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  1. #1

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    Default Monitor 10 crossover question w/ pic

    Thinking of recapping my 10's. I found the schematics page and I don't really understand how to read it but I can match the values to what I see on the actual crossover. Whats the big yellow one? Is that also a 12uF value and why does it look so different than the blue 12uF cap? Thanks for looking.
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    The blue caps are Non-Polarized Electrolytics. The yellow cap is Mylar. Electrolytics are much smaller than Film Caps.
    You'll want to replace all the caps with Metalized Polypropylene caps for the best sound. In addition, the Sand-Cast Resistors should be replaced with Mills MRA-12, or Mundorf Mox, Audio Grade Resistors. While you're at it, replace the little blue Polyswitch with a .5 ohm resistor, the same type as the others.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
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    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
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    Thanks for the quick reply! Very helpful.

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    The yellow one is what is known as a axial capacitor. They are used in Xover networks that do not require tough requirements. No set value...can go between about.47-to 1kuf. They are aluminum electrolytic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Msabot1 View Post
    The yellow one is what is known as a axial capacitor. They are used in Xover networks that do not require tough requirements. No set value...can go between about.47-to 1kuf. They are aluminum electrolytic.
    Axial is the mounting style, not the type of capacitor. The NP Electrolytics are also Axial mount. The Yellow cap is a Mylar Film Cap, not an Aluminum Electrolytic.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
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    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
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    I'll second replacing the polyswitch with a .5 Ohm resister (Mills type): it made a huge difference on my top end since my PS was so far out of spec (>1 Ohm).
    Yamaha DSP-A1 Integrated Amp
    (4) Polk Monitor 10B's w/SoniCaps, Mills, and RDO-194 tweets (R/L F/R)
    (2) Polk Monitor 4's w/peerless tweets (dual centers)
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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    Axial is the mounting style, not the type of capacitor. The NP Electrolytics are also Axial mount. The Yellow cap is a Mylar Film Cap, not an Aluminum Electrolytic.
    +1 cut one open you'll see lot and lots of mylar. you will not see any aluminum.

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    Thanks for the help. I'm listening now to the freshly recapped 10's and they sound incredible. Well worth the very little effort it took.

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    Good to hear! I have to admit: once I did it, I wondered why I had waited so long (of course the answer was $$).
    Yamaha DSP-A1 Integrated Amp
    (4) Polk Monitor 10B's w/SoniCaps, Mills, and RDO-194 tweets (R/L F/R)
    (2) Polk Monitor 4's w/peerless tweets (dual centers)
    B&O TX2 Turntable
    Nakamichi Cassette Deck 1
    Pioneer CLD-99 Elite LD
    Samsung BD-P2550 Blu-Ray/DVD
    LG LST-3410a OTA DVR
    Princeton AF3.0HD Monitor
    Optoma HD65 Projector

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    Quote Originally Posted by bwdst3 View Post
    Thanks for the help. I'm listening now to the freshly recapped 10's and they sound incredible. Well worth the very little effort it took.
    Awesome, enjoy them!
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

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    Quote Originally Posted by StantonZ View Post
    I'll second replacing the polyswitch with a .5 Ohm resister (Mills type): it made a huge difference on my top end since my PS was so far out of spec (>1 Ohm).

    In what way did it change the top end?
    Would it be just as good simply bypassing the Poly Switch with wire ?
    Last edited by kevintomb; 01-25-2014 at 08:05 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevintomb View Post
    In what way did it change the top end?
    Would it be just as good simply bypassing the Poly Switch with wire ?
    It "opens up" the top end (e.g. higher PS resistance was obviously attenuating upper frequencies). Replacing the PS with a wire (which I considered) would probably make it TOO bright, in addition to removing any sort of (tweeter) protection in the event of a surge.
    Yamaha DSP-A1 Integrated Amp
    (4) Polk Monitor 10B's w/SoniCaps, Mills, and RDO-194 tweets (R/L F/R)
    (2) Polk Monitor 4's w/peerless tweets (dual centers)
    B&O TX2 Turntable
    Nakamichi Cassette Deck 1
    Pioneer CLD-99 Elite LD
    Samsung BD-P2550 Blu-Ray/DVD
    LG LST-3410a OTA DVR
    Princeton AF3.0HD Monitor
    Optoma HD65 Projector

  13. #13

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    Polyswitches are a know issue with the older Polks. Their resistance is inconsistent even when new. Once tripped, their resistance changes, and they can introduce distortion in the signal. They are not precision devices by any stretch of the imagination. Polk even tried pre-conditioning them so their resistance would be consistent. Replacing them with a wire jumper will result in a higher tweeter output, and a "hot" or overly bright top end. Most replace the switch with a .5 ohm resistor, although some use a .2-.3 ohm as well. All depends on your particular taste.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    Polyswitches are a know issue with the older Polks. Their resistance is inconsistent even when new. Once tripped, their resistance changes, and they can introduce distortion in the signal. They are not precision devices by any stretch of the imagination. Polk even tried pre-conditioning them so their resistance would be consistent. Replacing them with a wire jumper will result in a higher tweeter output, and a "hot" or overly bright top end. Most replace the switch with a .5 ohm resistor, although some use a .2-.3 ohm as well. All depends on your particular taste.
    Gotcha....I tried simply jumper bypassing it and it did sound clearer, and with a bit too much treble, but I think it has a tad too much as is though.

    That 12.5 khz bump kinda annoys me on my Tweeters, and over the years, I am not sure if I am imagining it, but it seems worse now.

    I might even try a 1-2 ohm resistor.

    My old drivers and crossover are being used in a project I am undertaking for a friend, mainly just something to do. We are keeping the original baffle look of the 3 drivers, but on a short baffle about 22 inches high.

    Literally almost just cutting the RTA11t in half sorta, but made with new wood etc.

    It will be about the width of an old RTA8t, but only 22" high, and with the original 2 woofers and tweeter. WE realize it will limit the bass a good bit, but he has VERY limited room and a sub already so none of that will truly matter.

    Kinda the look of a 5jr+, but instead of the passive radiator it will be 2 woofers with the tweet centered between them.

    Not sure if we are gonna load it acoustic suspension or TRY one passive radiator.
    Last edited by kevintomb; 01-27-2014 at 08:28 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevintomb View Post
    Gotcha....I tried simply jumper bypassing it and it did sound clearer, and with a bit too much treble, but I think it has a tad too much as is though.

    That 12.5 khz bump kinda annoys me on my Tweeters, and over the years, I am not sure if I am imagining it, but it seems worse now.

    I might even try a 1-2 ohm resistor.

    My old drivers and crossover are being used in a project I am undertaking for a friend, mainly just something to do. We are keeping the original baffle look of the 3 drivers, but on a short baffle about 22 inches high.

    Literally almost just cutting the RTA11t in half sorta, but made with new wood etc.

    It will be about the width of an old RTA8t, but only 22" high, and with the original 2 woofers and tweeter. WE realize it will limit the bass a good bit, but he has VERY limited room and a sub already so none of that will truly matter.

    Kinda the look of a 5jr+, but instead of the passive radiator it will be 2 woofers with the tweet centered between them.

    Not sure if we are gonna load it acoustic suspension or TRY one passive radiator.
    I would go ported, not PR. I have the TS Parameters for most of the older drivers. Just punch them into WinISD or Bass Box Pro.
    As for the tweeters, there's really nothing you can do with the SL1000 or SL2000, other than a notch filter, but you're way better off with RDO-194s or even 198s if you do the TL Mod.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    I would go ported, not PR. I have the TS Parameters for most of the older drivers. Just punch them into WinISD or Bass Box Pro.
    As for the tweeters, there's really nothing you can do with the SL1000 or SL2000, other than a notch filter, but you're way better off with RDO-194s or even 198s if you do the TL Mod.
    Ya good idea. I think the passive radiators would be tuned "Too low" as they are tuned to something in the mid 30's I think from memory.

    Acoustic suspension will really raise the cutoff frequency.

    Hey If I give you the dimensions, would you mind modeling it for me? I mean if you have time. Due to uh recent comp crash and getting a new one, I no longer have access to any of my old stuff. Long story again....lol.

    Yes we realize the new tweeters are better, but he kinda wants to not spend much. I have the 6 drivers and crossover, he has a lot of wood. The original cabinets were water damaged, sitting on an area that got mildly flooded.

    The drivers are still like new, no rust, mold or ANYTHING wrong. The water merely got into the particle board, and about a foot of the bottom was all swollen and useless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevintomb View Post
    Ya good idea. I think the passive radiators would be tuned "Too low" as they are tuned to something in the mid 30's I think from memory.

    Acoustic suspension will really raise the cutoff frequency.

    Hey If I give you the dimensions, would you mind modeling it for me? I mean if you have time. Due to uh recent comp crash and getting a new one, I no longer have access to any of my old stuff. Long story again....lol.

    Yes we realize the new tweeters are better, but he kinda wants to not spend much. I have the 6 drivers and crossover, he has a lot of wood. The original cabinets were water damaged, sitting on an area that got mildly flooded.

    The drivers are still like new, no rust, mold or ANYTHING wrong. The water merely got into the particle board, and about a foot of the bottom was all swollen and useless.
    PM me or contact me via my website. I'll see what I can do
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevintomb View Post
    Ya good idea. I think the passive radiators would be tuned "Too low" as they are tuned to something in the mid 30's I think from memory.

    Acoustic suspension will really raise the cutoff frequency.

    Hey If I give you the dimensions, would you mind modeling it for me? I mean if you have time. Due to uh recent comp crash and getting a new one, I no longer have access to any of my old stuff. Long story again....lol.

    Yes we realize the new tweeters are better, but he kinda wants to not spend much. I have the 6 drivers and crossover, he has a lot of wood. The original cabinets were water damaged, sitting on an area that got mildly flooded.

    The drivers are still like new, no rust, mold or ANYTHING wrong. The water merely got into the particle board, and about a foot of the bottom was all swollen and useless.
    What is your technique for cutting and recessing the holes for the drivers?
    SDA 2BTL Sonicaps Mills resistors RDO-198s New gaskets H-nuts Erse inductors Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
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    Cutting we drilled out a few holes, and uses a jig saw and went very slowly.
    We are not to the stage of building the actual "Real" speaker yet, just a test model to see how it will fit and sound.

    I do have a router, but recessing is gonna be tricky for sure.

    I thought about "Free hand" with the router, but realize that will not work well....

    It is frankly too cold now for us to do much, so we are just talking mostly about it.

  20. #20

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    On my Center Channel Project, I used a 6 1/8" hole saw, and 1/2" rabbeting bit
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    On my Center Channel Project, I used a 6 1/8" hole saw, and 1/2" rabbeting bit
    Thanks David. I have visions of building a 2B cabinet with the wide spacing of the CRS+ but it's probably just a pipe dream. I doubt I have the woodworking skills to pull it off.
    SDA 2BTL Sonicaps Mills resistors RDO-198s New gaskets H-nuts Erse inductors Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
    Adcom GTP-450 preamp
    Adcom GFA-555 amp Upgrades & speaker protection added by OldmanSRS
    Pioneer DV-610AV DVD/CD player
    SDA CRS+ Hidden away in the closet

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    Quote Originally Posted by TennMan View Post
    Thanks David. I have visions of building a 2B cabinet with the wide spacing of the CRS+ but it's probably just a pipe dream. I doubt I have the woodworking skills to pull it off.
    Another Franken-Polk Ronnie? Actually, not a bad idea with the height restrictions you have.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by westmassguy View Post
    Another Franken-Polk Ronnie? Actually, not a bad idea with the height restrictions you have.
    Yea, I like to experiment as long as I can do it without damaging any parts and I can revert back to a stock configuration. Actually I think a cabinet with the same wide MW spacing and the same tweeter location as the CRS+, while maintaining the same cabinet volume as the 2B, might be the ultimate 2BTL design. I don't have the tools and woodworking skills to do it but I know someone who does. I've just not had the opportunity to talk to him about it. I expect it will be cost prohibitive for experimenting purposes to pay someone to do it but you don't know until you ask.
    SDA 2BTL Sonicaps Mills resistors RDO-198s New gaskets H-nuts Erse inductors Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
    Adcom GTP-450 preamp
    Adcom GFA-555 amp Upgrades & speaker protection added by OldmanSRS
    Pioneer DV-610AV DVD/CD player
    SDA CRS+ Hidden away in the closet

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    Quote Originally Posted by TennMan View Post
    Yea, I like to experiment as long as I can do it without damaging any parts and I can revert back to a stock configuration. Actually I think a cabinet with the same wide MW spacing and the same tweeter location as the CRS+, while maintaining the same cabinet volume as the 2B, might be the ultimate 2BTL design. I don't have the tools and woodworking skills to do it but I know someone who does. I've just not had the opportunity to talk to him about it. I expect it will be cost prohibitive for experimenting purposes to pay someone to do it but you don't know until you ask.
    You can actually build it better, all MDF, not particle board, lot's of internal bracing, and unlimited choice of cabinet finish and grill work. Sounds like a lot of fun actually.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

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    I have spent the last few days, literally scouring the forum, but can not find any actual "User measured" frequency response graphs, of any of our vintage drivers/

    Has anyone actually measured the drivers, "Free" of the crossover, to get the actual undoctored response and Impedance graphs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevintomb View Post
    I have spent the last few days, literally scouring the forum, but can not find any actual "User measured" frequency response graphs, of any of our vintage drivers/

    Has anyone actually measured the drivers, "Free" of the crossover, to get the actual undoctored response and Impedance graphs?
    I doubt you'll find that information anywhere, other than the secret underground lair, located below Polk headquarters in Baltimore.
    Even the T/S parameters I have for the older drivers don't have the SPLs listed.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL
    Center: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...hannel-Project
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/show...rround-Project
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat & Hurricane Nuts.
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-350

    "So is there any tread left on those tires or is it just like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?"

    www.dhsspeakerservice.com

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