Polk LSi9 vs Onix Reference 1 bookshelf

[Joey_V]

Ahh... finally.... I have heard the vaunted Onix Reference 1 bookshelf speakers (av123.com) against my Polk LSi9. I went to a nearby neighbor's house and audition the Ref1s with my LSi9 in hand.

I will add more tomorrow, but I will say this:

I went there with the purpose of hearing the Reference 1s and I kind of expected the Polk LSI9s to be blown away (weird since the LSi9 held its own against the ML Clarity and the LSi15 bested it). However, in the end, my neighbor began to audition the LSi9 and actually liked it to the point of making plans to audition the LSi15s at Tweeter tomorrow after work.

Hehehehehe....

I have always wanted to get the Ref1s as a replacement for my LSI9 and have even gone as far as posting my LSi9s for sale in the Polk Flea Market - but Zero was able to convince me not to. I am glad I didnt sell the 9s as I have no plans of getting the Ref1s now.

They are great speakers... but I prefer the 9s.

I'll do a better writeup tomorrow.

Good night fellow polkies. :D

[unbridled_id]

You should post your opinion on av123's forum as well. I would imagine that the folks there would say your crazy. When I do look at the av123 forum they always (except for us polkies ;) ) say that the rockets are superior to the lsi's much less the rererence series... I am happy you chose to keep your 9's they are a nice speaker.. I own rti's and covet lsi's....

[Joey_V]

They can think their Refs are superior to the LSi... but I heard it myself and they sound VERY similar moreso than different. The one thing I liked about the LSi9 is how it handled the voices and how it presented a better stage in comparison to the Refs1. The Ref1s were brighter and had somewhat more air - but didnt have the weight on the voice (which some like and some may not like). The 9s had the easy nod in bass output - we seriously had to check and double check that the sub wasnt on.

More tomorrow.

I must say, Kevin was a swell guy to let me listen to his Refs. Two thumbs up!

[Joey_V]

Here are the two impressions (Kevin (owner of the Ref1's that I auditioned) and Me (owner of the LSi9s that I brought for comparison)):


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Kevin:

Joey - no problem! It was fun comparing the speakers.

I went into the demo figuring the Refs would kill the Lsi9s. Joey mentioned that he thought the same thing. We were both wrong.

We ran both pairs of speakers off of my SP3. Tracks included a lot of R&B (Joey's), Tori, Fiona, Tracy Chapman, R.E.M., Indigio Girls, Disturbed, DMB, and a few others.

The Polks can easily hold their own against the Ref 1s. They are very similar sounding speakers, yet with the right music there is a difference. It just isn't a Ref vs Rocket difference.

The main difference between the two is that the midrange on the Lsi9s is a bit on the warm side while the midrange on the Refs is a bit on the bright/forward side. The Lsi9 has more bass, which I believe is causing the warmth in the midrange. When we ran the Lsi9s off of my receiver crossed over at 80Hz the midrange became a bit more neutral.

Both speakers image well and could reproduce anything we threw at them with ease. Treble response was very similar, with the Refs having the more forward presentation. Vocals on the Lsi9s seem to separate themselves from the music better than the Refs.

I definitely learned something last night. I have been too stuck on the 'online' thing for too long. The Lsi9s are a great speaker and they are fairly cheap (if purchased online). I never considered them, and I have to admit that it is partially because of the Polk name.

I plan on trying the Lsi15s sometime soon. Joey mentioned that the midrange is a bit cleaner and they image better since the midrange drivers are not asked to produce bass. They could be a real winner.

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Joey:

I wanted to hold off my posting of impressions until after Kevin posted his. I didnt want to step on anyone's toes.

Yeah, so here goes:

I came in with the mentality that the Reference 1s were going to make mince-meat out of my LSI9s. However, I should have thought differently as I remember correctly that at Tweeter, the LSI15 took apart the Martin Logan Claritys (a speaker twice its price)... and it wasnt just me who heard it, but the Tweeter salesman bought the LSI15 after my audition for his own personal use!

Anyway, back to the 9 vs 1 audition. Kevin and I unpacked the box after I got there and setup the speakers. First thing I noticed, WOW the Ref1s are pretty much the SAME SIZE as the Ref1s. I have never seen a single 5.25" driver bookshelf approach the size of the LSi9 but the Ref1s were just about the same height, width, and *almost* the same in depth.

I rapped my knuckles on top of the Ref1s and I noticed it was SOLID. I rapped mine on top of my LSI9 and I noticed that it felt a *tad* less solid. Perhaps the Refs have 1" mdf vs the LSi9's 3/4" mdf? Rapping my knuckles on the sides were a no contest though as the LSi9's are 1.5" thick along the sides. LSi9 were almost marble solid in this area.

We positioned the speakers at approximately the same distance as the Refs were. The left 9 speaker was inside the left Ref speaker and the right 9 speaker was outside the right Ref speaker.

We did several switches with the use of Kevin's spades. Btw, NICE SPEAKER WIRE!! I think it was the Onix SP200 or something, I forget what he said. VERY solid!

So we did several switches and we A/B-ed several songs. Then we decided to go 1:1 (1 Ref1 and 1 LSI9 at the same time).... so we could get a better feel for how the two speakers differ in sound. Then we went back to regular A/B-ing after about 20-30 minutes of this 1:1 configuration.

My impressions:
- The speakers are VERY similar. Similar to the point where if you played both in 1:1, you wouldnt be able to tell that you are playing to completely different speakers. NO KIDDING.
- The vocals are what separates the two. The LSi9 has this "weight" that the vocals have and is somehow separated from the rest of the soundtrack. The vocals of the LSi9 have this intrinsic "I am free from the rest of the track" characteristic - it truly is hard to describe but easy to hear. The Ref1s, on the other hand, has a more forward treble... very clean but doesnt remove itself from the background soundtrack as the LSi9's do.

- The Ref1s midrange in comparision to the LSi9s midrange is so similar, I couldnt tell significant difference during the audition. The two sounded so good in this area, it doesnt really matter how the two differed here.

- Regarding bass, I remember Kevin going, "what is that plate on the back of the 9s?" I think he was baffled by the sheer stupidity of its looks. I replied, "something about the bass."

Well... the LSi9 had an easy win over the Ref1's in this area. Although both speakers are about the same size, we had to check and DOUBLE check to make sure the UFW10 wasnt on during tracks in which the LSI9 was playing. YES, it was THAT good. The Ref's bass wasnt lacking, just that it didnt extend quite as deep as the LSi9's did. However, the Ref's presented what it had with utter speed and clarity. The bass stopped on a dime and started just as fast. Rise/decay was impeccable.

End of impression.

Towards the end, I found it cool that Kevin began auditioning the LSi9. He began to sit in his sweetspot and let the music rip on the LSi9s. I mentioned how the LSi15 improve on the LSi9 (I, on the otherhand, cant swing a floorstander since I live in the apt at school and I cant bear to life 70lbs x 2 everytime I move out and in =/). Seems like he will audition the LSi15 sometime soon and maybe even today.

I am interested in auditioning his Sapphires (if they arrive) and hope to come back for an encore. He was a very VERY swell guy and I am glad to have a neighbor who is MORE into audio than I am. I'm glad I'm not the only nut around these parts... hehehehe.

Ref1s ($1500 retail, but $800 bstock) and the LSi9 ($900 retail) = 2 thumbs up!

Between these two bookshelves, Kevin and I agreed, it boils down to preferences.

MLS... you make a FINE speaker!
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These impressions were originally posted at the av123 site and I do hope they refrain from flaming. I dont think they will be very keen to this turn of events.... LSi9 standing up to their Reference 1?? Say it aint so!

Hehehehe...

BELIEVE IT!!

The LSi9s are monsters in their own right!!!
<-Game face!

[Zero]

Joey,

First, thank you for taking the time to share your impressions on the Reference 1’s alongside the Polk Lsi-9. This is a match I have been waiting a long time to read about, and have come close to pulling the trigger on the Ref 1’s just to conduct a shoot-out for myself.

Your impressions are exactly how I felt the two would compete. I am also glad to see you walked away satisfied with your LSi-9’s, which are in my opinion, the single best speaker in the LSi line.

The market is becoming more and more saturated with incredible products in the critical $800-$2000 price-point, the LSi-9 is a great product that still holds its own in not only the large mass market, but small scale online vendor products as well.

The Reference 1 is an interesting product, market wise. It retails for $1500, yet is offered with the SP3 tube integrated amplifier for a package deal of $1,199.00. Mark just dropped the price down to $999 for both the REF1 and the SP3… So for the price of an LSi-9 pair, you can get the REF1 with what appears to be a very, very fine tube integrated. This is of course, both good and bad – depending on ones perspective.

I will be looking for your thread at the av123 boards.

Thanks again,

Cheers

[Joey_V]

Zero,

You were right in telling me to hold off before buying blind. You were COMPLETELY right.

Yes, the 999$ deal is very enticing, would've been perfect if I had been converted to the Onix side. However, lets not forget that you can get a brand new Polk from ebay for around 650$.... so it's not bad to be a Polk LSi9 lover either! :D

[Zero]

Joey,

As mentioned awhile back, I learned to hold onto a product until you get the opportunity to hear something you like a lot better. It is tempting, and a bit too easy to just drop what you own and rush for the latest craze or phenom when you are caught up into this hobby. You were smart by holding onto your speakers and are now reaping those rewards, instead of weeping with regret!

The $999 deal is absolutely fantastic for someone stepping into the realm of better sound. Tubes, and a good speaker, all for a G, you just can't beat that (at least until the 50 units are sold). The downside is however, that such deals absolutely destroy re-sale value and because of that, I hesitate to recommend such a system to someone caught up in the hobby.

As for getting the Lsi-9's for $650. Sure, you can even buy them for around that price from various online outlets that keep them stocked. Hey, if your on a budget, why not.. but, if you got the cash - SUPPORT POLK!!!! SUPPORT YOUR DEALERS!

Enjoy the 9's bud.

[2+2]

That was an interesting read Joey....thanks.

I am toying with the longterm (after my TV) idea of getting some Rockets towers in the future for the living room...I think they look real nice....and in the living room, looks definately count. I wonder how they compare to the Onyx Reference series....

[Early B.]

Great review. Thanks for posting it. I have always been intrigued by the Onix offerings. Great bang for buck and beautiful speakers, as well. I bought their UFW-10 subwoofer and it is an awesome performer.

Your results are not surprising. A while back I was in Tweeter and had the salesman put the Lsi9 up against an expensive Vienna Acoustic floorstander (don't recall the specific model) and the Lsi9 sounded just as good. If the 9 wasn't such a big bookshelf, I'd have a pair or two myself.

[heiney9]

Thanks Joey, that was a short to the point review of a speaker (Lsi-9) I've been wanting to purchase. I'm glad you included the music references as well. Well thought out descriptions. Great job and looking forward to the next review with the Sapphire's.

Rock On

H9

[Joey_V]

Ah... the sapphires. They look interesting but physically they dont appeal to me. We shall see when I see them and hear them in person.

[lomic]

Vocals on the Lsi9s seem to separate themselves from the music better than the Refs.

While I'm not a big Hootie and the Blowfish fan, I liked a few tracks off their Cracked Rear View album so I bought the DVD-Audio to give it a whirl. The first thing that struck me was how the vocals seemed to be completely seperated from the music. Usually the 9's do create this effect somewhat, but on this album it's just strange how completely seperate they are - it's like there are 2 sets of speakers in the room.

[Joey_V]

Lomic,

Yes... the 9s do this vocal separation thing soooo well. I'd never want to lose that in a speaker. The weight, the sweetness, the overall balance of the LSi9 is just so impeccable.

My 9s are here to stay for a little bit longer.

I have just realized that in order for me to upgrade from the 9s (without going 15s), it will take some serious money on my part.

One thing that interests me is the Onix Strata Mini... at $1500 or so, it is positioned as my next target for auditioning.

[Moreants]

Nice detailed comparo. I'd suggest the ones that I'd prefer but then I am a little biased.

[Joey_V]

Wow! Gorgeous finish... you make me jealous!

[goingganzo]

and you say you like the 15 beter than the 9.

[Joey_V]

This whole thing made me realize that I have really no where to go speaker-wise until I have a real job.

It is kind of bittersweet.

One, I am stuck.

Two, I like this kind of stuck though.

I guess it's time to focus on an amp and perhaps an LSiC.