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  1. #1

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    Default floorstanders - why necessary?

    Hi all,

    For a while now I've been trying to figure out how to step up the audio quality of my setup. I have a Polk RM6700 system with PSW404. The 404 is enough bass for me but I am ready for some more definition in the mids and highs. (I use nice audio monitors for computer speakers so I'm starting to get snobby)

    My room is currently 13x13x8 with an open floorplan.

    I see that most people here like floorstanding speakers, but I really don't quite grasp the necessity. Isn't that what the sub/satellite combination was meant to solve? I kind of like small speakers over monster floorstanders... but I want the best quality for my money. Maybe I just haven't experienced the right home theatre setup to make me understand ;)

    I'm thinking of buying from polkdirect or other ebay source. I am currently eyeing the RTi A5's / CSi 4.. but I am wondering if maybe 4 FXi4 speakers might be more in line with my needs? My amp is a Onkyo 606 so I need to keep it efficient as possible. (dont need massive loudness, particularly)

    Anyone want to argue one way or another? Thanks...

  2. #2

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    Alot of people like floorstanders because nothing can replace displacement...

    However, a good bookshelf will outperform a floorstander in clarity and staging...

    I like a floorstanding for the extra bass response and the larger sound it puts out...

    Definitely personal preference
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  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vr3MxStyler2k3 View Post
    However, a good bookshelf will outperform a floorstander in clarity and staging...
    Not sure about that one. It sorta contradicts the reason people like floorstanders. I'll bet if you put the Taylo reference monitors up against the 7U's in your room, I doubt that the monitors will provide better clarity or staging.

    As you said, with floorstanders displacement is the draw, but that equates to a bigger stage. I think the clarity issue may come into play with the bass of floorstanders not being set up properly in the room, so it can affect clarity.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

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  4. #4

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    Larger drivers move/energize more air. The little ones just don't do it for me any more.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
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  5. #5

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    blakflag get thy read on and check out this article. It's interesting.

    "2.5 Cheers For Stand Mounted Moniters"

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    Because if you want that BIG, real sound, you need to use real big speakers.

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    Hmmmm, if you don't know, you don't know.
    In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence.

    The best way to enjoy digital music reproduction is to never listen to good analogue reproduction.

  8. #8

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    Big speakers can sound like the real deal without breaking a sweat. There is a certain effortless character that indicates to you that as loud and accurate as it might be right then, going even further clockwise would somehow, just make them louder.

    Smaller speakers usually don't have this going for them.

  9. #9

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    There's no replacement for displacement.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Music Joe View Post
    blakflag get thy read on and check out this article. It's interesting.

    "2.5 Cheers For Stand Mounted Moniters"
    The author doesn't know WTF he's talking about.

    With speakers, go big. Big as you possibly can.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

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  11. #11

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    There are limitations though, as with most speakers.
    In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence.

    The best way to enjoy digital music reproduction is to never listen to good analogue reproduction.

  12. #12

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    The author states the monitor was 12x12x24. Nobody would use a semi square box. The general rule is 3x4x5. I prefer a larger speaker;)
    Last edited by ben62670; 10-15-2008 at 12:06 AM.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
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  13. #13

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    For me, it came down to floorstanders were really not that much more than bookshelves when you factor in decent stands for them. Also they were significantly more stable than speakers on stands would be. (important with kids and large dogs running around)

    That and I just like the look for floorstanders more.

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  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by blakflag View Post
    Hi all,

    I see that most people here like floorstanding speakers, but I really don't quite grasp the necessity. Isn't that what the sub/satellite combination was meant to solve?
    Well, since most speaker manufacturers top-of-the-line speakers are floor standers that should be a clue. Plus they just look better than little wimpy speakers on stands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    Well, since most speaker manufacturers top-of-the-line speakers are floor standers that should be a clue. Plus they just look better than little wimpy speakers on stands.
    And they don't take up any more floor space:)
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben

  16. #16

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    However, a good bookshelf will outperform a floorstander in clarity and staging...
    I'm going to amend your comment to say, can outperform in those areas, but a good floorstander can and will outperform a bookshelf in all areas.

    There is no subsitute for large radiating surfaces and a man's amp.
    'Political Correctness'.........defined

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  17. #17

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    how about SDA CRS+'s? they are bookshelf, no? and outperform other floorstanders in certain areas :p



















    runs and hides :)

  18. #18

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    Al, from first hand experience.....the CRS+ are very good bookshelf speakers, IMO. However, compared to the bigger SDA's, they don't hold a candle.
    'Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end."

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by blakflag View Post
    I see that most people here like floorstanding speakers, but I really don't quite grasp the necessity. Isn't that what the sub/satellite combination was meant to solve? I kind of like small speakers over monster floorstanders... but I want the best quality for my money.

    Blakflag,

    The question is: Do you want to Hear the music only?, Or do you want to Feel the music as well?

    You said you want the Best quality for your money, I'd recommend Polk SRS 2's, SRS 2.3TL's or 1.2TL's and a High Powered Amp with at least 200 WPC

    Here's my 1.2TL's with 600 Watts Per Channel, If you were in my living room while this was playing you would feel your internal organs moving ;)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHHLKERU0wo

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  20. #20

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    I'll give you my personal 2ch opinion when the RTi8's get here. I will be able to hear first hand between a dual 6.5" bookshelf RT55i vs dual 6.5" RTi8 tower.

    From what I've seen from R&R on the RT55 and RTi6 there is no difference in the woofers except the dustcaps and cone colors. Both are 4.1ohms. So the 8's got to be the same.

    I got the 8's because I have had stands for the last 20 years and the cherry finish. Before that I had several large driver tower/floor speakers. I hope the 8's are not too bass heavy/muddy.

    Personally though, I love the complete separation of the low bass freqs/res/standing waves from the the mids and highs, via a quality powered subwoofer in it's own box.

    Paul
    Last edited by Polksaladanni; 10-15-2008 at 04:01 AM.

  21. #21

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    A floorstander is nothing more than a monitor wanna-be all stuffed into a larger cabinet (a design flaw from the start). The designers spend more time trying to overcome the problimatic issues with trying to do everything in one cabinet properly.

    A monitor will out perform a floorstander in all areas but the bass department. However the difference in bass is the downfall of the FS.

    In probably all room placements, where you have the FS is more than likely the actual worst location for "quality" bass reproduction. Now you pair the monitor up with a good sub or two (properly located, calibrated & dialed in) & watch the FS cower & crawl into the corner with it's tail between it's leg.
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  22. #22

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    What about the LSi15's and 25's. To me they seem like LSi9's with a built-in subwoofer. The other difference is that the 9's are meant to handle all the bass. The cabinet and crossover of the FS LSi's in the upper portion do not carry the bass potion. So would 9's and a great subwoofer outperform the FS LSi's?

  23. #23

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    i'm not so sure i can agree with much of what has been said...

    I think in many cases a floorstander will outperform a bookshelf. of course there are cases where this isnt true but it always has been true in my experience.

    example: Comparing my RTi10s to the RTi4 and RTi6's that i have. The bookshelves, while they sound alright, have a muddy upper-bass and and non-existant lower bass. with the woofer trying to provide such a wide range of frequency response, it seems that the mids are negatively impacted. the RTi10s separate things much better, the mids and bass dont get jumbled together. I've tried both with and without a sub, and in either case i think the floorstander sounds much better.
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  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by George Grand View Post
    Because if you want that BIG, real sound, you need to use real big speakers.
    Quote Originally Posted by George Grand View Post
    Big speakers can sound like the real deal without breaking a sweat. There is a certain effortless character that indicates to you that as loud and accurate as it might be right then, going even further clockwise would somehow, just make them louder.

    Smaller speakers usually don't have this going for them.
    Quote Originally Posted by F1nut View Post
    I'm going to amend your comment to say, can outperform in those areas, but a good floorstander can and will outperform a bookshelf in all areas.

    There is no subsitute for large radiating surfaces and a man's amp.

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  25. #25

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    Default Apples & Oranges ...

    Quote Originally Posted by BjornB17 View Post
    ... Comparing my RTi10s to the RTi4 and RTi6's that i have. ...
    That's not necessarily a true FS vs. BS comparison, since the RTi10 have tweets, mids, and woofers, whereas the RTi4 and RTi6 only have tweets and mids.

    I have RT800s (FS) and RT55s (BS). They both have the same tweeters and drivers. Only the cabinet is different. The specs are slightly different on paper, but in real life, they are so similar that it really doesn't matter to me. On the size issue, the RT55 on their stands actually seem bigger than the RT800 standing on their own feet, and what McLoki says about dogs and kids is worth considering (if a BS falls off it's stand, it's going to hurt! A FS would not be unscathed in a topple either, probably, but it would take more of a push perhaps).

    Product pages (from the silghty newer "i" version of the RT line - the RT pages do not seem to be available but the official specifications are identical according to the manual I have):
    http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/specs/rt800i/
    http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/specs/rt55i/

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by pearsall001 View Post
    A floorstander is nothing more than a monitor wanna-be all stuffed into a larger cabinet (a design flaw from the start). The designers spend more time trying to overcome the problimatic issues with trying to do everything in one cabinet properly.

    A monitor will out perform a floorstander in all areas but the bass department. However the difference in bass is the downfall of the FS.

    In probably all room placements, where you have the FS is more than likely the actual worst location for "quality" bass reproduction. Now you pair the monitor up with a good sub or two (properly located, calibrated & dialed in) & watch the FS cower & crawl into the corner with it's tail between it's leg.
    Ha ha. You've been living with yor AAD 2001's for too long. Those monitors can definitely spar with the big boys, but they are a rare exception.

    I previously had a stereo sub setup and loved it. It was the best bass I heard, until recently. I changed the configuration of my setup (same speakers, but now along the short wall), changed a couple of components, and the bass is astounding. I didn't think it was possible. I haven't felt the need to add the dual subs again. The secret is in the setup. The vast majority of people with floorstanders don't have a clue about proper placement, but instead will damn all floorstanders to hell. (OK, so maybe that's a slight exaggeration.)
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50 LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

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  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by ben62670 View Post
    The author states the monitor was 12x12x24. Nobody would use a semi square box. The general rule is 3x4x5. I prefer a larger speaker;)
    Like that Greek guy. Nice, thanks.

  28. #28

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    wow thanks for all the input. Maybe I should just take the leap for some floorstanders. I will check out folks other recommendations but I have a feeling I won't have the coin for some of them. :)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Early B. View Post
    Ha ha. You've been living with yor AAD 2001's for too long. Those monitors can definitely spar with the big boys, but they are a rare exception.

    I previously had a stereo sub setup and loved it. It was the best bass I heard, until recently. I changed the configuration of my setup (same speakers, but now along the short wall), changed a couple of components, and the bass is astounding. I didn't think it was possible. I haven't felt the need to add the dual subs again. The secret is in the setup. The vast majority of people with floorstanders don't have a clue about proper placement, but instead will damn all floorstanders to hell. (OK, so maybe that's a slight exaggeration.)
    I was waiting for your response! ;)

    With floorstanders it's all about placement...most of the time with lack luster bass performance (due to sharing the same cabinet with the other drivers, XO, etc.). I'm glad to hear that you found the ideal spot for those bad boys. Now to really make them sing...put the subs back in!!! Now we're talking!!

    And you're right...those AAD 2001 monitors are a rare breed! Still loving 'em.
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  30. #30
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    The floorstand argument is definitely true when it comes to horns. There is a rare pair of decent horns in bookshelf form (Klipsch RB-75), but mostly floorstands because of the required size.

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