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  1. #1

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    Default Alpine DVA-9861 or 9860 experience?

    I need to replace my car stereo, and wanted to get a unit that can read MP3/WMA files off of a DVD-R disk, which both of these units can.

    I am just curious if anyone here has any experience with these units, and if they recommended them (or if they recommend other players that support the DVD-R / MP3 disks feature).


    Thanks a lot

    Lonwa

    PS: I am only aware of only these Alpine units, and a couple of JVC units that support the DVD-R / MP3 feature, if you know more I should look into, please let me know. Thanks.
    Last edited by lonwa; 01-23-2006 at 10:59 PM.
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  2. #2

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    The 9861 would be the one to get- 4V pre-outs vs 2V on the 9860. Both of these models seem to lack some of the SQ features found on previous Alpine H/Us.

    The reviews out there on the DIN-sized JVC with the screen on the face were not that bad, but if I remember right tracks burned to DVDr were a little hard to access, requiring some searching around.
    -------------------------------------------------------

  3. #3

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    but why should SQ matter considering he's looking to play MP3's off a dvd-r? Nothing like compressed audio... its like buying the biggest and best motor you can find and sticking it a ford festiva and only feeding it leaded fuel. I'm sure it'll perform beautifully.
    Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.

    Home Setup: Sony VPL-VW85 Projo, 92" Stewart Firehawk, Pioneer Elite SC-65, PS3, RTi12 fronts, CSi5, FXi6 rears, RTi6 surround backs, RTi4 height, MFW-15 Subwoofer.

    Car Setup: OEM Radio, RF 360.2v2, Polk SR6500 quad amped off 4 Xtant 1.1 100w mono amps, Xtant 6.1 to run an eD 13av.2, all Stinger wiring and Raammat deadener.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxis
    but why should SQ matter considering he's looking to play MP3's off a dvd-r? Nothing like compressed audio... its like buying the biggest and best motor you can find and sticking it a ford festiva and only feeding it leaded fuel. I'm sure it'll perform beautifully.

    That analogy doesn't work out too well. If you bought the biggest and
    baddest engine and placed it into a Ford Festiva that would be ONE FAST
    ride (in the quartermile of course... Making it handle would be a challenge)
    and running an engine on leaded or unleaded has no bearing on it's power
    output assuming the correct octane is selected. The only reason lead was
    added to fuel was to act as a lubricant for the valves to stop them from
    sinking into the valve seats (before they figured out how to harden valve
    seats) the lead also helped raise the octane level. But if you run true leaded
    fuel in an EFI vehicle it will damage the Oxygen Sensor.

    Talk about a thread jack! :D

  5. #5

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    Ahem...

    High bitrate MP3's sound no different to your ear than uncompressed audio, and if you think they do, then you have been suckered by your own mental wishy-wash.

    320 kb constant and 320~128 VBR are virtually if not dead on balls accurate.

    That being said -- most other MP3's encoded at different rates are ****, but hey we still end up listening to them because its cheaper than buying CD's and its easier to schlock 1000000 mp3's onto a disc than to put store bought CD's into a changer.

    It's a toss up... I personally like having the ability to play and use both good quality CD's (Kenferd Excelons have 24bit DAC's from TI) as well as load up an MP3 cd for a bit of a road trip or lazy day.

    ...

    I'm still digging the Focus with a beefed up Mustang 5.0 dropped in it, supercharged, and converted to RWD .... but that's a story for another day (some turkey on the internet did it - search google).
    "With your own attitude it is hard to survive here... But who gives a damn, we are here to change the world, and we dont need a password for that."
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  6. #6

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    Mp3's sounding like crap are not just due to bitrate. The lower the bitrate, the higher the compression, the more music information is discarded in the process. The software used to encode files to mp3 format also has a lot to do with how the mp3 will sound.

    Downloading seemingly identical mp3 files of the same song from the internet can yield different sound quality for each song. One encoder that gives great results is Exact Audio Copy (which uses a seperate msdos program called Lame to compress the music). While I haven't been able to get this working under WinXP, if you are running an older OS this program is great.

    EAC leaves the high and low frequency information in the resulting mp3 sounding great- as good as the original CD at 320 Kbps. Some other encoders will introduce noise or make the music sound muffled or dull even at 320 kbps bitrate, and it is worth experimenting with different programs if you are going to rip a lot of music to your hard drive for in-car listening.

    I understand the appeal of having 4.7gb of music on one DVDR in the dash of your car, and anyone who is going this route should realize that downloaded mp3s are not all created equal. Even if you rip all your mp3 files at the highest bitrate, 4.7 gigs is still a lot of music on one disk.
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  7. #7

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    Fair enough Greg... that being said, check this out...

    Blade Encoder -- the Vorbis wacky taffy guy -- I loved it, but its got a characteristic "whistle" and adds a coloration... why? I dunno, but it does... so I get what you're saying.

    Now, if you want to make lame work under windows - that's no problem. I'm running Lame V3.97 right now along with the Razor Lame front end for windows XP -- this lets you do batch encoding or decoding with constant bitrate from 128 up to 320 or variable bitrate with a max and min o fyour choosing.

    only issue with Razor lame is it "says" you can encode at rates below 128 but you can't -- the files all come out corrupt -- Blade (and Razor Blade Front End) will let you do 48 kbps mp3's or anything you want - that would be just for using on the web... such as background music for a webpage or other types of sounds.

    Anyway - here's a link to my server, it's the Razor Lame Front End with Lame 3.97 ... to run it - just copy the folder to your computer - there is no installation. I tried to upload it but its 1.3 megs and the file limit for polk is 1 meg.

    http://www.spinellicreations.com/download/lame397.zip

    then click on "razorlame.exe" inside the folder... it'll load the GUI .. inside the GUI, click "OPTIONS" -- and make sure you set the "C:\whatever\whatever\Lame\" path of where Lame.exe is (its in the folder, but that folder on my comptuer is probably in a different spot then it will be on yorus, so you have to reset it... then you're all set to go.

    you may where it says there are errors after encoding, but there aren't -- it's got "false" error messages occurring because I upgraded from Lame 3.6 something to 3.97 ... so error reporting sucks but it works like a champ... give er a shot.
    "With your own attitude it is hard to survive here... But who gives a damn, we are here to change the world, and we dont need a password for that."
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  8. #8

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    And this is why some people have no experience with true sound quality. For someone to honestly tell me that there is absolutely no sound quality difference between 320kb MP3 and a redbook cd shows your lack of knowledge in the topic. I absolutely guarantee you take anyone with a mildly trained ear and do a pepsi taste challenge between the two and I guarantee you'll hear the difference (with everything else being equal). If not, you've been listening to way to loud of music in a car or have way to loud of a motor. Its called hearing damage.

    BTW, my comment about the motor in a festiva is because if you take a huge motor and put it in an eggshell of a car, it'll twist the frame, jack up the axles, and in no time flat will not be going anywhere but up in flames.
    Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.

    Home Setup: Sony VPL-VW85 Projo, 92" Stewart Firehawk, Pioneer Elite SC-65, PS3, RTi12 fronts, CSi5, FXi6 rears, RTi6 surround backs, RTi4 height, MFW-15 Subwoofer.

    Car Setup: OEM Radio, RF 360.2v2, Polk SR6500 quad amped off 4 Xtant 1.1 100w mono amps, Xtant 6.1 to run an eD 13av.2, all Stinger wiring and Raammat deadener.

  9. #9

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    ... and that shows you're feeble (spelling) mindedness. To drop a big block or even a hopped up small block into a Festiva is not a bad idea. It's work... lots of work, but it's not a bad idea.

    Guess what... a Festiva doesn't have a frame!!!!!! It's unibody.

    Anyone doing something like that would be building a frame, not to mention motor mounts and a suspension and everything else, for the car. It wouldn't "jack up the axles", because a Festiva is a front wheel drive vehicle...

    FWD vehicles have CV-Half Shafts, not even real "axles". These half shafts would be removed and tossed.

    Something like a Dana 44 or 60 or even a Ford 9.5" would go in the back... something that even a big block would have a hard time "jacking up" as you put it.

    Yes, I probably listen to music far too loud, but guess what, that's because I have the equipment to do so on a regular basis... My ears have bled, literally, in the past. I like it that way. I don't have THOSE speakers anymore though (wish i did though). My motors are equally as loud, but yet again, that's because I don't drive a Festiva with an imaginary frame that you apparently think is there.

    On that note - go choke on a cherry bomb. I'm goin to bed.
    "With your own attitude it is hard to survive here... But who gives a damn, we are here to change the world, and we dont need a password for that."
    - Anurag

  10. #10

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    Wow, I'm sorry I'm not well versed in the Ford Festiva like yourself. I have never even sat in one let alone drove one. So whoopty do! You know a lot about piece of **** cars. I just got your address so the cookies are in the mail. Enjoy.

    As for audio, you clearly know nothing about sound quality or have any sort of trained ear. You have far to much to learn about music and the reproduction of it to get into at your current state. You know what sounds good to you but that obviously isn't saying much. So I'll let you feel all high and mighty about the Ford Festiva but don't even attempt to argue sound. Sure you know about car audio specifics but I guarantee you couldn't build a winning sound quality vehicle with an unlimited budget without someone else walking you through it. Until then, go choke on an MP3 player.
    Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.

    Home Setup: Sony VPL-VW85 Projo, 92" Stewart Firehawk, Pioneer Elite SC-65, PS3, RTi12 fronts, CSi5, FXi6 rears, RTi6 surround backs, RTi4 height, MFW-15 Subwoofer.

    Car Setup: OEM Radio, RF 360.2v2, Polk SR6500 quad amped off 4 Xtant 1.1 100w mono amps, Xtant 6.1 to run an eD 13av.2, all Stinger wiring and Raammat deadener.

  11. #11

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    Ouch.

    Actually, try ripping a few tracks with the EAC/Lame software, and then play them on your system. The highs/lows are very acceptable even when compared back to back with the source CD. I mentioned high/low frequencies, because these are the ones that usually suffer when compressing music to mp3 format. I say acceptable meaning the loss (320 kbps, constant bitrate) is minimal compared to most bitrates.

    I'm not referring to making an "mp3 cd" with hundreds of songs on one CD, which results in further compression to make it all fit on a 700mb disc. While handy for a road trip, this isn't an audiophile move as the extra compression makes it sound like crap. I am referring to burning them in standard format (conversion back to .wav) with 17-20 songs on a single disc.

    I have ripped and burned music in .wav format (which takes more hard drive space),which does not compress the original files. There is little appreciable difference from these over high bitrate mp3s ripped with a quality piece of software. Most downloaded music files are of dubious origin and tend to sound like garbage, and that is not what I'm comparing to.

    Could I tell them apart from the source CD? Possibly, but they do sound very good. Would they sound as good on $10,000 worth of home equipment? Doubtful.

    Making compilation CDs from the ones in my collection rather than carrying 400+ discs in the car is far more practical, because my local crackheads appreciate getting their hands on original discs far more than the home-made variety.

    http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/

    http://lame.sourceforge.net/

    Take your Pepsi challenge and report back. My apologies to the thread starter.
    -------------------------------------------------------

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxis
    Sure you know about car audio specifics but I guarantee you couldn't build a winning sound quality vehicle with an unlimited budget without someone else walking you through it. Until then, go choke on an MP3 player.
    We shall see... the Audiobahn Ram goes into competition this summer. Spent the whole fall/winter tweaking it. Still a little more to go, I'm pretty sure I blew out a tweeter, so another a couple are on the way as backups.
    "With your own attitude it is hard to survive here... But who gives a damn, we are here to change the world, and we dont need a password for that."
    - Anurag

  13. #13

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    ps --- considering the success Mac's been having with the SR's and virtually no alteration to their stock form, I'd probably not need an unlimited budget -- just a couple grand to pick up 2 sets of SR components and a single SR sub, couple of Tru-Tech Copper Series tube amps and call it a day.
    "With your own attitude it is hard to survive here... But who gives a damn, we are here to change the world, and we dont need a password for that."
    - Anurag

  14. #14

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    Youll need a lot more than that and so will I once I get into higher level shows. So far Im a big fish in a little pond. Ill do well this season being in the amateur class but next season when I move up to the modified league itll be a whole other story. Right now in the amateur ranks all you have to do is have a decent stage and good tonal balance and accuracy. Thanks to the SR's I do and so Ive won all the shows Ive entered. In the bigger leagues its a lot more strict.

    First off your stage has to be eye level and centered in the middle of the dash with left and right extending beyond the boundaries of the car. Next you have to have precise focus which is extremely hard to acheive (i.e the voice coming from an area the size of a softball rather from across the entire stage). Thats a ton of work right there before you even get into the tonal balance.

    This will become more evident as the season progresses. In MECA Ill be in the Amateur class the whole season so I should do well but in USACi Im in the Consumer Q class which is open power and vehicle mods. So Ill be competing against former world, national and state champs and expect to get spanked.

    SQ is extrmely hard as everything is working against you. A car is the worst environment imaginable for good SQ yet you have to figure out how to do it!
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
    MECA SQ Rookie of the Year 06 ~ MECA State Champ 06,07,08,11 ~ MECA World Finals 2nd place 06,07,08,09
    08 Car Audio Nationals 1st ~ 07 N Georgia Nationals 1st ~ 06 Carl Casper Nationals 1st ~ USACi 05 Southeast AutumnFest 1st

    polkaudio SR6500 --- polkaudio MM1040 x2 -- Pioneer P99 -- Rockford Fosgate P1000X5D

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    The biggest thing that has opened my eyes is buying the MECA SQ disc. I used to wrongly think metal and hard rock were harder to tune properly and it I nailed them Id be set. I couldnt have been more wrong.

    Go grab some Rebecca Pidgeon, Allison Krause or some good jazz and listen to your system and cringe. This type of music is much more revealing.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
    MECA SQ Rookie of the Year 06 ~ MECA State Champ 06,07,08,11 ~ MECA World Finals 2nd place 06,07,08,09
    08 Car Audio Nationals 1st ~ 07 N Georgia Nationals 1st ~ 06 Carl Casper Nationals 1st ~ USACi 05 Southeast AutumnFest 1st

    polkaudio SR6500 --- polkaudio MM1040 x2 -- Pioneer P99 -- Rockford Fosgate P1000X5D

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