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  1. #1

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    Default Mission Next ... Pre Amp ... For the LSIM setup

    I am almost done setting up my Nirvana Rig.. Thanks to you all guys!.


    In the next few months, once I recover from the current audio debt i would like to add a "PreAmp" with HT bypass for pure music and a "Pre Pro" for HT/Movies.

    I have some basic undertsanding about pre pro but i am little clueless on the pre amp section and hence i thought i start a head gather some infomration and bother some dealers before i pulll the trigger.

    I would like to start with Pre Amp for musical bliss.


    As suggested by my audio guru, the best possible combination is a Tube Pre Amp with SS Amp Like my Black Mamba

    After reading through bunch of threads here looks like most of you guys concur with that combination.

    the only Pre Amp i had in mind until now is SS pre amp "Parasound Halo JC2" but would like to move to tube domain with the help of our helpful polkies here. Are there any good SS Pre AMP contenders?

    Here is my current setup and my budget is up to 3k ... I would like to get a new one intead of used.

    LSIM 707
    LSIM 706
    LSIM 703
    Parasound Hal A51 aka Black Mamba
    MIT Shotgun S3's for Fronts and Center
    AVR-Onkyo 709

    As always your time and help is much appreciated

    So please let me know your suggestions on PreAmps
    Last edited by Sumerian; 09-10-2013 at 08:19 AM.

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    but would like to move to tube domain with the help of our helpful polkies here. Are there any good SS Pre AMP contenders?

    So please let me know your suggestions on PreAmps
    I'm confused. Are you looking for a tube pre or a SS pre? It's rare to find a tube pre with and HT bypass, if at all.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    I'm confused. Are you looking for a tube pre or a SS pre? It's rare to find a tube pre with and HT bypass, if at all.

    H9
    Both

    Since HT bypass is rare in Tube, i would like to take suggestins for both

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    I'm confused. Are you looking for a tube pre or a SS pre? It's rare to find a tube pre with and HT bypass, if at all.

    H9
    My Odyssey Candela has HT bypass....does it count??


    Sad thing is, I haven't hooked it up yet.....

  5. #5

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    Pricey....This is one of my all time favorites

    The VT231's he is offering are a wonderful tube...and its a black unit w/HT bypass

    http://app.audiogon.com/listings/tub...01-altadena-ca
    Home Theater:Samsung8000-55LED,Pioneer SC35, Pioneer DV-79AVi, Sunfire TGA7201, LSi25, LCi RTSc, LC80i
    2chnl system:Melody 101 tube pre, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, W4S Dac, MG Audio Planus2 speaker cables
    Office rig: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures

  6. #6

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    So with 3k I cannot get a decent tube?

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    So with 3k I cannot get a decent tube?
    I would think so.

  8. #8

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    You can get great tube preamp w/3k probably won't have HT bypass

    And don't rule out used, ton of great deals out there

    brgman a Polk member has a wonderful Joule Electra in the Flea market and a stand up guy and would match your other black gear.

    http://app.audiogon.com/listings?pag...er_category_id[]=31&min_condition=1&max_condition=11&listing_types _auctions=1&listing_types_classifieds=1
    Home Theater:Samsung8000-55LED,Pioneer SC35, Pioneer DV-79AVi, Sunfire TGA7201, LSi25, LCi RTSc, LC80i
    2chnl system:Melody 101 tube pre, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, W4S Dac, MG Audio Planus2 speaker cables
    Office rig: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures

  9. #9
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  10. #10

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    I believe Prima Luna has HT bypass in their Pre's

  11. #11

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    My Cary SLP-98 can (and probably will be) moded with a HT by-pass. Done by Cary, the upgrade is $225 per their web site. Other upgrades are available, too. I am pleased with my "Sweet Little Pre" and it can be had (used, of course) for well under your 3K budget. It is definitely one of the pre amps to consider, IMHO

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    Source Oppo 105
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  12. #12

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    I'd say toss that onkyo 709 and step up to a nice pre/pro like the Marantz 8801 or Anthem.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    ... I would like to add a "PreAmp" with HT bypass for pure music and a "Pre Pro" for HT/Movies.
    I would like to start with Pre Amp for musical bliss.
    WOW, this can start to get expensive. Is $3K your budget just for the 2 ch pre? Have you really thought about your total system goals? I'm sort of in the same boat as you in that I'm in the design stages of figuring out what I want. The BIG issue is how far do you want to go with a HT pre/pro? Or is that really the direction you want to go? Yes, you alredy purchased a muti channel amp, but what if a 2 ch tube preamp w/ HT bypass, with a couple of monoblocks, and an Elite SC AVR is what you are really after? Is the A52 going to be your only amp? Do you want all out 2 ch and all out HT? or 70% music, 30% HT, etc, etc, etc.....

    Anyway, here is a pretty good Master list of units that have a HT bypass:
    http://www.audiophile.no/articles-in...rocessor-input


    I think you should really think of how far you want to go and if you are heading in the right direction before dropping down up to three large ones.
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  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by leroyjr1 View Post
    I'd say toss that onkyo 709 and step up to a nice pre/pro like the Marantz 8801 or Anthem.
    An Anthem new (50v or D2v) will not be under $3k new, but they are great units (I have the 50v and D1). I also think you can't go wrong with the Marantz. Unless you are going to go crazy with room treatments at a pro level, either Audyssey XT32 or Anthem's ARC are a real benefit in two channel.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    I'm confused. Are you looking for a tube pre or a SS pre? It's rare to find a tube pre with and HT bypass, if at all.

    H9
    My Rogue Magnum 99 has HT bypass.

    Jim

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by vmaxer View Post
    My Odyssey Candela has HT bypass....does it count??


    Sad thing is, I haven't hooked it up yet.....
    $1500 for the Candela, Klaus may charge a bit more to put HT bypass on it. I use it all day/every day and it works fine.
    Aaron

  17. #17

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    Used Anthem Pre-2L. Tube amp with HT bypass. Can be found in the $600 range used. The only problem is they don't come around for sale often and sell quick when they do!

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgfish View Post
    Used Anthem Pre-2L. Tube amp with HT bypass. Can be found in the $600 range used. The only problem is they don't come around for sale often and sell quick when they do!
    This sounds like a nice little preamp Dawgfish, for all it offers for around $600.00 used, might be more attainable and a possibility someday.

  19. #19

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    It appears there are more tube choices with HT bypass. I wonder if the tube pre-amps have to be powered on to use the pass through. That could shorten tube life. But something like the Candela and then a nice HT processor might get the job done, probably not for $3K, especially if want a nice dedicated HT pre as opposed to an AVR.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30; Eastern Electric Mini Max; Adcom GDA600; MIT S3/Z Pc; SDA 1C; Squeezebox; Tubes add soul!

  20. #20

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    Ok down the line .. my plan is to upgrade my AVR to HT Pre pro Marantz 8801 or Yamaha CX -A5000 and have a dedicated Pre amp for music.

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    It appears there are more tube choices with HT bypass. I wonder if the tube pre-amps have to be powered on to use the pass through. That could shorten tube life. But something like the Candela and then a nice HT processor might get the job done, probably not for $3K, especially if want a nice dedicated HT pre as opposed to an AVR.

    H9
    I believe they do need to be powered on H9, so that is a valid point. My guess though is after the OP hears the LSiMs on tubes, the ht won't get used much! :-)

    Polkie2009 they are a very solid performer. When you factor in the performance, solid features, and relatively moderate cost, they are a real sleeper. There's a reason you don't see too many for sale and they go quickly when they do. Btw there's one for sale right now on eBay, but they're asking $1200 for it. That's way above ithe normal going rate for those.

    To the OP, the Adcom GFP 750 is a stellar solid state preamp with ht pass through. I would put that on your short list also. They typically go for about $600-750 used.
    Last edited by Dawgfish; 09-10-2013 at 08:56 PM.

  22. #22

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    Why limit yourself to something with an HT pass through?You could simply connect the front left and right outputs of the processor to any auxilary input on the pre.Sure the pre amp will need to be turned on but the addition of it's gain circuit in the signal path should be a non issue sonically assuming a decent low noise design.You just have to remember to set the pre's level to the same point you calibrated your levels at everytime you watch a movie.I use this approach and works perfectly fine for me.
    Last edited by FTGV; 09-10-2013 at 09:19 PM.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTGV View Post
    Why limit yourself to something with an HT pass through?You could simply connect the front left and right outputs of the processor to any auxilary input on the pre.Sure the pre amp will need to be turned on but the addition of it's gain circuit in the signal path should be a non issue sonically assuming a decent low noise design.You just have to remember to set the pre's level to the same point you calibrated your levels at everytime you watch a movie.I use this approach and works perfectly fine for me.
    Thats sounds like plan but the assumption is that preprocessor is running on pure audio mode and it is not adding any noise or deterioration to the signal

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    Thats sounds like plan but the assumption is that preprocessor is running on pure audio mode and it is not adding any noise or deterioration to the signal
    The sonic signature of the processor will be present regardless of wether you use an active pre or HT bypass after it.Assuming a good low noise neutral sounding pre it should add little to the mix.


    To clarify the preamp would be after the processor in the signal chain.
    Last edited by FTGV; 09-10-2013 at 09:31 PM.

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTGV View Post
    The sonic signature of the processor will be present regardless of wether you use an active pre or HT bypass after it.Assuming a good low noise neutral sounding pre it should add little to the mix.


    To clarify the preamp would be after the processor in the signal chain.

    ok gottcha, that helps

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    that is really eye catching...like a antique lab equipment looks gorgeous...

    is it a well regarded brand?

  27. #27

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    The purpose of HT Bypass is that your source(DAC/CDP/Phono Pre) plugs into the 2 channel pre with HT Bypass, and from there directly into the amp, removing the processor for music listening. IMO, a good 2 channel preamp will stomp all over the best of HT processors for 2 channel music listening. This is after owning processors from Mac and Marantz...
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    that is really eye catching...like a antique lab equipment looks gorgeous...

    is it a well regarded brand?
    Yes it is.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

  29. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sumerian View Post
    Thats sounds like plan but the assumption is that preprocessor is running on pure audio mode and it is not adding any noise or deterioration to the signal
    Maybe its me but, if I had a tube preamp, no way in heck would I want it on anytime I wanted to bypass it...tubes are expensive. The idea of a pre that will bypass while turned off sounds better, IMO.

    http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.p...d&zzAsindc&4&5

    The Cary Audio one that GlennDog posted the SLP-98 sounds like a very nice piece, a lot of nice feedback plus it will bypass while off....and damn is that SLP-98L F1 version sexy and they do other finishes as well!
    http://www.upscaleaudio.com/products...Bypass%21.html

    Review
    http://www.stereophile.com/tubepream...ary/index.html

    Might be one to put on the list to listen to, maybe there is a shop in your area?
    Last edited by WLDock; 09-11-2013 at 12:03 AM.
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  30. #30

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    Maybe its me but, if I had a tube preamp, no way in heck would I want it on anytime I wanted to bypass it...tubes are expensive.
    Signal tubes such as those used in a tube pre amp last a very, very long time. They are not like power tubes, so really it's a non-factor.

    For example, the signal tubes in my one tube pre are always on and they have been in there at least 5 years.
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