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  1. #1

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    Default SR 6500: Tweeter Location & Axis Question

    I will be putting in a set of SR6500s into my car (a '97 Porsche 911) with the intent of keeping things as close to stock appearance as possible while getting as good of sound as I can.

    My head unit is a Becker Monza and my amp is a Helix HXA-400 MkII. My plan is to use the included Polk crossover and not 100% decided whether to bridge the amp (a bit concerned that the 2 x 200/300Watts RMS/max may be too much) or just use the amp in 4 channel mode (4 x 65/85 W RMS/max) and 2 of the channels unused since I'm not going to even bother hooking up a rear stage for now. Detailed specs on the amp at bottom of post.

    The mid-woofer will be in the factory location which is at the front of the door down quite low. It's roughly at your knee as you sit in the car.
    Question #1: Is there any best way to aim the mid woofer? Should it be aimed as close to the listener's ear as possible or off axis in some way?
    I have some options with the tweeter. There is room to mount it within a couple of inches of the mid behind the factory grill or it can be mounted on the top of the door panel (approx chest high about 1 foot in front the driver & passenger's chest) using the surface mounts that come with the SR6500s.
    Question #2: Would either of these two locations present a real advantage over the other?

    Question #3: Should the tweeters be aimed at the listener's ear or off axis in some way?
    I'll try both on / off phase when I wire things up but wanted to get some wisdom from others on how to mount things since that's a bit harder to change later.

    Thanks much,

    Rick

    Technical specifications HXA 400 MK II
    Cont. power rating at 4 Ohm per channel . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 x 65/85 W RMS/max. power
    Cont. power rating at 2 Ohm per channel . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 x 100/150 Watts RMS/max. power
    Cont. power rating bridged at 4 Ohm . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2x 200/300 Watts RMS/max. power
    Frequency response . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 20 Hz - 20 kHz, +/- 0,2 dB
    Total harmonic distortion (THD) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . < 0,009%
    TIM distortion . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . < 0,016%
    Signal to noise ratio . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > 100 dB
    Input impedance . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10 kOhm
    Input sensitivity . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 700 mV - 8 V
    Fuse . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .2 x 25 Ampere
    Dimensions (H x W xD) in mm . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 31,5 x 200 x 336

  2. #2

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    all i can say at the momoent is (well, besides sounds like a damn nice frontstage) bi-amp(and 2/300 isn't 2 much but others here can help u out on this better than me) bi-amp
    Polk MM6501 kick panels, Eclipse cd7200mkll and SW9122 Bomb Box, Cadence A4, A7, CAP5, JL8W3V3

  3. #3

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    The mids would be better as far forward and as low as possible but if you are set on leaving them in the stock location then just keep them 90 degrees off axis. The SR mids have very good off axis response so you should be ok.

    The tweeters work best mounted higher up to help keep the stage nice and high. As for aiming, try to aim them at the opposite side head rest.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
    MECA SQ Rookie of the Year 06 ~ MECA State Champ 06,07,08,11 ~ MECA World Finals 2nd place 06,07,08,09
    08 Car Audio Nationals 1st ~ 07 N Georgia Nationals 1st ~ 06 Carl Casper Nationals 1st ~ USACi 05 Southeast AutumnFest 1st

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  4. #4

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    I would try the tweeters mounted coax and bi amped. I would also try to get them on axis as possible. Sure these speakers are great off axis but they are better on axis.

    I have mine mounted coax in the doors with zero stage height issues. It will help ensure you don't have major comb filtering. If you try it and the stage height sucks then change the tweeter to another location.

    I tried every location in my car for at least two months and having them mounted coax has provided me with the best results. Better focus, imaging, tonality basically it was all positive without giving up something else.

    The best solution is to try everything out for yourself. Everyone's car is different and one setup might not work for another. Aim the mids at different angles to see what sounds best and move the tweeter around also.

    What are the tuning capabilities of that deck?
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  5. #5

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    i like macs 1st and 4th sentence and dirts 1st and 4th paragraph
    don't have sr6500s but my eclipse components mounted in kickpanels also have zero stage height issues
    yeah whats up w/ that deck?

  6. #6

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    Guys,

    Thank you for the replies...very helpful.

    As a starting point, I'm leaning towards mounting the mids in the factory location (essentially at bottom/front of the door) and will mount the tweeters at the top of the door using the angled mounts.

    Wisdom seems to point towards bi-amping which seems to imply ditching the factory crossovers and going active...any suggestions on which crossover to purchase?

    The head unit...I'll admit...is a bit of a compromise. It has virtually no tuning capabilities (just basic fade, balance, tone, loudness, etc...). I'm using it because it's virtually identical to the factory unit.

    Thanks much,

    Rick

  7. #7

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    active yes, ditch don't think so. mac and dirt prob know better than me but i think they'll say keep xovr for tweeters audiocontrol makes nice xovrs. crutchfield sells em now

  8. #8

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    Bi-amp and active are similar but different.

    Bi-amp, you keep the crossovers supplied with the SR's. Then run one amp channel to one mid connection on the crossover and the another channel to the tweeter, do this for both mid/tweeter set. So, one four channel amp will run one set of speakers. This allows you to adjust levels of both tweeters and mids separately. If your deck had time alignment you could also adjust this for each speaker. (To run bi-amped you need to remove one of the jumpers on the crossover)

    Active, ditch the supplied crossovers that came with the SR's. Then directly connect the speakers to the amp in the same configuration as bi-amping, but you need an active capable deck or other device to set crossover points, level and TA(time alignment). This is a lot more flexible and at first it might be frustrating until everything starts to fall together. Right now you don't have the capability to run active.
    Last edited by dirthog; 05-19-2009 at 10:15 AM.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  9. #9

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    Surfed the net a bit and found:

    OP's hu is a becker. Becker as a company was made famous by the oem radios it supplied to mercedes benz from the late fourties on. Around the mid 90's they diversified into navigation systems and that accounts for 90% of their biz today. The company is well known across the pond as one that integrates quality and technology into its products.

    The Monza is Beckers attempt at getting back into the top end cd reciever mkt. UNfortunately it was designed with a navigation device mindset not an audiophile one. Since biz for the last 15 yrs has been mostly in navigation devices where technology and options are key. At a similar price of $600 a top end cdr would offer a wealth of sound control options. The monza offers technology options, 2 tuners, bluetooth, ipod connectivity, hands free for phone etc etc. But the most basic audio control as pointed out by the op. It puts out a 3v signal (it will be stout 3v signal...but still a 3v one), has 4 preouts and is 4x18 watts rms etc.

    Both Mac and dan know more abt install, so wont go there.

    All links to the h400 mk 2 took me to the helix a4 competiion model. If this is the amp its a killer. Apart from the impeccable birth sheet it allows for lp / bp / hp active xover from 12hz to 7kz. Bi amping sounds like a good idea. Great speakers and great amp with a decent signal. Should sound great. All that would be missing would be the eq and time alignment. This could be added thru a processor down the line.

  10. #10

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    wouldn't u still use/need supplied crossover for tweeter lowpass going active on capable HU and/or bi-amping also?

  11. #11

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    Biamping would be done from the amp, connect the tweets to front channels and the mids to the rear. If his amp allows him to set lp/bp/hp for each channel then he has two options:

    1. The sr xover splits the signal at 3.1khz. So using the passive xover, he can set the mid lp at around 40hz from his amp (since he's not using a sub, may as well get max bass from the mids. The sr mids anyways play down to 30hz). He would bp for mid at 3khz from the amp. Next he would set the lp for the tweet at 3khz. Only drawback here is that the xover point between mids and tweets is defined by the passive xover. According to Mac seperating the mids and tweets at 4khz gives good results. However this would be a good way to begin.

    2. The second option is going fully active. OP would remove the passive xover and play around till he finds the best xover point between mids and tweets. Mids lp would be set as above.

    Dan explained the above in his post.

  12. #12

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    No, that's not active. You only need the crossover when you biamp and you don't lowpass a tweeter. Lowpass let's all frequencies that are lower than the set crossover frequency pass through.

    Quote Originally Posted by cadenceclipse View Post
    wouldn't u still use/need supplied crossover for tweeter lowpass going active on capable HU and/or bi-amping also?
    Active, you set the HPF for tweeters, LPF and HPF for the mids, LPF for the sub, the crossover slope, levels and time alignment(TA) from the HU or other device. Even though you can set levels with the HU, that is for fine tuning. The gain on your amp needs to be set correctly or you will blow the tweeters.

    You have the ability to adjust each speaker separately. One tweeter could have the HPF set at 4khz and the other tweeter could be set at 5khz. They could have different slopes, TA, etc. Same for the left and right mid, the settings could be completely different for each speaker.

    Biamp, the supplied crossover sets the HPF/slope for the tweeter and LPF/slope for the mids. Everything else can still be adjusted for each speaker if you have a capable Hu or other device.

    Active is nice because you have more flexability. I have a higher crossover point and shallower slope on my driver side mid because they are more off axis than the passanger side. I did this to correct the beaming effect of higher frequencies.
    Last edited by dirthog; 05-20-2009 at 10:06 AM.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  13. #13

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    word. yeah wasn't sure if tweeter (passive crossover(or any for that matter) had LPF(was thinking so b/c i hear few people biamping keep crossover but guess thats cause they have no capable HU, processor, or etc)
    dirt u use dual filters(HU and amp)?
    (your 2nd paragraph) guess u could include subsonic in there?
    last question--how do u REALLY set gains(and crossover for that matter) besides by ear(which i've been trying for past 10 yrs)(think i'm almost there though-but probably not). guess w/ multimeter or somethin u can get gains exact? maybe clipping indicator has somethin 2 do w/ it..
    Last edited by cadenceclipse; 05-20-2009 at 02:41 PM.

  14. #14

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    Active is nice because you have more flexability. I have a higher crossover point and shallower slope on my driver side mid because they are more off axis than the passanger side. I did this to correct the beaming effect of higher frequencies.
    Info filed for use when active. Tks for sharing. :)

    In my bi-amped setup, the near side mid which is off axis is louder but not as sweet as the far side mid. The far side mid which is more on axis is not as loud, but a lot sweeter, fuller and more balanced.

    The loudness bit can be compensated by either eq or by lowering the gain of the near side mid from hu. I prefer to keep the gains level and do it from the eq. Balancing the sweetness is a bit of a struggle. Lowering the slope may help. Hang on give me 10 mts.........

    I normally run the mids at 24db/oct in a cascading setup. Did a 5mts test with the near side mid to 18db and attenuated 200hz, 80hz and 50hz a bit. I feel the mids blend better now and there is better clarity. But the stage is down a bit. Will run with this and tweak a bit. Will let you know how it turns out.

    Am not running active so cant set diff xover points for the tweets yet.

    Good to see you back on cp dan. :)

  15. #15

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    My amp crossovers are not used at all. Every setting is adjusted from my Hu, Pioneer 880 (Newer Version is 800). I cannot set a subsonic filter from my Hu, I don't have the need since I'm using a sealed box for the sub.

    I set the gains with my ears, others use a DMM. I don't use a DMM because of lost output. Music is not recorded at the same level as test tones.

    Set the time alignment first. I then set the gains for the mids and level match the tweeters. Next I set the crossover/slope and then eq last. Setting the mid level and TA are the easiest but the rest can take months.

    When setting the mids, turn your Hu to 3/4 volume or if you know when it clips set it to that volume. So, if your Hu goes up to 100 set it to 75 and play music with heavier bass. Next go to your amp and turn up the gain until you start to hear distortion from the mids. Once you hear it, back off of the gain until it goes away. Your mid gain is now set.

    Tweeter, start low and keep adding gain until it sounds correct. Might have to revisit this later.

    If everything sounds ok you can start adjusting crossover points and slopes.

    Then adjust eq.



    Quote Originally Posted by cadenceclipse View Post
    word. yeah wasn't sure if tweeter (passive crossover(or any for that matter) had LPF(was thinking so b/c i hear few people biamping keep crossover but guess thats cause they have no capable HU, processor, or etc)
    dirt u use dual filters(HU and amp)?
    (your 2nd paragraph) guess u could include subsonic in there?
    last question--how do u REALLY set gains(and crossover for that matter) besides by ear(which i've been trying for past 10 yrs)(think i'm almost there though-but probably not). guess w/ multimeter or somethin u can get gains exact? maybe clipping indicator has somethin 2 do w/ it..
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  16. #16

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    You could try the crossover on you amp to set the right mid LPF lower. Remeber at that point your amp and crossover will be working together. This might level out the difference in sweeter/fuller sound.

    I would adjust the gains for the mids after doing so to level match.

    Use the amp gains to set the levels first and then use the eq.


    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    Info filed for use when active. Tks for sharing. :)

    In my bi-amped setup, the near side mid which is off axis is louder but not as sweet as the far side mid. The far side mid which is more on axis is not as loud, but a lot sweeter, fuller and more balanced.

    The loudness bit can be compensated by either eq or by lowering the gain of the near side mid from hu. I prefer to keep the gains level and do it from the eq. Balancing the sweetness is a bit of a struggle. Lowering the slope may help. Hang on give me 10 mts.........

    I normally run the mids at 24db/oct in a cascading setup. Did a 5mts test with the near side mid to 18db and attenuated 200hz, 80hz and 50hz a bit. I feel the mids blend better now and there is better clarity. But the stage is down a bit. Will run with this and tweak a bit. Will let you know how it turns out.

    Am not running active so cant set diff xover points for the tweets yet.

    Good to see you back on cp dan. :)
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  17. #17

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    You could try the crossover on you amp to set the right mid LPF lower. Remeber at that point your amp and crossover will be working together. This might level out the difference in sweeter/fuller sound.

    I would adjust the gains for the mids after doing so to level match.

    Use the amp gains to set the levels first and then use the eq.
    My polk 4ch amp does not have seperate gain control for l/r. Also my hu is the p80prs, which is the 880 version for the asian market. Everything is identical except I cant band pass my mids (hence can't go active) and slopes are first and second order only for mids and tweets. The sub has third order 18db slope. Company figured they could save a couple of bucks and the dumb asians wouldnt know. :)

    12db is a shallow slope for mids. That is why I use the xover from the amp, so that I get an extra 12db. I set the xover from the hu at 63hz and at the amp a little higher than 63hz. My logic is - if the hu is cut off at 63hz on a 12db slope, the lowest freq the amp gets is prob around 45hz. Hence if I set the xover at the amp at say 75hz, again at a 12db slope, the speakers would see 60. I cut my sub off at 50hz from the hu at 18db hence the amp prob see's a low of 70hz. I then set the amp to say 40hz so that the sub gets 50hz at 30db slope. At least thats the logic...dunno if its correct

    Oh I hope you remember, we have rhight hand drive here. So the right mid is the near one.

    Last couple of days, I have been playing with the diff slope & xover settings. Tried keeping both mids at 63hz with the near side slope at 18db and far side at 24db. Also tried near side xover at 80hz on 18db and far side 63hz at 24db. Both had +ve's and -ve's. For now have settled for the former. It requried some tunning. I had to sacrifice a few inches in stage height but the coherence, fullness of sound is a big gain. I feel I have gained more than I have lost. ;)

  18. #18

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    I think we highjacked the op's thread.

    Just one clarification:

    The mids would be better as far forward and as low as possible
    That was Mac's comment. My stock location well forward (at the forward end) but about 6" below the window. So they are well forward but up high. Whats the diff between mids high up on the panel and those mounted at the feet?

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    Whats the diff between mids high up on the panel and those mounted at the feet?
    Pathlength difference.

    Measure the distance from the center of the speaker grill to the center of your head rest. Now measure the right side door. Note the difference. Now measure again but from a point as far down and forward on the door as you can. The difference between left and right will be less.

    Ideally youre wanting your left and right speakers to be the same distance away from you. This gives you the best and most true stereo effect. This is almost impossible in a car since youre sitting off to one side - duh. So the closest you can get them the better off you are and the less time alignment youll have to use which helps a lot in fixing pathlength issues but not all of them as pathlengths dont just affect the timing of the sound but also the intensity/volume. Time alignment from a processor affects the time but not the volume.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
    MECA SQ Rookie of the Year 06 ~ MECA State Champ 06,07,08,11 ~ MECA World Finals 2nd place 06,07,08,09
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    polkaudio SR6500 --- polkaudio MM1040 x2 -- Pioneer P99 -- Rockford Fosgate P1000X5D

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    We have jacked it and I was thinking we should start another thread but it's too late.

    You do have the capability to go active, I think.

    Do you have one gain for all four channels or one for channels 1/2 and another for 3/4? If you have two then you run the mids off of 1/2 and for the tweeters use channels 3/4.

    Did you use the switch on the side of the Hu to use network mode (active)? I would think you have the capability, but could be wrong.

    Edit: I looked up your deck and it does have the capability to go active. If your amp has separated gains your good to go. Have fun being more frustrated than ever trying different settings.




    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    My polk 4ch amp does not have seperate gain control for l/r. Also my hu is the p80prs, which is the 880 version for the asian market. Everything is identical except I cant band pass my mids (hence can't go active) and slopes are first and second order only for mids and tweets. The sub has third order 18db slope. Company figured they could save a couple of bucks and the dumb asians wouldnt know. :)

    12db is a shallow slope for mids. That is why I use the xover from the amp, so that I get an extra 12db. I set the xover from the hu at 63hz and at the amp a little higher than 63hz. My logic is - if the hu is cut off at 63hz on a 12db slope, the lowest freq the amp gets is prob around 45hz. Hence if I set the xover at the amp at say 75hz, again at a 12db slope, the speakers would see 60. I cut my sub off at 50hz from the hu at 18db hence the amp prob see's a low of 70hz. I then set the amp to say 40hz so that the sub gets 50hz at 30db slope. At least thats the logic...dunno if its correct

    Oh I hope you remember, we have rhight hand drive here. So the right mid is the near one.

    Last couple of days, I have been playing with the diff slope & xover settings. Tried keeping both mids at 63hz with the near side slope at 18db and far side at 24db. Also tried near side xover at 80hz on 18db and far side 63hz at 24db. Both had +ve's and -ve's. For now have settled for the former. It requried some tunning. I had to sacrifice a few inches in stage height but the coherence, fullness of sound is a big gain. I feel I have gained more than I have lost. ;)
    Last edited by dirthog; 05-26-2009 at 11:05 AM.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

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    We have jacked it and I was thinking we should start another thread but it's too late.

    You do have the capability to go active, I think.

    Do you have one gain for all four channels or one for channels 1/2 and another for 3/4? If you have two then you run the mids off of 1/2 and for the tweeters use channels 3/4.

    Did you use the switch on the side of the Hu to use network mode (active)? I would think you have the capability, but could be wrong.

    Edit: I looked up your deck and it does have the capability to go active. If your amp has separated gains your good to go. Have fun being more frustrated than ever trying different settings.
    We can move over to the SQ thread....:)

    1. Seperate gains for front and rears. Currently tweets connected to fronts and mids to rear ch of amp.

    2. My p80rs does not have an active switch on the side. Funny thing, these sets have a demo mode right? In the demo mode it shows you how you can band pass your mids. But I cant do it on my set......

    3. Inability to go active seems like a small issue right now. The hu was bought in the grey mkt (no bill / warranty) about 6 months ago. Pioneer India has not launched this model here, so I was forced to buy it in grey. For the last 4-5 days I am facing issues of the cd getting stuck inside the unit, from time to time there is a static kind of disturbance in the sound, the cd stops playing and I get error msg's 11, 12 and 17. Since the pioneer service centre will not service the unit, I'll have to take it to a normal repair shop and I dont trust these people. They may change 10 parts inside and I wouldnt know till the next prob occurs. I am told the lens need changing and the transport / eject assembly needs checking/ realigning.

    4. For now I am going to get it repaired locally as I dont have an option. Ifthings dont work out I will have to dip into the $$$ I was saving for the sr set up and buy a new HU. In case I need to buy a new HU any ideas on which one? I love the pioneer unit but dropping another $400 on a unit w/o bill warranty is a no no.

    5. DAMN DAMN DAMN I hate this SQ addiction.

  22. #22

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    You have to take the deck out of the harness in order to see the switch. It's a little black switch on the side of the deck chassis about half way back.

    Sounds like you have some issues though. I would recommend a Pioneer 800 or Alpine with like abilities.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

  23. #23

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    Pathlength difference.

    Measure the distance from the center of the speaker grill to the center of your head rest. Now measure the right side door. Note the difference. Now measure again but from a point as far down and forward on the door as you can. The difference between left and right will be less.

    Ideally youre wanting your left and right speakers to be the same distance away from you. This gives you the best and most true stereo effect. This is almost impossible in a car since youre sitting off to one side - duh. So the closest you can get them the better off you are and the less time alignment youll have to use which helps a lot in fixing pathlength issues but not all of them as pathlengths dont just affect the timing of the sound but also the intensity/volume. Time alignment from a processor affects the time but not the volume.
    ;) difference between mids at stock location, (up high and way forward on the door panel) = 17", difference between them if they were as far forward but at the bottom of the doors = 13" :)

    If the time alignment is taking care of the path length timing, would you recommend turning down the gain on my near side mid as a possible patchwork solution?

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    You have to take the deck out of the harness in order to see the switch. It's a little black switch on the side of the deck chassis about half way back.
    aaah.......now I feel like an idiot. :o Will be taking the unit tmrw to change the lens. Will check for this when he pulls the unit out. If its there I would activate it, I would leave the mid hpf at 63hz, set the mid lpf to 3.5khz, set the tweets hpf at 4khz and then bypass the passive xover, in this sequence. Correct?

    Sounds like you have some issues though. I would recommend a Pioneer 800 or Alpine with like abilities.
    Sure do have a problem. Whatever the problem is, it seems to be exacerbated by heat and the cars movement. We're in the middle of summers here with daytime temps around 115-120F. With the windows rolled up and the car parked in the open. I'm sure it gets to 130 inside the car. If I drive around in the afternoons, its getting to the point where I cant use the cd player at all. However tonight, I played the unit for about 2 hours w/o a problem, the eject function worked and no stoppages. Then the same problems started showing up.

    Anyway for now I'm going to go for a $40 lens change (is there any way of knowing if the replacement lens is genuine?) and hope for the best. The unit is a real tight fit in the dash slot. You need to really push the unit to get it in. Would the extreme heat cause the plastic dash to expand and thereby squeeze the chasiss even more? Hence problems while ejecting the cd?

    I'm prob just clutching at straws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    aaah.......now I feel like an idiot. :o Will be taking the unit tmrw to change the lens. Will check for this when he pulls the unit out. If its there I would activate it, I would leave the mid hpf at 63hz, set the mid lpf to 3.5khz, set the tweets hpf at 4khz and then bypass the passive xover, in this sequence. Correct?
    Yes, do not use the xover. Remember to turn the gain down on your tweeters and start at lower volumes.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

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    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    If the time alignment is taking care of the path length timing, would you recommend turning down the gain on my near side mid as a possible patchwork solution?
    No. The lower end frequencies will be stronger on the left than the right because its closer BUT the higher the frequency, the more directional it becomes and the more intense it becomes as it becomes more on axis. So while 200 Hz is stronger on the left side because its closer - 3 KHz may be stronger on the right side because its much more on axis where the left speaker is a full 90 degrees off axis.

    In my car, the lower stuff is stronger on the left but 500-800 are about even between doors then the right side starts getting stronger from 1000 on up and really gets stronger in the 3.2KHz and up range.

    So what Im getting at (finally) is that unless you have an independent left/right EQ to fix these issues, youre better off just leaving the gains as is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacLeod View Post
    No. The lower end frequencies will be stronger on the left than the right because its closer BUT the higher the frequency, the more directional it becomes and the more intense it becomes as it becomes more on axis. So while 200 Hz is stronger on the left side because its closer - 3 KHz may be stronger on the right side because its much more on axis where the left speaker is a full 90 degrees off axis.

    In my car, the lower stuff is stronger on the left but 500-800 are about even between doors then the right side starts getting stronger from 1000 on up and really gets stronger in the 3.2KHz and up range.

    So what Im getting at (finally) is that unless you have an independent left/right EQ to fix these issues, youre better off just leaving the gains as is.
    1. I sit on the right side hence rigt mid is closer.

    2. I can tune 16 frequencies for left / right. 20hz, 31.5, 50, 80, 125, 200, 315, 500, 800, 1.25khz, 2, 3.15, 5, 8, 12.5 & 20khz.

    3. Eg 3khz for me is stronger from the left tweet as that is on axis and the right (near side) tweet is off axis. hence my setting for 3.15 is -4 for left and -2 for right. 200hz is set at -4/-2, 500&800 are -5/-5 and -2/-2. 1.25kz is -2 left and -4right......so its pretty much in line with what you say.

    4. Mac can you pls validate the following: The far side mid is on axis but plays softer by 3db becoz its further. Hence lets take 500 hz lets assume the reading for this frequency is 85db for l&r, when measured in the left seat. If the same frequency was measured in the right seat would the reading be 82db for left and 88db for right? Or does seat position have no impact on the sound level...........

    tks

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    Arun, remember that car audio is a different beast and what works for one person or another might not work for you. Different cars, speakers, speaker locations, install, seat material, center consoles, personal preference and more all determine the final outcome.

    So we can say this is how something is or usually is and it may be that way but you need to follow what you hear.
    HU: 880PRS
    Front: SR6500
    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

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    You do have the capability to go active, I think.
    You have to take the deck out of the harness in order to see the switch. It's a little black switch on the side of the deck chassis about half way back.
    I Owe you big time Dan .......I'm serious. God I feel like such a dork :o Yes I can go active.

    Got the lens changed and flipped the switch from std to nw. I could'nt get the passive xovers disconnected today will do that tmrw. Have set the xovers from hu as follows:

    sub lpf at 50 hz at a 36db slope (yes I can go all the way to 36 in std mode its only 18db)

    Mid hpf at 63hz @ 24 db slope
    Mid lpf at 3.15khz @ 18 db slope

    Tweet hpf at 4khz @ 18db slope.

    Thats the good bit. Now to the problem..............the mids are not playing. The HU for some reason is only seeing the tweets and the sub. So while I can fade left and right I cant fade front / back. But I can set the xover for all three ie tweets mids and sub

    In the std mode there were 4 positions for TA - FL / FR / Front / front and back. Now I only have FR & FL. Funnily I can set the TA for all three ie tweets, mids, sub. However only the tweets and sub are playing........

    In one of your posts you had mentioned that the mids should be connected to the front ch's of the amp and the tweets to the rear. My setup is the opposite........could that be a reason?

    HELP!!!!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by arun1963 View Post
    In the std mode there were 4 positions for TA - FL / FR / Front / front and back. Now I only have FR & FL. Funnily I can set the TA for all three ie tweets, mids, sub.
    Play around with the sub LPF and Mid HPF to find the best sound.

    Check your RCA's from the Hu, Rear = Mids & Fronts= tweets I believe. The tweeters have to be set to amp channels 1/2 or 3/4 and then connect the mids to the other. Just make sure you turn the gain down for the tweeter and don't crank it up until you are 100% positive you have everything set correctly

    Do you have a manual for this? If so, read through the entire network mode section.

    One thing it won't tell you and it will allow you to adjust each speaker separately instead of just FR & FL. Go to the audio adjustment screens and scroll through until you see "NW 2" or "NW 3" on the upper part of the screen. Push in on the directional button on the remote or Hu in until it allows you to adjust everything separately. Never go back to the other option because settings don't carry over to the other.

    So if you are adjusting everything separately and then you push the directional button in to go back to adjusting L & R it will not use individual speaker adjustments but adjustments to the entire L & R side. Hope this isn't confusing.

    If you didn't reset your deck you must do so. Otherwise Network Mode won't work correctly
    HU: 880PRS
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    Amp: Alpine MRV-F545
    Sub: SR124-DVC
    Amp: Alpine MRD-M1005

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