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  1. #1

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    Default Transparent wire company a Joke or high quality wire.

    I didn't want to go into a Transparent debate on the other thead so I figured starting my own should be fine.

    Russ feels Transparent is a joke and I'm looking for his reasons why. Do others feel this way who has experience with Transparent?

    Now others can speak up who own MIT as they are a sister company who split off Transparent years ago. There designs are very close to Transparents. Both companies took this technology and went there own way with it but all in all very close.

    I personally like both wire companies but I favor Transparent after a one on one demo on Krell and Dynaudio, I felt the Transparent Supers sounded better then the MIT's I forget the correct model but they where white wires with huge white network bricks. WBT type connectors on each end. Nicely built.

    Dan
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.

  2. #2

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    All I need to know about Transparent. Link
    Check your lips at the door woman. Shake your hips like battleships. Yeah, all the white girls trip when I sing at Sunday service.

  3. #3

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    Transparent wouldn't even exist if it wasn't for Bruce Brisson(MIT). They have been and always will be an MIT wanna-be.

    How could you not know some history behind what you recommend?

  4. #4

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    I know the history from Transparents point of view. They splitt off and made there own products. The 2 owners have a deep passion for what they do and firmly believe in there technology. But guess what??? None of that adds up to good sound quality. I have said it in the past, give me all the tech babble you want but if the given product dosen't sound good , it's all a bunch of wind.

    Transparent has proved they are a very good if not one of the very finest sounding cable companies in the world today. Many audiophiles swear by them. Many critics worship there products and use it themselves. In the industry they are well respected.

    This thead isn't about how I feel about Transparent but how all of YOU guys feel. Please keep em coming.

    Dan
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.

  5. #5

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    well if thats the build quality, I don't want em... epoxy and resoldered wires...
    MY HT RIG:
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    2 Channel Rig:

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  6. #6
    Stronzo
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    "Me too" ;)

  7. #7

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    Actually, transparent was fairly smart. By putting those inductors in line to the signal path, their cables would sound different.

    Now if you have el-crappola wire and spend $$$ on transperent wires, they would sound different. You would then believe that this "new" sound is really what was on the recording and how your old cables were so bad as to hide it (even though your old cables were more accurate).

    Great marketing with measurable differences to standard wire...

    As the Guiness boys would say... "Brilliant!"



    It is amazing that if item "A" costs 20X item "B" and they sound different, virtually everyone would assume that "A" sounds better, even if that is all distorition or innacuracies. (Which may actually be pleasing to your ears: see tube vs. SS)
    Last edited by jdhdiggs; 01-24-2005 at 06:02 PM.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin

  8. #8

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    Originally posted by mantis
    I know the history from Transparents point of view. They splitt off and made there own products. The 2 owners have a deep passion for what they do and firmly believe in there technology. But guess what??? None of that adds up to good sound quality. I have said it in the past, give me all the tech babble you want but if the given product dosen't sound good , it's all a bunch of wind.

    Transparent has proved they are a very good if not one of the very finest sounding cable companies in the world today. Many audiophiles swear by them. Many critics worship there products and use it themselves. In the industry they are well respected.

    This thead isn't about how I feel about Transparent but how all of YOU guys feel. Please keep em coming.

    Dan
    Pffffffffftt....buy whatever blows your skirt up. If digging Transparent after demoing it with gear that you don't own convinces you, so be it.

    However, I've seen nothing that Transparent does, nor can anyone explain to me why Transparent technology is superior to any other company. In fact, quite the opposite is true.



    BDT
    I plan for the future. - F1Nut

  9. #9

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    Interconnects that I currently own or have owned in the past year:

    Transparent musiclink
    Transparent Plus MM technology
    Signal Cable Analog 2
    Radio Shack Fusion
    Kimber Hero
    Kimber Silver Streak
    Acoustic Zen Wow
    Cheapo Acoustic Research
    Cheapo Monster Cable

    Now in a decent system where one has good speakers, amps, and source none of the above sound bad as in unlistenable turn of the stereo right now. However, there is a noticeable difference in separation of instruments, timbre, and micro details I have found.

    I like my Transparents. Actually liked them better than the Acoustic Zen Wows (which I sold). Price wasn't a factor here because they cost about the same.

    Transparent's new technology is the MM technology where the same level is now 2.5 times the same level in performance than the musiclink technology. Therefore, Transparent MM plus is roughly equivalent to the older Musicwave Super.

    I prefer the Transparent Musiclinks over the Kimber Hero in one setup that I have. Room acoustics being a factor here and also I found the Transparent to have slightly more microdetail. Now if you blindfolded me and brought me back into a room could I identify Transparent vs. Kimber on a song which I was totally unfamiliar with? Probably not right away. But when I switch inputs "on the fly" you can hear the slight difference. Eventually, after switching back and forth, I'd be like yeah, I like this one better. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

    I currently have the Silver Streaks that I want to shootout with the Transparent MM Plus on the Jolida cdp where I can switch inputs on the fly. It will be interesting to me to see how they compare. Will I prefer the Transparents again is the question.

    I like Transparent. I don't care what's in the boxes etc. If it sounds good I'm keeping it regardless of the name. If the wire can give me that little bit more detail or make a sound come from somewhere different then that's cool too. Are the prices outrageous? Yes; but I've set a limit on what I feel makes an appreciable difference for me and I'm sticking to it.

  10. #10

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    pjdami,
    nice objective reply man. What lacks around here is actual experience. Why people judge things by it's cover or whats said here online is behond me. I can see if THEY listened and said"they suck the ball bag" or "what junk this is and look at it's buit quality" then I would be ok cool thats how they felt about how the given system THEY where listening 2 felt.

    Troy,
    BLEEP off. If you have no Transparent experience then go post on someone elses thead. You have no bussiness on this one.Same goes to anyone else with no Transparent experience.Besides you stupid BLEEP , I used to own Transparent. I had alot of it in my system. Sorry to curse like that but I felt it was nessary to get my point across.

    Dude get a life or something would yeah. You always feel the need to be a big jerk
    Last edited by mantis; 01-24-2005 at 08:33 PM.
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.

  11. #11

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    Default This PM is too good to NOT share with everyone....

    **** you *******

    The title says it all. Find someone else to **** with. I have no time for your ******* replies and jerk ass ways. Dude find something constructive to do like running on the tread mill , or self improvement classes. People who look for **** are **** themselves. Offically your the single biggest ******* on the forum.
    Just like your reply, if you actually had some eperience with Transparent, I would take the time to talk about it with you . But no you have to act like you do. **** off Troy
    Wow, didn't realize that I wasn't allowed to have an opinion on Transparent that conflicted with yours, Dan.

    By all means, if a Transparent jerk-off session is the order of the day, please continue...

    BDT
    I plan for the future. - F1Nut

  12. #12

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    Dan - I don't think that it's completely neccesary to list everything that an individual has experienced. What, now we need a disclaimer for responses now? I am not sure how the rest of the forum runs responses, but I don't specifically talk about a subject, and expound upon it, if neccesary, unless I know WTF I'm talking about about in the first place.

    Dear forum,
    I've heard Transparent cables, if they were that great for my application....they would still be IN that application. I hope you weren't confused by the lack of listing my audio resume'. Thanks for your time.

    Regards,
    Mark


    I mean cmon'. Furthermore, I don't prefer Transparent due to the fact that they 100% IMO, a clone of MIT.

    Dan - Show me evidence that Transparent patented that cable design prior to being the cable manufacturer for MIT.

    Can you show me some "white papers" on Transparent?

    I'm personally glad that Paul has found something that works for his gear, that's the whole point of all of this stupid audio crap anyways. One man's audio nirvana is another man's bad review.

    Paul - I have an extra set of MIT Shotgun S3's, that if you would like to demo, I'll send it down to you. I'm not going to say they are better, it's for you to try out. It's just a friendly offering, nothing rude is meant here.

  13. #13

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    BTW, did I SAY it was crap?

    No, I didn't. What I SAID was that I have found no compelling reason to give Transparent further consideration. Did I say they were bad? No, I didn't. There are LOTS of great items out there that I don't feel compelled to try for a myriad of reasons.

    As I said, if you like 'em, bully for you.

    BDT
    I plan for the future. - F1Nut

  14. #14

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    Whatever creams your twinkie is what I say. I found Russmans recommended reading interesting though.

    I'll stick with my Moster cable. That's right, I said it.

    Now, who's got some monster bi-wires they want to unload? :)

  15. #15

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    Originally posted by pjdami

    Transparent's new technology is the MM technology where the same level is now 2.5 times the same level in performance than the musiclink technology. Therefore, Transparent MM plus is roughly equivalent to the older Musicwave Super.
    What? Without opening the whole "wiring doesn't make a difference" can of worms, could you clarify this for me? It makes no sense. 2.5 times the technology? If two wires have the same R-L-C values, they will sound exactly the same regarless of technology right? What else is there in a wire? It looks like both transperant and MIT are just messing with the inductance and capacitance of the line. Once you lock in the "ideal" values, how can twice the technology make any difference...

    Can someone give any reason why this wouldn't be the case?

    Next club polk gathering we will have to try a blind cable interconnect test...
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin

  16. #16

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    What? Without opening the whole "wiring doesn't make a difference" can of worms, could you clarify this for me?
    I hear you with the resistance, inductance, and capacitance theory. Do I understand it? No. Have I actually compared the newer technology to the older "higher" up models to see if their claim is true? No. The local dealer, who I put a lot of confidence in, told me that is what the Transparent sales rep told him during a training seminar. BS? Maybe. I don't know. Transparent has a generous "upgrade" policy too if one ever wants to upgrade to the next higher level then one can do so at the retail cost difference. I don't feel like I need to do this at all. I picked a level that I was happy with (they let me demo some wire) and that's what I chose to go with.

    Interestingly, another local dealer here who is a straight up guy and been in the business for 25 plus years told me to ditch all of my kimbers, transparent, etc. for Nordost wire. Just goes to show one how much different wire is out there and how different people have their favorites. For me its about synergy and matching gear that fits the room environment. For my tubed gear now, I have more fun leaving the wire alone and just changing out tubes. There are just so many combinations out there it is ridiculous. At some point one just has to say "Eff It" and just grab a beer and enjoy some good tunes.

    I am going to be brutally blunt here...most of our audio memory is very short lived especially with wire differences. I often have to take notes on certain passages to be able to remember differences when I can't "swap on the fly". I don't let these differences obsess me though. It's sort of like swapping tubes on a preamp or something. Its hard to make decent gear sound "bad" with decent wire. Some of the wire will allow more details through though with more information and less what I like to call "smearing" of the soundstage. Does the "smearing" sound bad with the less than $100 / pair IC's. No, but when comparing "A" vs "B" and one can switch easily between the two it is easier to hear the differences.

    Nobody has to believe what I say or do. This forum is here to share experiences and ideas for others to try if they so choose to do so. I surely have taken the advice of many of you here and I'm glad I did because I've put together some really nice systems as a result based on what others like and I have found to like too. With that being said, wire is a way for all of us to have our "uniqueness" with our gear even if the differences between the "higher" end cables may just be subtle to most.
    Last edited by pjdami; 01-25-2005 at 09:23 PM.

  17. #17

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    PJ - Thanks for taking the time to post a fully evolved comment....we should have more of these :)

    All - Here is some great reading from MIT on the theory and application of their products. Bruce built his company around this information.

    I don't care whether you believe it, or even give a crap about discussing it, make your own decision.

    MIT - Patents/"White Papers"/'Burn-in"
    Last edited by dorokusai; 01-25-2005 at 09:55 PM.

  18. #18
    Stronzo
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    Well said, Paul.

  19. #19

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    I particularly like Paul's comment on picking a level, and most likely sticking with it, because he's happy. I completely agree with this approach as well.

    MIT has been a favorite of mine since F1Nut let me borrow a pair of MI-330 Series II interconnects a long time ago. It immediately changed my whole perspective on interconnects and their effect on system synergy and performance.

    It happened, and it was all the factual data I needed to look into this alot more.

    I've went through a pile of interconnects at one time or another, and chose the MIT brand for what would later be my critical listening rig. It was the brand I enjoyed the most, as it was my benchmark.

    I eventually chose the Shotgun S3 as my "level" of choice, due to already hearing the Shotgun S1 on F1's rig. He loves them, to date, and a few demo's later....he still owns MIT. We have similar tastes and ears, so I value my friends opinion on things greatly.

    Anyways, I personally didn't think that the benefit of the S1 series, outweighed the cost. I felt as though the S3 was where I wanted to be, and I like Paul, don't have any need to move around in this bracket....I'm happy, and I made the perfect choice for MY gear.

    Will I ever upgrade to another interconnect? It's nowhere close to a priority or need.

    Do I demo these cables that are in the Polk Cable Swap Program? Of course I do, but then they go right back in the program, as it's not for me, it's for the Polk forum. It's not that they are bad, some are excellent, but I already know what works for me, and my gear.

    The PCSP is to try and help those of you who don't want to "waste" the money, or wish to spend it "wisely"....play with a few things that may be interesting to you and your stereo bits.

    Not to plug the PCSP again, but to not try something that is basically FREE, boggles my mind. This isn't directed to those that HAVE made an educated decision one way or the other.
    Last edited by dorokusai; 01-25-2005 at 10:47 PM.

  20. #20

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    At a boy Paul. :)

  21. #21

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    Thanks Paul, I guess for me thisswill have to be a "show me" item since, with my engineering background (We do seem to have the most difficulty with this) I can't see why it would make a difference. I my extremely limited tests I found no difference, but that was between very similar priced items so who knows what that proves...

    Next club gathering I would like to try to hear these differences.. Perhaps I'm just deaf and will be perfectly fine at the $30/interconnect level.

    And Doro, I do plat on entering the club interconnect program but until my "good/decent" stuff makes it up here there's not much of a point. (LX-5 + X-Box+ Kenwood receiver do not make a reference system in my book)
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin

  22. #22

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    pjdami,
    nice write up. Using your ears I love it.

    jdhdiggs
    Without hearing any differences , all the tech writings and proof or non proof makes no difference. I have for years read about all the technology that goes into all kinds of wire. But at the end of the day if it doesn't sound BETTER then what I'm using at the time , again it make no difference. You say "show me" I say "let me listen to it".May mean the same thing but in writting I take it as proof that it's better worse or different.

    I read the whole thing that Russ posted about whats inside of the network bricks. I knew exactly as I have taken apart a few of mine. Transparent will tell you exaclty whats inside there networks. But again that means nothing unless it sounds better then what I'm using or testing it against. I have found a place for Transparent wires but not in my personal system. I perfer the sound quality of Kimber Kable and wired my system accordingly.
    As dorokusai found what he needs in MIT , I have found it in Kimber Kable. I have no desire to try anything else. It does exaclty what I want it to do at speaker wire level as well as Interconnect level. Digital audio I have not found BETTER or even DIFFERENT sonding cables. Hell I have tried higher end coax vs good quality coax and have not found any audio differences. The only difference I have found was when I tried a cheap Mitsubishi Digital Toslink vs a monster lightspeed toshlink. Kimbers Optical which I own didn't sound any better or different then my monster or Transparent. I also have digital coax Kimber which again made no difference.

    Dan
    Last edited by mantis; 01-26-2005 at 05:50 PM.
    Dan
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  23. #23

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    Why, if they tell you what's inside, would you do take your own apart? Why not just have a rep do it to one of thiers? Surely they have something like that (like bose and the transparent sub).

    Second, I'll agree that in the end, sound is what matters, however, without some sort of basic understanding of why, it just gives MORE ammo for the wire voo-doo and doo-doo crowd.

    Third, arbitarily screwing with the crossover point, as Transparent does just seems A. stupid and B. gimmicky given the arbitrary way they do it.

    BDT
    Last edited by TroyD; 01-27-2005 at 09:35 AM.
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  24. #24

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    Troy,
    My first pair of Musiclinks where the older style which the networks where held together by reverse screws. When the rep came in , he didn't have cutaway bricks but only talked about whats inside. It was good learning.
    Yeah I agree that knowing is a good thing.I for one am not into voodoo of any kind. I don't use quarters on my speakers or any stuff like that.
    As far as what there networks really do is cut off hz over 20khz.They feel this is where most EMI and RF have effects on sound quality. Without the signal getting there, interference is a mute point.

    Hey man if you like MIT , you will like Transparent. If you can get over all the tech babble and everyone trying to prove they are better, a pair of Musiclink plus interconects , a pair of matching Musicwave plus speaker wires would most likely make your rig sound sweet.

    Hey you never know,

    Dan
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.

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