround FXi-A6 Rear RTi-A3 Sub 2x PSW505
    Sony BDP-S790 Dishnetwork Hopper/Joey Logitech Harmony One Apple TV
    Two Channel
    Oppo 105D BAT VK-500 w/BatPack SDA SRS 2.3 Dreadnought Squeezebox Touch Apple TV

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by hallga77 View Post
    I have had some Polk Monitor 10s that I have had for a few years and love the sound of them. I had to realign the magnets on some and JB Weld all the mid/bass drivers so I thought the SDA's (being the holy grail), would be something I should pursue. I found a pair of CRS+ in good shape on CL while I was on vacation and bought them. I heard them and was not blown away but thought "they'll sound better with my setup". I got them home and I'm a bit disappointed. I have some old Small Advents and a pair of DCM TF400s that have a more pleasing balance to my ear. I'm not hearing the SDA "magic" I was hoping for. What would be the first step to bringing out that "magic". Replacing the tweeters, redoing the crossovers or what?
    I was disappointed with my CRS+ not having the SDA sound when I first got them. It turned out to a problem with them not being wired correctly. The SDA sound is nearly non existent if the polarity of the speaker connections isn't correct. In my case the previous owner had installed and new mid-woofer and had the wires going to it reversed. When I got it right it made all the difference of night and day in how the speakers sound. You should check for proper polarity all the way from the amp to the drivers. Don't take anything for granted. You can read about my experience with it in the link below.

    CRS-Just-arrived-Need-help-checking-them-out
    SDA 2BTL Sonicaps Mills resistors RDO-198s New gaskets H-nuts Erse inductors Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
    Adcom GTP-450 preamp
    Adcom GFA-555 amp Upgrades & speaker protection added by OldmanSRS
    Pioneer DV-610AV DVD/CD player
    SDA CRS+ Hidden away in the closet

  10. #10

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    Welcome to CP! Members who have responded here have a wealth of knowledge - follow their advice and you'll get those CRS+'s singing like they should.
    "Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills, polyswitches removed, Lg Solen inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR binding posts, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheets (3" strips) installed on back wall behind MW's & Tweeters, interior of cabinets sealed, AI-1 interface with 1000VA transformer

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by F1nut View Post
    An accurate description of how you have them set up and what gear you are using would be a big help.
    agreed.... If not properly set up with enough power they will not sound good at all-if not damage something also..the sda's arent just a speaker to bring home and hook up to your everyday receiver..properly placement & accs are a must to make them operate to specs...hook them to a nice amp & make them sing for you....welcome to Club Polk. Stick around & youll love those CRS's
    RANDY
    ~SDA2b Adcom gfa555 565pre 555t 600cd Pioneer PLa35d
    ~SDA1c Denon POA2200 Yamaha RX-V1(gold) HK25 AT-LP120tt-HT 4/rs Cs400i/cc Premier Acoustic PA-150 subwoofer
    ~Marantz 2252b 5025b 6300tt Tech-a4010s monitor 7b
    ~Yamaha cr2040 Advent2 Monitor 10a
    ~Rotel RV555 monitor 4 series 2 -office-
    ~Pioneer seQ404 headphones

  12. #12

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    I do have the stock interconnect in place. They are about 10ft apart 9 inches out from the wall which is the long wall of a 16 x 11. Plaster walls, wall to wall carpet, 2 doorless openings on the left as I face the speakers. A 6 ft wide, 3 ft high 2ft deep wooden equipment cabinet in between the speakers. I have the SDAs sitting on 29 inch stands (wooden bar stools actually). currently they are hooked up to an NAD 3150 Integrated. The main music sources are a CAL Tercet CD player and a few different vintage turntables. They sound a bit harsh compared to the old Small Advents and the DCM TF400s that I have been using.

  13. #13

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    Thanks for all the greetings and advice. I'm not giving up yet.

  14. #14

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    A picture might help to but sounds like you have them too far apart, should be 6-8' and if I read correctly you have a wooden cabinet between them so you need to pull them out 2" past the cabinet to start with.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs

    Ofc: Wright WLA12 preamp: Anthem Amp 1: Pio Elite DV-79AVI: Airport Express: CAL Sigma II DAC: PA LS90 sonicaps and mills

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by thsmith View Post
    A picture might help to but sounds like you have them too far apart, should be 6-8' and if I read correctly you have a wooden cabinet between them so you need to pull them out 2" past the cabinet to start with.
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    This!
    There should be as close to a perfect triangle as possible, between you and the speakers for the best SDA effect.
    As others have said, check polarity of the drivers, compared with the wiring diagram. Also, make sure the rear binding posts are correct as well. On both speaker, facing the back of the speaker, the red terminal should be on the left, black on the right.
    If you have a multimeter, check that the interconnect cable is good. there should be continuity from end to end between the two "pins" that carry the signal. The "blade" should also have continuity from end to end, but doesn't actually carry the signal in that generation SDA.
    You NAD, at 60 watts per channel is not going to get you far with the CRS+s. Couldn't find out whether it's even rated for 6 ohms either.
    Correction, I did find one source that said it was 50 watts per channel, but had plenty of headroom, and could handle 2 ohm loads. you might be OK
    Welcome to Club Polk
    Last edited by westmassguy; 06-19-2013 at 07:57 PM.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  16. #16

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    Also make sure the speakers themselves are in the correct position. They're marked left and right. Make sure they're setup that way
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  17. #17

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    Welcome ! The harshness could be the tweeters or the crossovers we are 23+years.

    A lot can be done by updating the tweeters and the crossovers.

    You should be able to hear the difference with the IC cable
    plugged and unplugged

    Picture uploads need to be below 300k or they won't work.

    Please check this SDA Handbook and crossover information website.

    vr3mods.com/uploads/SDA_Handbook_2011_Rev2.pdf

    http://www.gimpod.com/


    Quote Originally Posted by hallga77 View Post
    I do have the stock interconnect in place. They are about 10ft apart 9 inches out from the wall which is the long wall of a 16 x 11. Plaster walls, wall to wall carpet, 2 doorless openings on the left as I face the speakers. A 6 ft wide, 3 ft high 2ft deep wooden equipment cabinet in between the speakers. I have the SDAs sitting on 29 inch stands (wooden bar stools actually). currently they are hooked up to an NAD 3150 Integrated. The main music sources are a CAL Tercet CD player and a few different vintage turntables. They sound a bit harsh compared to the old Small Advents and the DCM TF400s that I have been using.

  18. #18

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    As stated, they are too far apart. The cabinet in between may cause issues, but if you pull them out past the leading edge, you will lose a lot of bass, which they are a bit shy on to begin with. Ideally, SDA's should be about 6" off the back wall and parallel to it. Do not toe in, period.

    The SL2000 tweeter has a nasty 5dB spike around 13kHz. The RD0194-1 replacement is much better. You can also upgrade them to use the RD0198-1 tweeter, which is even better.

    there should be continuity from end to end between the two "pins" that carry the signal. The "blade" should also have continuity from end to end, but doesn't actually carry the signal in that generation SDA.
    Slight correction needed, the blade does not have continuity in the regular SDA cable. It does in the AI-1 SDA cable.
    'Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end."

  19. #19

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    By golly you're right F1
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  20. #20

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    Those guys from Mars are always right. Name:  Clipboard011.jpg
Views: 181
Size:  10.4 KB

    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    By golly you're right F1

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by PolkieMan View Post
    Those guys from Mars are always right. Attachment 86485
    LOL

    Man am I getting old...
    I watched the show when it wasn't in reruns
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    LOL

    Man am I getting old...
    I watched the show when it wasn't in reruns
    Uuhhhhhhh - me too!

    Loved it when "Martin's" antenna raised and he went invisible. Man how I wished I could do that!
    "Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills, polyswitches removed, Lg Solen inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR binding posts, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheets (3" strips) installed on back wall behind MW's & Tweeters, interior of cabinets sealed, AI-1 interface with 1000VA transformer

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by drumminman View Post
    Uuhhhhhhh - me too!

    Loved it when "Martin's" antenna raised and he went invisible. Man how I wished I could do that!
    Yeah, that and the "X-Ray" glasses on the back of comic books lol, if only they worked.
    Way off topic, apologies to the OP
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  24. #24

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    Default Photo of SDA CRS+ setup after suggested adjustments

    Thanks for the suggestions. Current setup after suggested adjustments. I think they need to be raised another 4-5 inches. I hear a better soundstage when I am slouching badly but there is a big improvement. I knew the cabinet was a problem but had them closer to the wall because they sounded a little thin. Are the improved replacement tweeters still available from Polk or is there another source? Trying to post a picture along with this. Not sure it is working, though. I don't see the picture so I guess not.
    Last edited by hallga77; 06-30-2013 at 11:16 PM.

  25. #25

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    Default No luck with picture upload.

    No luck with picture upload.

  26. #26

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    Is your seating made from cloth and is your head above the back when sitting straight up? I notice an improved soundstage when slouching because I get less reflections that way.
    Usher CP-6311, Shuguang S200MK, Shuguang S845MK, Pioneer BDP-51fd, Douglas IC's, AQ cv-8 SC's, Pangea/Douglas PC's, Epson 8100

  27. #27

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    Sofa is cloth with miniblinds and a picture window above it behind me. I think the soundstage for any of my speakers would be improved if I moved them to the short wall in my rectangle but with the small 32inch flat screen on top of the cabinet would block a window so that's not going to help unless I just set them up for music instead of HT.

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    Last edited by hallga77; 07-01-2013 at 12:37 AM.

  29. #29

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    You need to get real speaker stands that can be shot loaded and spiked. Ideally, you want the tweeter at ear level, which is normally 39" to 42" from the floor.

    Yes, Polk sells the RD0194-1, which is the direct replacement. They also sell the RD0198-1 should you want to do the TL upgrade, which I strongly suggest.

    To load a pic, do not preview your post.
    'Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end."

  30. #30

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    Thanks for the input. I knew the makeshift stands would not be the ideal thing but the stools were the only thing I could come up with quickly that would be close to tall enough and reasonably stable. I would have liked to have had the original Polk stands but the guy I bought them from didn't have them. I just wanted to get a better idea of what they'd sound like before getting in too deep.

    The tweeter swap and other mods/upgrades are all things I might pursue.

    Thanks for the picture tip as well.

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