Crazy French

[gidrah]

http://www3.sympatico.ca/rsf/France.htm

[trubluluc]

What did you say???

I hope his sweetspot has a seatbelt.

-Luc

[burdette]

No wonder France can't win a war.

I didn't see a Discwasher...

[F1nut]

That set up is AWESOME and those horns are beautiful. Drool......

[STUFFMD]

That's what i'm talking about....a real freaking wall of sound....I gotta get me one of those.................Peace StuffMD

[meestercleef]

and to think that he could have equally good sound from a Bose wave radio!

[RuSsMaN]

That's an awesome rig, talk about 'live'. Nice link Mark....

Cheers,
Russ

[HBombToo]

Would that be considered a high end rig?

[Janusch]

Showed my friend the pics and his mouth dropped open, he is a really turntable freak. He then proceeded to spend the next 1/2 hours discribing them. Awesome pics.
Thanks

[hoosier21]

two tone arms? can somebody explain that?

[rlw]

Originally posted by hoosier21
two tone arms? can somebody explain that?

B/c you want to run two different cartridges...

For example, a cart with a "mono" stylus and a cart with a "stereo" stylus. The grooves are different enough that to get the best sound requires a stylus specifically designed for that.

If you're a serious vinyl collector and audiophile, you might want to run a second cart that's a "beater": there's nothing like placing a 50 year old piece of vintage vinyl on your table, carefully dropping your $3,000.00 cartridge/stylus on it, and then discovering a crack in the middle of the LP. It might have been hard to see before, but with your stylus/cantilever/coils hanging out of it, you wonder how you missed that gaping chasm.

Likewise, if you're not seriously listening, just partying, it's nice to not use that mega-buck cartridge. The more you use it, the quicker you get to buy a replacement.

Everything in analog is a tradeoff. For example, I might like a certain cartridge/arm combo b/c of it's high-end response; I might like another cart/arm combo b/c of it's ability to mask surface noise. So I might use the first one on my LP's that are in great shape, but not on other LPs.

The list of reasons for 2 arms goes on and on and on...I wish my table supported two arms. I'd love to have a "beater" cartridge mounted and ready to go at all times.

[Janusch]

The friend that was looking at it said that you would want this type of setup if you are switching from 78 to 33 1/2 because they have two different needles

[RuSsMaN]

As rlw said, one mono, one stereo.....

[jmasterj]

Show the wife that , and tell her you won't go that crazy. But you
do need a______________, and a couple of _______________
and a ___________, and you'll be finished for a while. heh heh heh....

[Frank Z]

talk about a horny frenchman!!

[HBombToo]

Thats a good 1!

[smglbrth]

I'm sure it sounds, good, sort of, maybe but that's got to be the one the most unique, well thought out, put together, definitely one of the most butt ugly systems I've ever seen.
Like I said before though, I'm sure it sounds good....

[nadams]

Are those 36" woofers or something??? Something tells me that's a lot of sound!

DooD

[madmax]

Has anyone heard a good turntable like those on a really good system? Just intrigues me a bit. Could they really sound better than the $200 pioneer I don't care for much? There just has to be something to this "sound" people talk about. I've tried my pioneer a few times over the past few years and have never been impressed.
madmax

[rlw]

Originally posted by madmax001
Has anyone heard a good turntable like those on a really good system? Just intrigues me a bit. Could they really sound better than the $200 pioneer I don't care for much? There just has to be something to this "sound" people talk about. I've tried my pioneer a few times over the past few years and have never been impressed.
madmax

Yeah, me.

If you're ever in the Cleveland, OH area, you're welcome to stop by for a listen. You can then be the judge.

But a good, properly set-up analog rig really does sound that much better.

[meestercleef]

I have never listened to a really good turntable with a really good cartridge/stylus. However, I've noticed huge differences in sound quality on tape decks, comparing say, Type I tape recorded on a boombox w/out any Dolby vs metal tape recorded on a decent (not audiophile, but decent) mass-market deck w/Dolby C & Hx Pro. If the difference between good & bad turntable equipment is as great as the difference in cassette quality, I'm willing to at least consider the possibility that vinyl can be a great experience. If your vinyl years, like mine, were spent listening to hard rock on cheap turntables w/cheap cartridges/styluses in an altered state of mind, it's easy to be dismissive of vinyl. In my recent tentative explorations of the vinyl issue, I had it pointed out to me more than once that I would need to get a good cartridge/stylus, not just a good turntable. I've been told that when a cartridge/stylus comes with the turntable, it usually (not always) is something you should replace & keep as an emergency back-up. Just my 2 cents worth for anyone looking into vinyl. If you have experience w/quality turntables & want to correct or elaborate, please do, as I'm just passing on what I've heard.

[rlw]

Originally posted by meestercleef
In my recent tentative explorations of the vinyl issue, I had it pointed out to me more than once that I would need to get a good cartridge/stylus, not just a good turntable.

More importantly, you need to get a cartridge that is designed for use in the tonearm, and those have to be mated well to the table in question. For example: a low-mass arm will not typically mate well with a low-compliance cartridge - the cartridge/stylus assembly will transmit too much energy back into the arm and the arm will resonate at an undesireable frequency. If you want to run a low-compliance cartridge, you should use a high-mass arm which can remain unaffected by the mechanical energy transmitted from cart/stylus.

And if you have a low-compliance cart/high-mass arm combo, you need to match that carefully to the table, for the same reasons. If too much energy is transmitted to the TT plinth - and too much is relative to the mass/design of the plinth - then resonances will be excited...

Then, you have to worry about the environment your idea table/arm/cart are placed in: you can have the best combo, but if vibration from external sources [like your speakers] creates resonances in the TT plinth, that's going to affect the sound that is reproduced. In it's worst manifestation, this is called feedback...

OH, and we haven't even started on the electrical characteristics required of a step-up device. Remember, LP's are cut with an EQ curve (most typically RIAA); the curve is such that the cart's output has to have bass boosted and the treble cut. Now try doing that accurately, without phase shift, to a signal that might be coming off the cart at microvolts.

Then there's the issue of electrical noise: a low or even medium output cartridge can require a lot of gain. In my system, running a medium output MC cartridge, I have 65dB of gain in the phono stage, and then the amps give 37dB of gain - so running the preamp at unity gain [admittedly loud] means that there's 100dB of gain, give or take. Any slight hum/RFI introduced in the signal from TT to phono stage is going to get really obnoxious by the time it hits the speakers.

Digital is definitely easier - in fact, I'm now wondering why I even bother with analog as I realize what a PITA it is. But then I'll go downstairs and listen...and realize that analog is worth it.

Sorry to babble.

[meestercleef]

my brain hurts

[madmax]

Originally posted by rlw


Sorry to babble.

Not babbling at all!!!

Thanks for the input. I am thinking about getting a turntable setup sometime this winter but know little about it. I hope you will be around to help guide me. I'm thinking in the range of $500 to $1200. I hope you can build a good turntable/arm/cartridge/preamp setup for that much but I'm not sure. I would want a decent preamp with a tube in it so I'm sure that is a cost adder. I recently saw a VPI setup for $1300 new which included an arm and cartridge that might be a consideration. I forget the name of it but it looked pretty basic.

Thanks!
madmax

[madmax]

This is the one I've been looking at.

http://www.amusicdirect.com/products...PISCOUT&rljs=1

[rlw]

madmax: I looked for your system on the showcase, and didn't see it, and I'm too lazy to go looking through all threads for it...if you don't mind, can you post it? Include some details about your room setup as well...acoustics, construction, etc.

What kind of music do you listen to? What qualities do you value most in the music you listen to? Different tables have different "sounds". VPI's traditionally have a darker, lusher sound - some people love that, others (me included) hate it. I haven't head the Scout - but I can't imagine that VPI would much change their house sound. VPI does make excellent, reliable products, so I wouldn't hesitate over build quality.

How much vinyl do you currently have? How much are budgeting to buy? Are you going to be buying the "audiophool" pressings? What about used? BTW, there's more audiphool vinyl being pressed now than in the "heyday" of vinyl - by far. There's a lot of new vinyl being pressed in general - I just picked up the Dixie Chicks latest release on LP, and it's excellent. Not to mention that all the hardcore is released on vinyl, and it's cheaper than CD...so if you're a music lover, vinyl makes more sense than ever.

What's your total budget for this? I'm going to suggest that you think about: a record cleaner ($30 - $500); a stylus cleaner; a tracking force gauge; a level; a protractor/alignment tool; and a good stand for your table. You'll probably want to budget somewhere around $200-$400 for a cartridge, and at least that for a phono stage. All this can quickly add to a grand.

Do you like to "tinker"? Do you like to upgrade? Analog is great for this - it's pretty amazing how much you can change the sound of your system easily with a table mod. If you're looking for a no-brainer, one-stop solution, something like the Scout might be great - but I'm not sure that I see a lot of upgrade potential in it. For example, I'm not a big fan of a plinth constructed from a plate of steel and MDF - the MDF is OK (not great), but steel? Talk about ringing like a bell...the MDF will damp that, but enough?

Also, the VPI uses an AC motor - not a bad thing at all - but you have to feed it good clean AC to get the best results. If you have crappy power, you might want to consider some kind of an AC regenerator for any AC motor.

If you're ever looking to upgrade, I think the Scout will be a problem. I don't think it will be worth upgrading much - I can't see tossing a better arm on it, and I can't see tossing a really great cartridge on it. I think that ugrading from the Scount means selling the Scout and starting over - and I have a gut feeling that you're going to take a beating if you do that - you'll probably get, at best, $500.00 for it a year from now.

I'd also suggest that you give Galen Carol a call (gcaudio.com). He's a great guy - and he sells VPI as well as other brands and will give you a straight scoop. He's one of the best out there.

Just some stuff to think about. Don't worry, there's more. It's all worth it, too. I can't begin to tell you how analog has put the joy back into listening to music - and everybody who sits down and listens to my system agrees.

Hope that helps.

[gidrah]

rlw - great info

VPI is out of my financial reach. I'm trying to snag an old Dual off my buddy.


I bet this guy spends over $1000/yr on replacement tubes.

[F1nut]

Audiophool? Is that someone who invests in outdated source material or is it all of us here? :p

[gidrah]

I too wonder about this name. Furtherr explanation please.

[F1nut]

I'm sure he is refering to people who buy audiophile grade recordings. Perhaps he doesn't think the better recorded issues are worth the money. Since I gave up on vinly a long time ago I can't speak for that medium, but as for cd's, I swear by the audiophile grade.