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  1. #1

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    Default Hagerman Phono Preamp Build Pt. 1

    Probably the thing I enjoy most about this Forum is the friends that I have made over the years here. I have had the opportunity to meet and spend time with so many fine folks at Polkfests and my travels around the country. The story of how I came into owning a Hagerman Phono preamp involves two of my Forum friends Larry (analog97) and Rich (Scompracer). I have had the opportunity to visit their homes and hear their fine audio systems, good music, food, small talk and learning new things. I met Larry through another friend and Forum member DiPole Dan. Larry is a vinyl nut with a minty pair of 1.2TL's. He introduced me to his beautiful sound which included a Hagerman Phono preamp that he built himself. This tube powered beauty is sold in a half kit form. Mr. Jim Hagerman is an accomplished audio component designer and will sell you a high quality PCB, parts list and instructions. The builder can choose to buy piece parts from Digikey or any supplier. Some builders have become accomplished tweakers of Hagerman's products and share their experiences on the Hagerman Forum at Audiocircle.

    I began listening to vinyl back in the 60's and pretty much gave it up in the late 90's for CD's. I've warmed up to vinyl and began to slowly get back into it over the last three years. Low end stuff, used turntables, LP's from garage sales, etc. After hearing Larry's Hagerman phono preamp I had to own one!!! The smooth presentation, deep and detailed soundstage just knocked me out! I had wanted to build the preamp myself, but my my job promotion has just consumed my time during the last year. I have been putting in 12+ hour days, traveling domestically and overseas. Enter Scompracer. Rich and I communicate frequently and I had been heralding my love for the Hagerman phono preamp, but angusihing that I just didn't have time to build it. Rich says "Carl, I'd be happy to build it for you". After about two months of procrastination, I took the leap and started buying parts and shipping them to Rich.

    (end Pt. 1)
    Carl

  2. #2
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    Hi carl!
    SRT For Life; SDA Forever!

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    Four main satellite speakers, six powered subs, two dedicated for LFE channel, two center speakers for over/under screen placement and three Control Centers. Amaze your friends, terrorize your neighbors, seize the audio bragging rights for your state. Go ahead, buy it; you only go around once.

  3. #3

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    Default Hagerman Phono Preamp Build Pt. 2

    What happened next was just wonderful. Rich started to build the unit and was sending me pictures to update me on the progress. I can't begin to describe Rich's natural gift or talent to work with his hands. He built the Hagerman Cornet 2 so meticulously, it looks like it was built by a master craftsman. Every piece part was mounted perfectly, resistor voltages were matched to 0.01 ohm for each opposing side of the tubes, capacitors were mounted with the labeling facing up, equal height, spacing and soft bend radii on all the board components. He drilled the case for tubes and transformer holes and mounting locations, switches and lights. He used surgical gloves while handling and building everything including the case. The result was a masterpiece. Enough rambling, how about a few pic's?:D













    Carl

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    Default Hagerman Phono Preamp Build Pt. 3

    So, how does it sound?

    Absolutely fabulous! I'm still burning in the unit but it has surpassed all of my expectations. I've been spinning tunes I haven't listened to in years and I am just in awe of the sound of this unit. How much did I spend? Less than $600 on parts. How does it compare with other factory build name brand audiophile units? I leave that question alone. Read all about the audio DIY'ers experience and comparisons on the Hagerman Forum.

    Many thanks to Jim Hagerman, James Howard (tubesforever), Larry and especially Rich. I owe you guys big time!

    For a complete photo essay of the Hagerman Cornet 2 build by Scompracer, look Here

    Back to listening!

    Carl

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    Quote Originally Posted by ESavinon View Post
    Hi carl!
    Hi Ed!
    Carl

  6. #6
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    Rich is a master! We are fortunate to have him!
    SRT For Life; SDA Forever!

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    Four main satellite speakers, six powered subs, two dedicated for LFE channel, two center speakers for over/under screen placement and three Control Centers. Amaze your friends, terrorize your neighbors, seize the audio bragging rights for your state. Go ahead, buy it; you only go around once.

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    Sweet! That's awesome and looks great. Nice Job on the build Scompracer!!

    I just got my first TT and have just been looking at some CP threads on Phono Preamps. I saw Hagerman Phono Preamps mentioned quite a few times so I checked out the site. I am intrigued and am considering building one myself, although I might start with the Bugle kit (until I'm sure I want to invest more in the Vinyl way).
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    Very nice indeed!
    I am going to do some tube DIY soon. I'll tell you right up front it will not be as pretty as that!
    Congrats.
    Ben

    Edit: BTW where did you get the case?
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben

  9. #9

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    Thank you for the kind words folks! Carl, it was my pleasure. I’ve had several phono stages and the Hagerman Coronet 2 far exceeds its price point. If I wasn’t so enamored with my present phono stage and sub mV cartridge, I’d have one of these. Don’t know how I missed Hagerman along the way. It is my favorite, a low distortion Class A tube design. Gain is 44dB. The instructions are great, and if needed there is plenty of help available on the Hagerman forum at Audio Circle. Larry was a big help with tips as he has a couple of Hagerman builds to his credit. The total parts for this build configuration (less shipping) was ~$567.

    Carl went with the Auricap upgrade, while others have used a more exotic and expensive blend of components. While it is debatable, we followed the Auricap’s install recommendations. Per Audience, the Black and Red wires are not voltage polarity, “but is a consideration of minimum noise pickup.” Black is signal in IIRC.

    Some other upgrades/changes Carl went with are Vampire RCA jacks, a Furutech gold plated IEC plug and a front, top panel mounted power switch. He also upgraded the transformer, but I can't recall the brand. The original build has a rear mounted switch contained in the IEC connector, and a pair of board mounted double RCA jacks. The extended power switch wires were wrapped with copper foil and mounted above the board so they wouldn’t add any noise to the circuit.

    Ben, the case is made by Lansing Enclosures.

    B2H12-V01A in Clear, B2H12-V01B in Black. They sell extra panels in the event you mess one up or modify your build. Cost for the Black case was $119, IIRC.

    EDIT: That little switch on the front panel is stereo/mono.
    Last edited by SCompRacer; 09-10-2009 at 02:16 AM.
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    Thanks Carl. I do like the replaceable pannels... Just in case.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben

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    Wow,,just wow,,not only Rich's build quality,but a great writeup,and a very touching story.For the life of me,I cannnot think of anyone more deserving.Rich,, what a gift you have,,Carl,, I'll be in Pittsburgh next year for Thanksgiving.:)You guys are "top shelf"--congrats to both of you.:)
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

  12. #12

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    Default Coronet phono preamp

    Hagerman kits are very nice. I started with the Bugle many years ago and have built the Piccolo mc step up amp also. I use a denon low output mc and the Piccalo works very well. I want to build a Coronet someday soon. The Bugle is better than any built-in phono section I have compared. That was very nice of Rich to build a Coronet for you. It helps to have built one already as many of the layout questions or doubts have been overcome. From all I have read you will be very happy with the sound and will have to spend many times more to better the Coronet. With tube rolling and cap swaps you can make the Coronet any way you want. Jim Hagerman is very helpful with any questions and makes great gear if you dont want to diy it yourself. The forum at Hagerman is tops also like this forum. Have fun spinning the licorice pizza.

  13. #13

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    Err,, Rich,, whatcha' doin this winter,,eh :)

    Just my .02,,but Rich has set the bar up a notch or so,,look at that build quality.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)

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    Great job Rich. It shows you put a lot of love in building that piece.

    Congrats on the new pre Carl. (Just be prepared....who knows what Rich will ask for in return....:D)
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  15. #15

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    Nice write up, enjoy!
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Nice work Rich......I saw the "in progress" photo's a few weeks ago as Rich has been keeping the RAS updated on the build. A true work of art and no small feat.

    Enjoy Carl, hope to spend some time with you when you finally head out this way!

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

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  17. #17

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    Thanks again for the kind words. Carl is a good friend and ichiban (#1), most deserving of top notch effort!

    After I lit the Coronet 2 up on the bench and it passed some initial voltage/scope tests without smoke or flames, I inserted it in my basement retro system. Even with no hours on it, the C2 sounded mucho better than my Yamaha integrated phono stage. So I call Carl all excited that it plays and say listen to this, pointing the phone at the 7A’s. A few seconds later, pops and crackles start up. Uh, Carl, let me call you back…LOL Turns out the 12AU7 was puking out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ricardo View Post

    (Just be prepared....who knows what Rich will ask for in return....:D)
    Ricardo, a trip to the basement?:D Carl had sent me an old school hand written note of appreciation via snail mail with some unexpected compensation enclosed. Thanks very much Carl! If anything, I owe him now and can’t wait for his visit.

    George, what you got in mind? Other than catching up on movies, I do have this supposed belt drive killer Lenco idler wheel turntable plinth to finish building. I am trying to keep the momentum up after the C2 build. (Very hard, near impossible.:D).

    Yes, the RAS got updates a day or two after Carl saw them. Them guys keep track of what is goin on!
    Last edited by SCompRacer; 09-11-2009 at 03:08 PM.
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    Those of you who haven't been fortunate enough to meet Rich in person are really missing out. Not only does he know his stuff, he's always willing to lend a hand. He's made this hobby much more enjoyable for me.

    Now I just have to resist handing him a check and schematics for all the things I'd like him to build for me! ;)
    [ My Rigs ] Balanced Audio Technology | Revel | Dodd | Monarchy | PS Audio | MIT | Polk | Etc.

  19. #19
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    Hello,
    Very nice work! Great attention to detail, beautiful craftsmanship! I enjoyed reading the complete thread, thanks for posting it.
    Enjoy, Ken

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    Nice! Very professional looking DIY effort.Your chassis choice suites the project perfectly.

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    Excellent work Rich. Thanks for posting this Carl.
    "Polk SDA-SRSs are hopelessly out of date both sonically and technologically... I see no value whatsoever in older SDA speakers."~Audio Asylum Member
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    Carl,

    I am happy to have turned you on to something pretty special IMHO. My Cornet2 and Clarinet tube pre-amp are capable of getting some things right and producing some great sound. Having heard your Cornet2 last nite, I know you have really turbocharged your vinyl playback. Wow, Famous Blue Raincoat on 45 rpm was just off the charts!!! Kudos to you and my hat is definitely tipped to Rich for such a fastidious build. Larry

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    Well I have had the Cornet 2 in my rig now for about two weeks. I have been burning it in periodically with Hagerman's "FryKleen" and the inverse RIAA filter. Last night Analog97 came over my house and wanted to hear my new arrival. Analog had loaned by the Hagerman "Piccolo" as my TT is using a Denon DL-160 which has a 1.6 mV output. My preamp is a Parasound C2 HT controller and my gain was turned up very high to give me the performance I wanted. I thought the Piccolo would give it some gain that the unit seemed to lack. The Piccolo has adjustable gain and loading (ohms). So we set it to 47K loading and 10 dB gain then gave it a spin. The vinyl rig sounded really good. However, my Both Analog and I were a little mystifed by the low gain. Even at the 20 dB level it did not give me the performance that I would have expected. We changed the loading from 47K to 1K then BANG!!! At the 10 dB gain setting and 1K loading the whole system came alive. Lots of gain at a reasonable preamp setting, low noise floor and stunning soundstage. Both of our jaws hit the floor with the dramatic improvement with the loading change on the Piccolo. We spend the rest of the night in vinyl bliss. The Cornet 2 with the Piccolo worked extremely well with the Denon DL-160. I'm doing an endzone dance!!!
    Last edited by schwarcw; 09-12-2009 at 10:42 PM.
    Carl

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    Quote Originally Posted by george daniel View Post
    Wow,,just wow,,not only Rich's build quality,but a great writeup,and a very touching story.For the life of me,I cannnot think of anyone more deserving.Rich,, what a gift you have,,Carl,, I'll be in Pittsburgh next year for Thanksgiving.:)You guys are "top shelf"--congrats to both of you.:)
    George, I hope that you can stop over next Thanksgiving for a visit and to hear some tunes! You are welcome anytime in my house.

    Quote Originally Posted by heiney9 View Post
    Nice work Rich......I saw the "in progress" photo's a few weeks ago as Rich has been keeping the RAS updated on the build. A true work of art and no small feat.

    Enjoy Carl, hope to spend some time with you when you finally head out this way!


    H9
    Brock, I am hoping to get into Chi-town next month on my way to Seattle. Plans are still tentative.

    Quote Originally Posted by blakeh View Post
    Those of you who haven't been fortunate enough to meet Rich in person are really missing out. Not only does he know his stuff, he's always willing to lend a hand. He's made this hobby much more enjoyable for me.
    ;)
    You got that right! Rich is first class all the way!
    Carl

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    So do you need the Piccolo along with the Cornet2? Or can you tune the Cornet2 to achieve the same result?
    Keep in mind, I have no idea what the loading and gain mean with respect to TT Cartridges.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mmadden28 View Post
    So do you need the Piccolo along with the Cornet2? Or can you tune the Cornet2 to achieve the same result?
    Keep in mind, I have no idea what the loading and gain mean with respect to TT Cartridges.
    The Denon cartridge is a high output moving coil (1.6 mV), it should have a phono preamp gain of about 56 to get an input level that would be similiar to say your CD player. The Cornet has a gain of 44 dB, the Piccolo has settings of 12, 20 and 36 dB. The Piccolo is inserted between the turntable and the Cornet 2 to provide a higher output level, which would be similiar to the moving magnet cartridge.

    A moving magnet cartridge has a much higher output, typically 2.5 mV to 6.0 mV. I would not need a Piccolo for this higher output cartridge.

    I hope this helps! Thanks for the nice remarks in your earlier post.
    Carl

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    Quote Originally Posted by schwarcw View Post
    The Denon cartridge is a high output moving coil (1.6 mV), it should have a phono preamp gain of about 56 to get an input level that would be similiar to say your CD player. The Cornet has a gain of 44 dB, the Piccolo has settings of 12, 20 and 36 dB. The Piccolo is inserted between the turntable and the Cornet 2 to provide a higher output level, which would be similiar to the moving magnet cartridge.

    A moving magnet cartridge has a much higher output, typically 2.5 mV to 6.0 mV. I would not need a Piccolo for this higher output cartridge.

    I hope this helps! Thanks for the nice remarks in your earlier post.
    Ahh, I think I got it, it all depends on the cartridge your using. Hmm, good to keep in mind when I decide to buy or build one.
    Thanks Carl.

    -Michael
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    Amazing work Rich!

    Happy listening Carl!

    I am still waiting for the right time and opportunity to buy a phono preamp (preferably tube stage). So, if you run into one for sale, please do let me know. TIA
    I am sorry, I have no opinion on the matter. I am sure you do. So, don't mind me, I just want to talk audio and pie.

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    Thanks very much for the compliments! Carl is very pleased with it so that makes it all worthwhile!

    Michael, myself, Larry and I believe Carl are in agreement that a 2.5mV output cartridge is the minimum that should be used with a 40-44dB gain MM phono stage. Too low of an input can result in thin sound that cranking up the volume on the pre amp won't restore.

    Carl, I always experiment with loading no matter what the cartridge specs say. Good job! In your last email you mentioned that the Piccolo can be added to the Coronet 2 build. That would make it a truly versatile, one stop shopping phono stage.
    Make yourself necessary to someone. Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    That is true craftsmanship in action!
    madmax
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    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D

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