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  1. #1

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    Thumbs up 2ch Receivers Have Come a Long Way

    I got a h/k 3390 stereo receiver earlier today to use in a studio I'm setting up in the house to do my paintings. I planned to use a pair of Polk bookshelfs with them.
    Well, I got too excited, and instead, brought it down to the main rig for a test run.
    I unplugged my tube integrated and fired up the h/k.
    This receiver is SICK! I swear I did not expect it to sound this good. Hell, for the 3390's asking price, this unit is a steal and probably the best bargain in audio I've come across so far (new, not used).
    This receiver is not going anywhere. It's staying in the main rig.
    Attachment 97136Attachment 97137
    I currently have it powering my RT1000p's. The sound is so open, detailed, dynamic and effortless. Excellent HF extension. The texture is very nice and rich too which I really dig.

    I've also have NAD separates that I rotate in my rig that cost way more $. I like this h/k much more. I know some of you may think I'm crazy, but that's ok, maybe I am, because I like this unit as much as the 3 single ended tube amps I have.

    I'm going to try it out with my LSi9 and B&W in a few months.

    I never tried a receiver in the past other than about half a dozen 5.1 HT receivers that couldn't do music. Now I'm excited about 2ch receivers after trying this one out.
    I think I'm going to get a Yamaha R-S300 next and compare it to the h/k.

    This unit is definitely worth checking out if you're in the market for 2ch amplification. Don't let it's price fool you.
    Last edited by organ; 04-29-2014 at 10:51 PM.
    CD Player: Original CD-A8T
    Receiver: Harman/Kardon HK3390
    Speakers: Polk Audio RT1000p
    "I would rather have a cup of tone than an ocean of power" **Dr. Harvey Rosenberg**

  2. #2

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    heh I've got a HK 3490 directly powering a pair of Polk Monitor 5s (real old ones with the famed Peerless Tweeters) or on the B output a pair of Onkyo SKF-4800 towers, it never ceases to amaze me the power this thing has. Can drive the snot out of either pair or all four speakers together (Flame me if you will) For a short while it directly powered my RTiA7 towers but...they needed more power than it could give but for easier to drive speakers it's quite the nice piece of equipment.
    Living Room Evolved
    Onkyo TX-NR717
    Parasound HCA-1200II
    Polk Audio RTi A7 Black Front
    Polk Audio RTi A3 Black Rear
    Polk Audio CSiA6 Center
    Transparent Audio Music Wave Biwire cables > Mains
    Canare 4S11 >Center
    Audioquest Evergreens on most of the analog connections
    Tannoy TS2.12 Sub
    Marantz CD6004
    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Piano Black TT
    Parasound Zphono Phono Preamp
    Apple Mac Mini
    Apple TV 3rd Gen
    Sony PS3 160Gb/Microsoft XBox 360
    Insignia 55 inch 120Hz TV

  3. #3

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    Go grab a baby Marantz and see how it compares. Stupid good for the bill or two they command.
    Usher CP-6311, Shuguang S200MK, Shuguang S845MK, Pioneer BDP-51fd, Essence Audio HDACC, Douglas IC's, Douglas Alpha bi-wire SC's, Pangea/Douglas PC's, Epson 8100

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by nbrowser View Post
    heh I've got a HK 3490 directly powering a pair of Polk Monitor 5s (real old ones with the famed Peerless Tweeters) or on the B output a pair of Onkyo SKF-4800 towers, it never ceases to amaze me the power this thing has. Can drive the snot out of either pair or all four speakers together (Flame me if you will) For a short while it directly powered my RTiA7 towers but...they needed more power than it could give but for easier to drive speakers it's quite the nice piece of equipment.
    That's awesome. Glad to hear I'm not the only one blown away by h/k stereo receivers. You have a better one.
    Good call on the RTiA7. I should have mentioned that these units were not made for heavy loads judging by their specs. Thanks for sharing.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSkip View Post
    Go grab a baby Marantz and see how it compares. Stupid good for the bill or two they command.
    I was looking at them, but the only ones available around here are in the $400-$500 range. I'm going to wait until clearance and see what they ask. I think I see a lot of receiver swapping in my future lol.
    CD Player: Original CD-A8T
    Receiver: Harman/Kardon HK3390
    Speakers: Polk Audio RT1000p
    "I would rather have a cup of tone than an ocean of power" **Dr. Harvey Rosenberg**

  5. #5

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    Some pics...



    CD Player: Original CD-A8T
    Receiver: Harman/Kardon HK3390
    Speakers: Polk Audio RT1000p
    "I would rather have a cup of tone than an ocean of power" **Dr. Harvey Rosenberg**

  6. #6

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    psst I've had a HK 3375 for well over a decade now...that lil 75x2 receiver...can and does surprise people to this day with easy to drive speakers too...just thought I'd add that.
    Living Room Evolved
    Onkyo TX-NR717
    Parasound HCA-1200II
    Polk Audio RTi A7 Black Front
    Polk Audio RTi A3 Black Rear
    Polk Audio CSiA6 Center
    Transparent Audio Music Wave Biwire cables > Mains
    Canare 4S11 >Center
    Audioquest Evergreens on most of the analog connections
    Tannoy TS2.12 Sub
    Marantz CD6004
    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Piano Black TT
    Parasound Zphono Phono Preamp
    Apple Mac Mini
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    Sony PS3 160Gb/Microsoft XBox 360
    Insignia 55 inch 120Hz TV

  7. #7

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    I had the 3490 and it is a superb unit. That series is a sleeper for sure.

  8. #8

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    The Marantz SR4023 is a good unit as well. A shootout of the 3490 and SR4023 would be fun.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conradicles View Post
    The Marantz SR4023 is a good unit as well. A shootout of the 3490 and SR4023 would be fun.
    Someone provide me with a SR4023 and I'll put it head to head with my 3490 on my RTiA3 bookies...let the watts fly!
    Living Room Evolved
    Onkyo TX-NR717
    Parasound HCA-1200II
    Polk Audio RTi A7 Black Front
    Polk Audio RTi A3 Black Rear
    Polk Audio CSiA6 Center
    Transparent Audio Music Wave Biwire cables > Mains
    Canare 4S11 >Center
    Audioquest Evergreens on most of the analog connections
    Tannoy TS2.12 Sub
    Marantz CD6004
    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Piano Black TT
    Parasound Zphono Phono Preamp
    Apple Mac Mini
    Apple TV 3rd Gen
    Sony PS3 160Gb/Microsoft XBox 360
    Insignia 55 inch 120Hz TV

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by nbrowser View Post
    psst I've had a HK 3375 for well over a decade now...that lil 75x2 receiver...can and does surprise people to this day with easy to drive speakers too...just thought I'd add that.
    That's great to hear. I never knew these receivers can sound so good. I thought I would never try a 2ch receiver. It was always separates and integrateds for me. Also nice to hear that you've had the 3375 for over a decade. Build quality must be good!

    I can't wait to compare the sound signatures of different brands.
    CD Player: Original CD-A8T
    Receiver: Harman/Kardon HK3390
    Speakers: Polk Audio RT1000p
    "I would rather have a cup of tone than an ocean of power" **Dr. Harvey Rosenberg**

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by organ View Post
    I can't wait to compare the sound signatures of different brands.
    And this is where the fun begins...took me several receivers til I found the AVR to replace the 3490 in the living room, took a while and a few mis-starts to get a sound signature I wanted in my main system. It wasn't until I tried a Onkyo TX-NR717 in my system that I was happy, tried Pioneer, a lower level Marantz NR-1403, etc. Then comes along this Onkyo and whamo, happiness. It'll take a great unit to replace your 3390, once you get used to the warm HK house sound it's going to be difficult going another direction.

    But do NOT shy away from trying other gear, You'd be surprised at what a good piece brings to the table or a bad piece that takes away. Remember, they're your ears, do it to your ears wants and most of all, have some fun, I know i did in rebuilding my big system quite honestly. I'm extremely happy with what i got now but am starting the cabling replacement, better ICs and better speaker cabling for the mains coming soon!

    Oh and that 3375...in the first 5 years I had it I pushed it hard, it's been through hell in a handbasket under my ownership and never once has it showed any signs of falling down.
    Living Room Evolved
    Onkyo TX-NR717
    Parasound HCA-1200II
    Polk Audio RTi A7 Black Front
    Polk Audio RTi A3 Black Rear
    Polk Audio CSiA6 Center
    Transparent Audio Music Wave Biwire cables > Mains
    Canare 4S11 >Center
    Audioquest Evergreens on most of the analog connections
    Tannoy TS2.12 Sub
    Marantz CD6004
    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Piano Black TT
    Parasound Zphono Phono Preamp
    Apple Mac Mini
    Apple TV 3rd Gen
    Sony PS3 160Gb/Microsoft XBox 360
    Insignia 55 inch 120Hz TV

  12. #12

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    It's a pretty good unit. I have one on a pair of CSW Model Sixes that rivals the sound of my LSI-7s on the separates below. @#$%^

    But I found that it is does not have synergy with everything. It did NOT like the Rti-4s I had that much or the LSI-7s--which sounded veiled on it and lacked oooomph!

    It loved the Energy RC-10s (made them image like "crazy"). It made some old Paradigm 5se MKii sound better than they do on most other gear? And so on.

    I currently run them with the Cambridge Soundworks Model Sixes and that's a phenomenal combo for less than $399 new (Receiver and speakers on sale, of course).

    Have always been curious about that Marantz in relation. The Yamahas are a more neutral sounding receiver than the HK which I find warmer. Which means the LSi-7s sound better to me on the Yamahas.

    cnh
    Last edited by cnh; 04-30-2014 at 12:03 AM.
    Onkyo TX-SR 805 System #1 HT AVR
    Office Two Channel: LSi-7s (Nakamichi CA-5, NAD 214, Pioneer BDP51fd)
    Vintage Polks: Polk Monitor 5As, Monitor 7Bs [HK 730], Monitor 10As [Marantz 2265], SDA-2Bs [Jolida JD-303, Jolida MV-MK4]
    Headphones: HD600, Q701, ATH-M50s etc. Bravo Audio Ocean amp., Onkyo P-304, Adcom GFA-555, Technics Direct Drive TT

  13. #13

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    Of the massmarket brands, hk and Onkyo never really gave up (at least totally) on the 2-channel market -- small as it must have become.

    A previous post to this thread invoked vintage Marantz "for a bill or two". FWIW (and in my profoundly un-humble opinion), (EDIT) most of the vintage solid-state Marantz equipment is, today, over-priced by ca. a factor of two relative to its performance. This, I believe, is due to the enduring popularity of the rather -- idiosyncratic -- aesthetics of the equipment.

    2600 by mhardy6647, on Flickr
    scan0006 by mhardy6647, on Flickr

    Got enough knobs & buttons? :-)

    I find the Superscope-era Marantz receivers to be quite solid-state-y sounding (in the worst sense of the term) and overall thoroughly mediocre (e.g., performance of tuner section) relative to more sensibly priced vintage massmarket Japanes options such as Yamaha and Sansum -- or hk or Onkyo.


    ... and, yeah, as you all know, I am biased. :-)

    yamaharack 012414 by mhardy6647, on Flickr
    Last edited by mhardy6647; 04-30-2014 at 09:14 AM.
    all the best,
    mrh

  14. #14

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    Soo...you're sayin' the new stuff is better than the old stuff...my reading skills have diminished as much as my hearing. What?
    Main Family Room: Sony 46 LCD, Sony Blue Ray, Sony DVD/VCR combo,Onkyo TXNR 708, Parasound 5250,
    Polk SDS-SRS with mods, CSI 5 center + Klipsch SC2, Polk RT2000P rears, Klipsch KG 1.5's sides, Polk Micro Pro 1000, Polk Micro Pro 2000, Polk SW505, Belkin PF60, Signal Cable Classics,Monster IC's, 2 15 amp circuits & 1 20 amp circuit.

    Living Room: Belkin PF60, Parasound HCA2200, MIT ProlineEXP balanced IC's,Emotiva XDA-1 DAC/Pre,Emotiva ERC2 transport,MIT AVT2, Polk LSI 9's.

  15. #15

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    Have you heard the baby versions? My 2216 is anything but solid state sounding. It's also got enough power to push many speakers it shouldn't.
    Usher CP-6311, Shuguang S200MK, Shuguang S845MK, Pioneer BDP-51fd, Essence Audio HDACC, Douglas IC's, Douglas Alpha bi-wire SC's, Pangea/Douglas PC's, Epson 8100

  16. #16

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    Yup.
    all the best,
    mrh

  17. #17

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    Just a little FYI, but the 3490 was able to power my LSi 15's, so if you want to tryout some LSi stuff cause you find em for a good price... that little HK can drive them all day long...

    My 3490 was a super awesome little unit and I would gladly pickup another one in a heartbeat.
    Advice is free, the Flea Market is earned - F1Nut

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    HT: APC H15 | Pio 51FD | Uverse | Xbox 360 | Squeezebox Classic | Integra DTR 5.9 | Carver AV-705x & M1.0t MKII Opt002 | LSi 15 | LSiC | LSi F/x | Kimber Hero IC & 8VS SC

    Office: Win 7 -> DacMagic w/ Pangea PSU | DIY Pass BOSOZ| Parasound HCA-1200ii | Polk RTA 11TL | Cables TBA

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  18. #18

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    I love my 3380. Very honest sound. Nice warmth. It's currently pushing my B&W DM601s in my bedroom. I think that's a good combination - the B&Ws sounded pretty harsh on my NAD 7100.

    Has anyone tried the phono on these units? Is it any good?
    HT System:
    Pioneer VSX-820-k
    Front: Polk Monitor 7B Restored
    Rear: Currently not in service
    Center: Boston Acoustic VR12
    Sub: Bowers & Wilkins ASW600

    2Ch:
    Restored Pioneer VSX-1250
    Yamaha P-500 Turntable

    Living Room:
    NAD 7240PE
    Klipsch KG4

    Bedroom:
    Harman Kardon 3380
    Bowers & Wilkins DM601
    Polk PSW10

    In and out of rotation:
    KLH Model 6,
    Polk Monitor 5 Series II
    Design Acoustic PS-10A
    NAD 7100

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by nbrowser View Post
    And this is where the fun begins...took me several receivers til I found the AVR to replace the 3490 in the living room, took a while and a few mis-starts to get a sound signature I wanted in my main system. It wasn't until I tried a Onkyo TX-NR717 in my system that I was happy, tried Pioneer, a lower level Marantz NR-1403, etc. Then comes along this Onkyo and whamo, happiness. It'll take a great unit to replace your 3390, once you get used to the warm HK house sound it's going to be difficult going another direction.

    But do NOT shy away from trying other gear, You'd be surprised at what a good piece brings to the table or a bad piece that takes away. Remember, they're your ears, do it to your ears wants and most of all, have some fun, I know i did in rebuilding my big system quite honestly. I'm extremely happy with what i got now but am starting the cabling replacement, better ICs and better speaker cabling for the mains coming soon!

    Oh and that 3375...in the first 5 years I had it I pushed it hard, it's been through hell in a handbasket under my ownership and never once has it showed any signs of falling down.
    Thanks for the heads up on the Onkyo. I see that the 717 you mentioned is a surround sound receiver. Do you know if the TX-8050 is the stereo equivalent to it? I don't really want a surround receiver because I'm strictly stereo and if I get one, I'd be paying for extra channels I won't use along with all the extra processing (video/audio). The 8050 is currently on sale for $399, but I'm going to wait on it. Price usually drops even more during summer time when the audio/ht stores are their slowest. So I will wait until summer to check out an Onkyo.
    My next one will be the Yamaha R-S300B. They're currently being replaced by the R-N version and the R-S300B are being cleared at $250-$299 right now. So I'll probably go hunting for one in a few months. Still want to get used to this h/k.

    You're right about the warm h/k house sound. I had a h/k 5.1 avr about 10 years ago. That, along with in-store demoes showed me how good their sound is. Problem at the time was, I couldn't get the avr to do music. It sounded fantastic with movies, but pretty weak on music. I've always wanted that sound back, but in a 2ch amp or int. Now with this 3390, I'm getting that sound with excellent music reproduction. I would describe the sound as detailed, warm, rich, extended and very dynamic.

    Glad to hear you found your sound with the Onkyo. I hope to try out one of their receivers by this summer. I had the 575 5.1 receiver a long time ago and it was very good. Looking forward to hearing Onkyo again.

    What I want to do is, try out the budget stereo receivers of all the different brands. Once I find the one I like most, I will save up for their best 2ch receiver. This h/k is my first and I already feel it will be very hard to beat. I like everything about the sound with zero complaints.

    Quote Originally Posted by cnh View Post
    It's a pretty good unit. I have one on a pair of CSW Model Sixes that rivals the sound of my LSI-7s on the separates below. @#$%^

    But I found that it is does not have synergy with everything. It did NOT like the Rti-4s I had that much or the LSI-7s--which sounded veiled on it and lacked oooomph!

    It loved the Energy RC-10s (made them image like "crazy"). It made some old Paradigm 5se MKii sound better than they do on most other gear? And so on.

    I currently run them with the Cambridge Soundworks Model Sixes and that's a phenomenal combo for less than $399 new (Receiver and speakers on sale, of course).

    Have always been curious about that Marantz in relation. The Yamahas are a more neutral sounding receiver than the HK which I find warmer. Which means the LSi-7s sound better to me on the Yamahas.

    cnh
    Ha ha. So it happened to you too, eh? LOL. You're right, my current h/k with Polk RT1000P set up, is better sounding than my NAD/LSi9 set up to my ears. So weird. Thanks for sharing your experience. Like you, I also enjoy the LSi on more neutral to bright sounding gear. I find the LSi9's to be very, very warm on their own.
    I think the Reference series from Klipsch would be a great match with the h/k. I had two sets of their towers, but sold them a few years ago. Wish I still had them to try out. Will probably wait until newer models arrive and get a good clearance deal on the current models.

    Quote Originally Posted by mhardy6647 View Post
    Of the massmarket brands, hk and Onkyo never really gave up (at least totally) on the 2-channel market -- small as it must have become.

    A previous post to this thread invoked vintage Marantz "for a bill or two". FWIW (and in my profoundly un-humble opinion), (EDIT) most of the vintage solid-state Marantz equipment is, today, over-priced by ca. a factor of two relative to its performance. This, I believe, is due to the enduring popularity of the rather -- idiosyncratic -- aesthetics of the equipment.

    2600 by mhardy6647, on Flickr
    scan0006 by mhardy6647, on Flickr

    Got enough knobs & buttons? :-)

    I find the Superscope-era Marantz receivers to be quite solid-state-y sounding (in the worst sense of the term) and overall thoroughly mediocre (e.g., performance of tuner section) relative to more sensibly priced vintage massmarket Japanes options such as Yamaha and Sansum -- or hk or Onkyo.


    ... and, yeah, as you all know, I am biased. :-)

    yamaharack 012414 by mhardy6647, on Flickr
    Thanks for sharing those pics, Mrh. I see people go crazy for those older Marantz. I prefer a simpler look (really like the looks of their current receivers). Not sure if I'm ever going to get into vintage receivers. I'm worried about parts failing and other internal areas becoming brittle due to age. I have a Dynaco ST-70 that I spent much time working on.

    I'm excited to try out one of the new Marantz stereo receiver. Just waiting for a good price. It's $499 at the moment.

    Quote Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
    Just a little FYI, but the 3490 was able to power my LSi 15's, so if you want to tryout some LSi stuff cause you find em for a good price... that little HK can drive them all day long...

    My 3490 was a super awesome little unit and I would gladly pickup another one in a heartbeat.
    That's great to hear. I will try mine out with the LSi9's once I get stands for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmjungbluth View Post
    I love my 3380. Very honest sound. Nice warmth. It's currently pushing my B&W DM601s in my bedroom. I think that's a good combination - the B&Ws sounded pretty harsh on my NAD 7100.

    Has anyone tried the phono on these units? Is it any good?
    I have a pair of DM6 that was professionally restored last year. It sounds superb. I will try them out with the h/k in a few months. I just hope it has enough balls for them.


    Now I have another question. I noticed there are two subwoofer outputs on the 3390 (I'm assuming same thing on the 3490). Are both of them mono subwoofer outputs?
    CD Player: Original CD-A8T
    Receiver: Harman/Kardon HK3390
    Speakers: Polk Audio RT1000p
    "I would rather have a cup of tone than an ocean of power" **Dr. Harvey Rosenberg**

  20. #20

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    The receiver I got when I first purchased my SDA CRS+'s back in 1989 was a Harman Kardon HK 990 VXi. At the time it was ranked one of the top 5 receivers on the market. That thing did the SDA's beautifully, and it still sells for about $250 on eBay if it's in good condition.
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.

  21. #21

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    I have been enjoying my Vintage Marantz 2238b which not only looks sexy but sounds tubey. I lucked out finding it on Craigs List for next to nothing. Now if it just had a remote I'd be all set.

  22. #22

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    Organ thats a beautiful set up you have there. I have owned probably 8 HK's & boy they all did a great job . Enjoy the HK :)
    Randy
    HT-SDA1c Yamaha-RXV1-Denon-POA2200-HK DVD25-Cs400i-Monitor4's-Premier Acoustic150
    2ch-SDA2b-ADCOM GFA-555-565-600-555-YaQinCd2-Pioneer PL-630-AKAI GX210d
    Pioneer-SA9800-SG9800-CTF650-TXD1000-RT-909-Monitor11-Peerless
    Marantz-2252b-5025b-6300-YaQinCd1-TeacA4010s-Monitor7
    Yamaha-CR2040-Advent2-TeacA4010s-Monitor7

    Yamaha-CA810-CT810----- No Speakers Yet
    Marantz SR1000-Pioneer PM120 workbench set up

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by organ View Post
    I got a h/k 3390 stereo receiver earlier today to use in a studio I'm setting up in the house to do my paintings. I planned to use a pair of Polk bookshelfs with them.
    Well, I got too excited, and instead, brought it down to the main rig for a test run.
    I unplugged my tube integrated and fired up the h/k.
    This receiver is SICK! I swear I did not expect it to sound this good. Hell, for the 3390's asking price, this unit is a steal and probably the best bargain in audio I've come across so far (new, not used).
    This receiver is not going anywhere. It's staying in the main rig.
    Attachment 97136Attachment 97137
    I currently have it powering my RT1000p's. The sound is so open, detailed, dynamic and effortless. Excellent HF extension. The texture is very nice and rich too which I really dig.

    I've also have NAD separates that I rotate in my rig that cost way more $. I like this h/k much more. I know some of you may think I'm crazy, but that's ok, maybe I am, because I like this unit as much as the 3 single ended tube amps I have.

    I'm going to try it out with my LSi9 and B&W in a few months.

    I never tried a receiver in the past other than about half a dozen 5.1 HT receivers that couldn't do music. Now I'm excited about 2ch receivers after trying this one out.
    I think I'm going to get a Yamaha R-S300 next and compare it to the h/k.

    This unit is definitely worth checking out if you're in the market for 2ch amplification. Don't let it's price fool you.
    I've been beating that same drum for quite some time now myself. With todays advancements & the way technology finds it's way into gear that years ago was simply unheard of. The notion that a top flight 2 channel receiver or a flagship AVR can't hold it's own against separates is an outdated notion that doesn't hold water & some just can't come to grips with. Technology is a wonderful thing! Pass it on down.
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "
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    Extensive room treatments

  24. #24

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    ... amusingly enough, I've been using an hk power amp upstairs for the last few days...

    DSC_9173 by mhardy6647, on Flickr
    all the best,
    mrh

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    Mhardy... one of these days I may need to buy one of your old school pieces off of you lol...

    They all just look so minty and cool....
    Advice is free, the Flea Market is earned - F1Nut

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    I'm also with mhardy on the vintage Yammies being better than both the Marantz and Pioneer SX line. Organ, you're doing yourself a disservice by ruling out vintage gear. If you think that HK sounds good you should hear a CA-1010 or CA-2010 in class A mode...
    |Fronts - Peerless RTA-12B | Center(s) - Peerless Monitor 5 | Rears - Peerless Monitor 4 |
    |AVR - Yamaha Aventage RX-A1020 |
    |TV - Philips 46" Smart LED | Gaming - Xbox One - Xbox 360 | Headphones - Philips Fidelio X1 |

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    Please note that I wasn't denigrating the modern 2-ch hardware... I just wanted to (yet again!) surface my bias in terms of vintage equipment when it comes to Marantz 22xx receivers (suffixed or unsuffixed) against their competition from the same era.

    Case in point - tonight there was a 2220B on eBAY for $195. You should be able to get something considerably better sounding (especially by modern standards) for that than a 2220B.

    Just one schlub's opinion, of course...
    all the best,
    mrh

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    My only gripe with the new H/K stereo units is that they don't offer a CD player to match (if they do I can't find one).

    Marantz offers matching CD players and even a new 2-channel amp.

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    I don't disagree that their prices are bordering insane, especially on the high power units. If you can find one for $100 though, I think you'd be very hard pressed to find a better piece. Old Yammy SS still hasn't made it into my house, but the Pioneers of that era sound horrendous by today's standards IMO. Talk about SS-sounding. I admittedly stopped playing the vintage game when I got into modern pieces though.

    As nice as some of those flagship AVR's sound, I still haven't heard one to top a nice integrated that can be found at less than half its price. But that's another topic altogether. One other piece that doesn't get enough mention on this site for a nice starter 2 channel rig is the $100 Sherwood receivers. They keep the bells and whistles out of those and you end up with a nice performer for not a lot of coin. I bet a Sherwood receiver and those Pioneer bookies would be one hell of a start to a budget system.
    Usher CP-6311, Shuguang S200MK, Shuguang S845MK, Pioneer BDP-51fd, Essence Audio HDACC, Douglas IC's, Douglas Alpha bi-wire SC's, Pangea/Douglas PC's, Epson 8100

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    Just checked out my craigslist out of curiosity...

    http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/4440221495.html

    Seems a tad steep
    |Fronts - Peerless RTA-12B | Center(s) - Peerless Monitor 5 | Rears - Peerless Monitor 4 |
    |AVR - Yamaha Aventage RX-A1020 |
    |TV - Philips 46" Smart LED | Gaming - Xbox One - Xbox 360 | Headphones - Philips Fidelio X1 |

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